benlessard

I also made a mistake saying symm werent highly efficient. Both ways are efficient and the difference are minimal. Question regarding symm when you are using the reverser (there is no 55 right) its only high shortage and low shortage (in a direct way?) if so where is the 5611 ?

Agree this was just an example to show a 2 suiter after or without the reverser. There is of course no practical need to exit a 7402 at 3H. The word slightly is adequate, however showing the common shape earlier isnt that much important compared to showing some critical shapes earlier. If you prefer to go by odds tables the 6421 is before the 5530 and before the 5440 but a 6421 suggest 2 trumps suit while a 5530/5440 suggest 3 trumps suit, a case can be said for showing tough 3suiters shapes before common ones. Anyway the fact that you can put the shapes everyway you want is a nice feature of my method. Remembering A=+1,B=+2,C=+3,D=1,E=4,F=9,G=14 H=19 is easy. The table isnt that hard if you already know your odds tables. For example i can easily do a chart without the reverser 1C---1H (pos with S) 1S?---2C(diamonds could be 4S+longer diamonds) 2D ?---- Now 2H is A and 2S is B but there is no reverser. Put purely in odds frequency and without 3-suiter. First column is my method 2nd is symmetric relay(reverser needed with longer D) S+D 2 suiter/no 3 suiters ♠♦♥♣ 5422=D........3C.......3C 4522=AD......3C.....3D reverser followed by +3 5431=BD......3C.....3D directly= low shortness 4531=E........3D......3D reverse+directly 5413=AE......3D......3D high short follwed by step1 4513=BE......3D......3D reverse +high short +step1 5521=CE......3D......3H 5512=ACE....3D......3D or 3H im not sure 6421=F........3H.......3H 4621=AF......3H.......3H 6412=BF......3H.......3H 4612=CF......3H.......3H 5530=ACF....3H....... 5503=G........3S....... 6430=AG......3S....... 4630=BG......3S....... 6403=CG......3S....... 4603=ACG....3S..... 6511=H......3nt......... 5611=AH......3nt....... 6520=BH......3nt....... 5620=CH......3nt....... 6502=ACH......3nt....... 5602=I......4C....... My practice isnt that good with Symm relay so im sure ive made some mistakes. Please double check and finish the chart if you please thanks in advance.

Ive thought for a while and i dont know why i bid a lazy(lame?) 4H, the dummy came down exactly like ive visualize it. Partner hand was x Kxxx Qxx KJTxx Had i bid 4D, would you signoff in 4H holding partner hand ?

Pass 5CX can turn out to be expensive. If we believe the 2D is based on a 6 carder and that partner doesnt have 5C. Partner shapes is probably 4423 or (43)24, with a 4414 partner would probably find a X or bid 5C playing me for the stiff spades.

Im not fond of relaying balanced hand so this was purely an example. that why ive started as 2D. In symmetric relay the hands that are showned 0,0,2,3,3,3,3 in my method its 0,0,0,3,5,5,5 if there is an ensemble of less then 13 hands my method isnt optimal with more then 13 my method take the upper hands. 5431 & 5413 is also at D (D,ABD & BCD) Under E or at E i have showned 8 hand wich is the same of sym relay. (D,ABD & BCD) + E,AE,BE+CE+ACE At F ive showned 13 hand, all the previous+F,AF,BF,CF,ACF At G ive showned 18 hands wich is 4 more then symm relay. Also the frequency is where my method gain because my hand are in frequency order wich is not always the case in symm relay. Unless im wrong the 5512 exit at 2S while the 5431 are at 2nt. a recap to show you where i exit the hands if my first possible bid is 2D (A=2D) 2Nt= 5422+5431+5413 3C= 5440+5521+5512+5530+5503 3D= 6421+6412+6430+6403+6511 3H=6520+6502+7411+7420+7402 Do the same with symm relay and you will see.

Easy to memorize ok but extremely efficient no. In term of effiency there is no comparaison between symmetric relay and what ive post. Pick 8 random hand (without or after the reverser) and you will see . As for the 5440 ive put an * because sometimes there is none and sometimes there should be 2 of them. For simplicty we always carry 1 and only 1(the void is 1 under the 4 card suit) 5S+4H = only 5404 is possible. 5S+4D = only 5440 is possible 5S+4C = only 5044 is possible 5H+4S = 4504 5H+4D = 4540 5H+4C = 0544 As for the 4441 we are responding 1D or opening 1D with them. But we could treat them like 2 suiters. Just that with a structure like mine exception are a pain.

Ive already post this 2-3 years ago on BBO forum but nobody did understand or nobody was interested. 1C ! strong----??? you have a GF balanced hand and decided that 2D to 3S is reserved for balanced hand with GF values. 1-3334 2-3343 3-3343 4-4333 5-2344 6-2434 7-2443 8-3244 9-4243 10-4234 11-3424 12-4324 13-4423 14-3442 15-4342 16-4432 17-2335 18-3235 19-3325 20-2353 21-3253 22-3352 The order you want to put it is your choice. But youll need to memorize it. Now 2D=A 2H=B 2S=C 2Nt=D 3C=E 3D=F 3H=G A=(+1) the + is very important B=(+2) the + is very important C=(+3) the + is very important D=1 (there is no+) E=4 F=9 G=14 H=19 Lets says you have 3253 wich is hand number 21. By looking at the letter we see that the way to make 21 = (+2)+19 So we start by B (+2) 1C-----2H (B or +2) 2S©----3S(H or 19) The 2S by partner is only a relay but still take the letter "C" If you have hand 13 /4432/ the way to make 13 is (+1)(+3)(+9) 1C-----2D (A == +1) 2H(B)----2S(C == +3) 2Nt(E)-----3C(F == 9) For a 2suiter its the same thing 1H------------1S (relay) 1Nt (clubs)----2D (art GF) ??? 1S-------------1Nt (relay) 2C (diamonds)--2H(art Gf) 1S-------------1Nt (relay) 2D (hearts)-----2Nt (art GF) the hands are 5422 ==1 5431 ==2 5413 ==3 5440*==4 5521 ==5 5512 ==6 5530 ==7 5503 ==8 6421 ==9 6412 ==10 6430 ==11 6403 ==12 6511 ==13 6520 ==14 6502 ==15 7411 ==16 7420 ==17 7402 ==18 6601 ==19 6610 ==20 7501 ==21 7510 ==22 You have a 6430 wich is hand number 10. partner just Gf at 2D so... 2H=A 2S=B 2Nt=C 3C=D 3D=E 3H=F 3S=G 2D (GF)------2H (A==+1) 2S (B)-------3H (F==9) Lets say you have a 7402 and are lucky enough that opps dont interfere. 7402= 18 to make 18 its (+1) (+3) and 14 so its A=C=G 2D (GF)------2H (A==+1) 2S (B)-------2Nt (C==+3) 3C (D)------ 3S (G == 14) and voila youve just showned a 7402 under 3Nt. The chart for one suiter can be something like 6322 ==1 6232 ==2 6223 ==3 6331 ==4 6313 ==5 6133 ==6 7321 ==7 7312 ==8 7231 ==9 7213 7330 7303 7033 8221 8212 8122 8311 8313 8133 80?? 8?0? 8??0 If you are not able to Gf early you can play a simpler variant. Wich is probably more practical. A=+1 B=+2 C=1 D=3 E=6 F=9 G=12 H=15 So if you you have hand number 11 its B (+2) and F(9) Partner bid X (GF) -----you bid X+2 (B) he bid X+3( relay C)------you bid X+6 (F) Feel free for any questions or comments.

Yes i meant 3C as multi inv. If the multi inv is under 2Nt then 2Nt can be used for unclear gameforce. GF. 1D---1S 2C---??? regular 4th suit GF 2H GF but need a rebid to clarify 2S to play 2Nt INV 3C INV 3D INV 3H INV for most of the players to GF with S & H its 2H followed by 3H 3S INV Inversion 2H multi inv 2S to play 2Nt GF 3C GF 3D GF 3H GF 3S GF 1st of all since you are more likely to hit a GF hand then an invitationnal hand the inv style seems better. 2nd there is only a 2 space difference between 2H GF and 2nt GF wich is a small price to pay for unclear GF hands. 3 you can invite and finish in 2S not 3S 4 Unclear invitationnal hand are much better handled by a multi inv. AJT98 Axx Jxx xx In regular its a close call between 2Nt/3D and the game in S is easily possible. By bidding a multi inv and pass or correct response. 2H----??? 2S = i refuse a S inv 2Nt = i accept a S inv but refuse a Nt INV (a normal 2nt bid) 3C = i accept a S & NT inv but refuse a C inv (a normal 3C inv bid) So if partner refuse a S inv you can try your luck in 2Nt or 3D. If partner accept a S inv you have an easy 4S bid. If opener take a lot of space its doesnt bother you because hes maximum and accept all your game try, so no need for slam bidding and signing off in game should pose no problems. The opposite isnt true when 2H is GF, the 3rd bid by opener will be all over the place denying responder the chance to established fit at a confortable level for slam/game exploration. 1D-----1S 2C-----2H (GF) here if opener rebid 2S or 2Nt or 3C all is well. But if he rebid 3D/3H/3S/3nt its a different story. The downside of multi inv will come in a later post.

With a big 2542 and the protected K of clubs why would he bid 3S ? With 5 reasonnable spades a doubleton H and maybe a diamond fit you might endup in 4S. If you bid 3S and partner raise to 4S is 4Nt keycard or natural ? It make sense to play 4nt as natural when you are limited and made a preference and partner showned no extras, but its a very rare and precise agreement. AQT42 K9 Kxxx xx xx AQJ10x AQJ9 Kx 4Nt/4H/5D are quite better contract then 4S. Can you blame partner for bidding 4S over your 3S ? Im wondering what ive would have done with a 0553 or 0643 and bad hearts. For me a 3D bid doesnt really show a 5th D, a bad 1543 and no club stopper or 2542 with good hearts or even 2641 and lousy H is a possible 3D rebid for me.

P-----(1d)-----1H------(X!) alerted as 4 or + ♠ & 6pts+ 3C FSJ-(p)---??? Jxxx AJxxxx void AQx all white Our FSJ requirement are a bit loose. KQx or xxxx is adequate support. QJTxx or AJ9xx is adequate side suit.

4C is tempting but i prefer 3Nt. 66% of my values are soft values outside partner suits, this suggest nt for me.

Its the hand of the year when i really want to play Flannery.

With Kx of clubs partner will try to bid Nt to rightside the contract if Qxx vs Kx.+ a 3S bid followed by a 4nt would be keycard. So 4Nt is natural and could be many shapes imo. Imo the real problem is that 3H isnt forcing. For me its so obvious that a GF bid is more important then a limit raise where i want to show my spades first. I rarely want to show a suit before raising unless im sure the opps wont interfere. Its one more hand where 4st inv is a lot better then 4th forcing. I agree 4th suit INV aint perfect but i prefer to have problems on invitationnal hand then on GF hands. 1H---1S 2D---??? Its so obvious that 3D/3H/3S forcing and 2H multi inv is better then the otherway around. (3D/3H/3S) inv and 2H art GF.

Im not afraid of 4Nt without a S stopper despite the fact that a S lead is likely. However i dont have a particular agreement about a possible 4C bid. 0-5-5-3 or 0643 is the more likely for me. IMO partner hand is 1642 , 2542 or 1543 and we want to protect his K of clubs. For the rest im not sure but i guess ill bid 7H.

Low club to the 8. Or D to the J.

Pass for me not close. Partner would have bid 4S with anything that breathe. With 3H he know we have a stiff or a doubleton. If he got 2H our stiff is worth only 1 trick. AKxxxx xxx, Kx,Qx is an easy 4S bid. AQxxxx xxx Kx Kx is a 4S bid. IMO The problematic hands are AQxxxx xxx x Qxx AQxxxx xxx x Kxx

3H is enough, partner could have a 4carder.

1- no, 2- You will not find a director who will allow the 2nd X to stand. Passing 3C is automatic.

2D wtp. What ive noticed in those problem is that those who are reopening without extras values are often the first to pass for penalty. ??? Please explain why you prefer to play in a 5-2/6-2 & ruffing from the long trumps VS a 5/3 & 5/4 fit & ruffing from the short hand.

4C namyats. Otherwise a direct 4H is my bid. Ill X a 4S by the opponent to show a 5H bid with some def values. In a bidding contest or in a forum ill open 1H.

What you want to discover is if the Qs are working ? of if there is wasted values facing a stiff. A simple yet efficient method is that a direct bid show a stiff and the cheapest bid is a balanced articial and ask for a shortness. 1H---2H 2S (ask for a stiff/doubleton) ------3C stiff or doubleton C This imo is only good in MP, in imps you should avoid game-tries at the 3 level like plague.

Pass,X,3D. In our method X= semi penalty 2Nt = very good 3 level overcall in unknown suit or a good 2suiter 3C= take-out nf 3D= lightish overcall. i would bid 3D.

I used to bid only 2S with those hand, playing weak nt or in MP 2S is probably ok. But in imps im sure bidding 3 is the correct bid. The club void is worth at least an A. If your partner make a game try and you dont accept its better that you dont tell anybody about this. Gross nonsense

We are discussing this and (1M)---4m as artificial 2 suiter GF. This allow to make a michael and bid again for sacrifice without showing extras values while bidding the GF directly setup FP. Curiously these hand are happening more often then the 4 level preempt. (1C)----4D (1M)----4m are auction that rarely happen for us. I think its a statistic fluke but the strong 2 suiter happen a lot more. (1M)-----P-----(2M)------4m as natural is even less frequent.

Opps bid 3S RED thinking that hes got a fair chance to make it or that hes got a fair chance of not being doubled I dont see what special extras my hand got to overrule this.