Jlall

I *think* it was KJ9x xxxx Tx Axx in dummy. LHO underled the heart ace vs 2N. My partner did not underlead the HA vs 2D and AQ of spades were off.

Good post, agree totally.

2C, clubs or bal GF. If I don't have that agreement but am playing with an expert I will assume it. If I don't have that agreement and am playing with a non expert or old fashioned person I would bid 2D (and hate it).

With Barnet Shenkin I played that there was a step to show a slam suitable hand with no fit in this auction and also in transfer then 4m auctions ie: 2N 3D 3H 4D same problem exists when you have a great hand for slam and no fit. So in your auction 4H is a good hand for slam with no fit, 4S good hand for slam with a fit (reversing these seems better, but we just played the first available step showed this).

No problem, thanks for apology.

Just curious, am I way off in thinking that generally the first suit bid below game after a fit is found in this manner is naturalish is a normal treatment? I am thinking also of an auction like 2C 2D 2S 3S As far as I can tell, it is very normal among the leading players in our part of the world. FWIW I am a strong believer - there is even a (hardly necessary) statement to this effect in my system notes. Not sure about the rest of the world, but I suspect this treatment is not mentioned in (for example) the chapter on cuebidding in "5 Weeks to Winning Bridge". Fred Gitelman Bridge Base Inc. www.bridgebase.com heh ok, thanks. I guess if you are 100 % sure your partner will cuebid an ace/king over 3S no matter what, then you should pass 4H (I guess this is obvious). However I would contend that since the five level is safe like 95 % of the time, and partner is so unlikely to have no ace or king for their limit raise when we have this powerhouse, you might as well make the game easier by asking for aces. If you are playing wtih a fellow beginner/intermediate, sometimes they'll make a mistake, or perhaps they have read somewhere the same thing I was taught and didn't think they had to cuebid an ace no matter what. There must be some chance you are on different pages, and if we think there is a 95 % chance partner has an ace or king, and there's a 95 % chance that the 5 % of the time he doesn't have an ace or king we are safe at the five level anyways it makes a lot of sense to me to just blackwood. Maybe you will get burned .25 % of the time, but there is a much greater chance partner has erred or that you are on a different page in the bidding than that.

Good problem, JLall! All that expert analysis makes it possible to appreciate the likely necessity for an immediate ♣ lead. But would a low heart from partner have conveyed an even clearer message? :) dunno, we play udca anyways so a low heart would encourage, but not sure why a low heart would be better than the queen in general.

Just curious, am I way off in thinking that generally the first suit bid below game after a fit is found in this manner is naturalish is a normal treatment? I am thinking also of an auction like 2C 2D 2S 3S

I think Justin meant to say "superfluous" and unfortunately picked "fatuous". I wouldnt put any money on it. Jillybean, do you think you ARE a bid? Did I ever say "jillybean is a stupid person?" I didn't even say "someone who bids 3S is stupid." I DIDN'T EVEN SAY SOMEONE WHO BIDS 3S IS MAKING A STUPID BID (WHICH WOULD BE A FINE THING TO SAY). I said that since I am bidding 4N over the signoff, my previous 3S bid was stupid. You can take this to mean whatever you want. But it is astounding that over and over and over on the forums you feel like you are entitled to make snide little attacks on me like this one while maintaining your holier than thou, I'm so offended by everything attitude. I would offer you a bet. If we made a poll on who is being more offensive and my post was posted, and your post (quoted) was posted, yours would overwhelmingly be considered more offensive. If nothing else, your motive is to try and denegrate my character, when mine obviously had no malicious intent at all. I am shocked that you of all people are taking this attitude when all I have ever done in the past is help you and give thought out answers to every one of your threads. I am really amazed right now. No doubt I frequently make offensive posts, and personally attack people, so maybe this is just a case of getting called out for past crimes which I was never called out on, but I do not understand where you are coming from at all right now if you are serious about this thread. Maybe there is some underlying issue you have with me. Good luck.

I think Justin meant to say "superfluous" and unfortunately picked "fatuous". He's a pro bridge player not a pro writer so I'd give him benefit of the doubt here. Although I do think he's crossed the line on previous occasions in other threads. By giving me the benefit of the doubt you mean assuming I said the wrong word? Interesting. I didn't think you had to be a pro writer to write things on the forums! Fatuous as far as I know means silly, or perhaps a form of foolish: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fatuous As usual jillybean is being hypersensitive. It has always been the case on this forum that it is FINE to attack a bid or the merits of a bid, and NOT FINE to attack a person. As you have noted, I have indeed broken this rule and attacked a person before (though I doubt I have ever done that on the beginner/intermediate forums). In this case, I said SINCE I WOULD BID 4N NOW, the 3S bid was fatuous/silly/"inanely foolish." Obviously this is because if I'm going to bid 4N over the weakest possible bid by partner, I probably should have done it to begin with. If you want to bid 3S then pass 4H, I made no judgement about your 3S bid, I just implied that I think this is poorly judged (based on the fact that I wanted to bid keycard over the signoff). I think it is clear to any non hyper sensitive person that my point was: If you are going to bid 4N after the bidding goes 3S-4H you should not have bid 3S! THAT IS A SILLY WAY TO BID THE HAND IN MY OPINION! If someone like jillybean instead of thanking me for my honest advice which I have never failed to give her, or any post on the beginner/intermediate forum in order to try to HELP her chooses to be hypersensitive and take my post as an attack on her, that is her problem. I honestly do not know why I even bother. I am frankly amazed that anyone who seems to have basic reading comprehension skills could be REMOTELY offended by my post.

I thought 1 of the south american teams would make it to the quarter finals, didn't know who to pick between argentina and chile and brazil... really rooting for chile though!

Bermuda Bowl: Quarter Finals: Usa 1, Brazil, Bulgaria, China Semi Finals: Netherlands, Norway Finals: Italy Winners: USA 2 Venice Cup: Quarter Finals: Germany, USA 2, Denmark, Italy Semi Finals: USA 1, Sweden Finals: France Winners: China Seniors: Quarter Finals: England, Italy, Sweden, Japan Semi Finals: Indonesia, USA 2 Finals: USA 1 Winners: Poland

Lol, Norway in the semifinals? I will bet that you have no chance at that wine in that case! edit: Ok maybe that was unfair to norway, but no helgemo helness and no aa molberg is very sad :( Brogeland is the best player ever though so who knows! Even without HH and Aa-Molberg we have a team I think will advance to the KO stage. If so, we might beat any team, but just as easily lose to any team advancing from the RR. Agree that the Netherlands, Italy and USA2 (in that order) seems like the best teams though. Yes you are right. To be honest I looked at all the rosters after my post to Gerben and I think Norway is the 4th best team lol. So I guess I should LOL myself for being rude to Gerben about putting them in the semis. Oh and as I said, Brogeland is the best player ever. I stand by that :)

How can you be happy just bidding 3D with such a powerhouse, especially when it now looks like partner has a stiff spade and RHO has a weak hand with 3 spades?

I accept 1N so I can cuebid 2S. Just saw that RHO does not correct to 2N if we dont accept so we can bar LHO... That's sad. If I knew that was gonna happen I would reject and bid 3S because barring LHO is pretty clutch. I needed a wire :)

yes, very easy 3H. 4 is too much with this.

Doesn't this show a spade stop? They bid two suits. Just making up some theory: We are over the spade bidder so we need a spade stopper to bid 2NT. Without a spade stopper but with a non-positional heart stopper, we can bid 2♠. Apparently Ken Rexford can bid 2♠ with this hand as well :) I have another theory. 2♠ is the only cuebid below 3♣, which could be our last making spot. So 2♠ shows nothing except extra strength. Partner can make a cuebid at the 3-level over that if he has one suit stopped and is worried about the other. Right, meant to add this, obviously since 2S lets you stop in a safe partial and 3H drives you past 3C they cannot be thought of as equal cuebids.

I drove to 4C. This seemed right at the time because I was placing partner with 4-6 given my QJT of clubs. I personally can't think of that many hands at all with 4-5 that I would overcall 2C when my clubs are at best AK9xx. Anyways, as cherdano said partner is very unlikely to have a min 4-6 since the opps quit bidding! Missed this at the table. Oh well. Partner had Qx Kxxx xx AK9xx. 3C was the limit.

I was partner, I thought I made a thoughtful pitch with KJxxx Qxxx --- Q98x. Note I cannot afford a club pitch as partner might have KTxx of clubs. If I had AQJ of spades I would definitely pitch an encouraging spade, so I thought a club was indicated.

I thought 2146 was more likely than 1246 because with the latter LHO would try to get to 3N. A spade void is possible, but with 0346 LHO would also try to get to 3N. Anyways, I didn't love my chances to beat it (because LHO could have some bad 56 as someone said, or 74 or whatever), but I thought they were significantly better on a spade lead. Even though I thought they'd usually make I think X is right, especially since some percentage of the time your teammates don't bid slam. As usual I run good and we cashed 2 spades and got an uppercut. It makes on a heart lead.

I bid 3C which I think is a pretty hopeless bid. 2S is much better. Partner had Qxx KQxx KTxx Tx and 3N makes.

My dad had this hand and passed 2N and went +120. The other table opened 1D and got to play 2D which is down 1.

I bid 2S and X. Didn't matter what you did on the second one. On the first one I missed 500 or 800 by not doubling to get to a no play 3N, but partner wrapped it. At the other table they doubled, but LHO bid 3H! Now the other guy couldn't make a responsive double, so he bid 3N and went down 3.

I doubled. Most people I gave this hand to overcalled 5C, but if they didn't they bid 2C, 4C, X. I think you are a strong favorite to beat this on a heart lead, RHO made a NF 3S bid, and LHO didn't try for slam. You might well beat them 2 or something. On this day you get lucky and beat them 3, partner having a stiff club and clubs 2-2.

I'm not sure the conclusion follows from the premise. The Spingold attracts a lot of top international players. They are generally being paid to be there by clients. It doesn't seem too far a stretch to suggest that if there were top amateur teams around outside the US, they are less likely to be there is no-one is paying for them. I think also that there is a huge difference between countries. The US has by far the biggest pro bridge population. It might well be the case that all the top players are professional. Huh? That was my point. If you are a top player you will very likely get a client, and unless you are very wealthy you are not going to turn that down. If you are an amateur who is not getting paid, you are probably not a top player (or you are independently wealthy). I find it funny that people seem to think the good foreign players are UNDER seeded also. If you are a foreign player who gets hired to play here you are generally given more seeding points than you are worth, just based on ZOMG HE IS A TOP FOREIGN GUY. You then have time to put up results, and your points will decay if you don't. Drijver and Brink don't have that many seeding points because they have put up no results at all at ACBL nationals in the few years they've been playing. They definitely started with more seeding points than they have now. I am not saying this to say anything bad about them, they are a great pair, just saying this because someone mentioned them as an outlier. In general your seeding will be more accurate after you have played for a few years here than whatever you get when you first come over (you will be overseeded). Anyways to be clear my point about the top teams all having clients was to say that top players will inevitably get hired. There will never just be 4 dudes who are really good, good enough to win the spingold, who are going to play amateur and win. Obviously if 4 truly top players made a team and had no client they would have a big advantage. The point is this will not happen.