PhantomSac

??? I'm saying "I don't understand why 4N should show a doubleton spade. It seems like it should just be a slam try in diamonds." I don't understand what your most recent post means. My question is, "Why do you think 4N should show a doubleton spade as well as a slam try in diamonds, rather than just a slam try in diamonds. What relevance is the doubleton spade supposed to have?"

x Ax KJxxx xxxxx etc, a slam try with any hand type is unlikely on this auction but I would guess a stiff spade is as likely as a hand without one. Obviously a hand with 3+ spades is not possible since you would have raised spades to begin with if you had anything.

:) Unfortunately

Jeremy if you think 4N shows a good 5D bid why do you think it shows a doubleton spade also? What would you do with a good 5D bid that didn't have a doubleton spade?

oh ok

If you have that it seems clear to use it but I would rather open 6♦ than 1♣. Vs the right opps opening 7D is really hot heh.

I was partner, I had K9xxxx Axx AQxx ---, I think I would bid 5C over 4N, and would just bid 5D over 5C, so I agree wrt to 4N>5C.

Why is this an improvement?

With 12 HCP usually I'd just go with 4S since there's a decent chance to buy it in 4H. Given that I have 5 hearts though, it seems unlikely. I would definitely look left and look right here, and if my opps were little old ladies or weak I would bid 4H expecting them not to bid 4S that aggressively even with short hearts if they didn't have many HCP. If the opps were good or young (aka aggressive), I would try 5H to maximize the pressure on them.

Granted that partner doesn't have to have a huge hand, but you have one! If I had to choose between Passing and bidding 6D, I would certainly choose 6D. I might even choose 7D over Pass. Fortunately you have a few choices in between :) Fred Gitelman Bridge Base Inc. www.bridgebase.com Glad you posted this I kind of thought even 4N/5C was not enough and that 6D was the right bid... is that going overboard?

If you bid 4N please state how you mean it (some kind of slam try in diamonds, or something that implies a doubleton spade).

AQ x JT8xx xxxxx w/w imps, starting with partner: 1S (2C) p (2H) X (4H) ?

Lol what is going on?? Even if south overcalls some terrible hands, north is committing to the 3 level by bidding 2S or 3H anyways, so it doesn't really matter at all. Even if the cue has a wide range, that is much better than 3H having a wide range, since as jdonn says 2S gives you a whole level to investigate.

Yeah in standard I would double or pass

So partner never has a weak NT hand type? That is MUCHHHH better than playing standard methods. And he only has 4 clubs if he's 4414 exactly, or if he's balanced 18-19 in which case he can bid again? Seems like 3C and X are your options, 3C is a good one since partner almost always has 5 clubs if he's going to pass 3 clubs. X will work better in the unlikely event that partner can pass it with 3415/4414 hand type (but in the latter case he will almost never pass), or when 2S is a superior partial to 3C (unlikely since we have such weak spades). X works needlessly poorly whenever partner has a strong hand with 4 spades and a heart stopper and we end up in 4S instead of 3N. 3C seems like an easy choice given your methods.

I'll just say imo Xing pretty light when I was 5-4 in the majors and primed out rather than overcalling was an expensive lesson I learned. The trend especially in the 2000s was becoming to overcall so heavy which I agree with on certain hand types that I think we all got wrapped up in it and started overcalling on a hand like this (zomg only 17 points!) Even if you start with 1S and it doesn't get passed out which is a real danger because partner can pass with many 5-7 counts with 1-4/1-5 in the majors, and the opps won't save you with length in spades (despite someone saying earlier that they respond with any hand that would respond to a 1 bid with, that is a very non standard/bad style in response to an overcall), your hand is so good opposite a fit that you will struggle to catch up even if they bid. For instance, take the auction (1D) 1S (2D) p (p) X (p) 3C (p) ? I assume you will pass here, but you could easily miss a game opposite something like as xx Qxx xxx KQxxx (in fact you might have missed a slam!). Had you doubled it could go 1D X 2D 3C, and you will reach game easily, because you encouraged partner to bid a suit freely which is quite important on a flexible/primed out strong hand like this that improves greatly opposite a fit. How about an auction like 1D 1S 3D p p X p 3H p ? Surely you should bid game here (though a lot of beginner/ints would not realize that), even though partner could have 0, you make game opposite very little when partner has hearts. Well if you are driving to game opposite a heart fit, I don't see much gain in having bid 1S first. Even after 1D 1S 3D p p X p 3S you really have no idea what to do. Partner is going to pass 3D with something like 6 points and 3 spades pretty much always since your overcall range is so wide, and he needs such a good hand to bid 4S directly, his 3S lower limit must go up to keep the range from being too wide. The truth is these auctions where the opponents are going to preempt in diamonds are the BEST ones for overcalling 1S, because sometimes after doubling it will be tricky to get your fifth spade in if the opponents preempt. But they still aren't exactly great, because your strength is so understated and you need to make up for it. If partner is ever able to freely bid something after you double you're in great shape, and if the opponents do not preempt that high you're in great shape. If you have always overcalled 1S with this hand routinely I'd encourage you to try doubling next time you have a hand like this.

The fact that I led the DK should probably mean that it's a poor choice :unsure:

HBD!

Yeah I'd double, being passed out in 1S cold for 4H is a definite concern, and our playing strength is enough to X and bid 1S.

Why will partner do something over 4H? He bid 3S non forcing, there is no reason to think he will bid 4S now.

Chris, Roscoes is freaking awesome!

Why bid 1C-2D with 7-9 and 1C-2C with inv+ ? Why not 1C-2C with 7-9 and 1C-2D with inv+ ? 1C-2C lets you play 2C. Granted, the opponents are likely to balance, but it gives opener the option to defend or bid 3C. 1C-2D leaves lots of room for us and opponents while depriving us of playing 2C. Gaining an extra step when you are inv+ can be quite useful (especially if you use the step well and don't just play some stopper showing bids), and playing 2C is a narrow target that is pretty rare.

My head is exploding from amazement. How is a 10 count with 4 trumps and a worthless doubleton not a limit raise? What do you people need for a LR?

3H? Lol, I've been seeing this a lot lately, people somehow won't cuebid with a normal limit raise. This hand is a 2S bid even if the fourth trump was a club, that's how poor 3H is.

At the local bridge club I notice people never alert jacoby 2N either.