Walddk

I would appreciate if you don't put words into my mouth. Where did I say anything about death sentence? I mentioned "sanction", and yes, I will stick to that view. If you really care about what that should be, let me tell you this: They should be reprimanded, asked to make a public apology and sign a document where they promise not to do a thing like this again. If they refuse to do either of the two (apology, signature), they should be banned from being selected for a USA team in the future. Call it a warning if you like. This is far away from the death chambers as far as my interpretation is concerned. Roland

I am delighted that he did! Roland

Please tell me the crime of any woman who did not hold the sign (if there is any). Failing to boycott the ceremony? It is obvious to anyone that this was a team decision, so they all believed that it was the right thing to do. Therefore, they were all on the podium (plus a minor who is completely innocent and has nothing to do with it). Yes, I know who he is. Let me repeat so that no misunderstanding is possible. It was an absurd provocation, and they chose the wrong place for it. "Shockingly poor judgement", as fred put it. I concur. Roland

You are too naive for comfort if you think that this was the work of one person. Unless "We" is "pluralis majestatis". I don't think Debbie Rosenberg is royal. Roland I'm not saying they didn't know. For all you know any of them objected. Or just didn't care. I'm sorry, if they stood up there with a sign that says "Roland didn't vote for Bush" then should you be sanctioned? For obvious reasons I did not, and I would not have either if I had been an American citizen. Again, that is beside the point. We know what they did, not what they did not. And in case you still think that this was one woman's work, I happen to have evidence to the contrary since at least one more held on to the sign at some point! So do you now believe that it was a team decision or not? Roland

You are too naive for comfort if you think that this was the work of one person. Unless "We" is "pluralis majestatis". I don't think Debbie Rosenberg is royal. Roland

They have. Try this ... http://usbf.org/docs/corpDocs/Bylaws.pdf and look at 3 e. The last part reads: "Support only those member participants who exhibit the highest caliber of sportsmanship, personal conduct and ethics". Judge for yourself whether the women have violated that rule or not. I would be surprised if this case did not reach the Grievance and Appeals Committee. The trouble is that Gail Greenberg is on that committee, but she must surely be out of the decision taking if it comes that far. Roland

Firstly, I wrote "maybe". I did not state that they did. Secondly, if publicity is not what they wanted, why did they think it was necessary to show the sign? Publicity in my world is: I want to make it public. That was exactly what they did! Nothing offensive at all as I see it. Roland

Maybe the women achieved what they really wanted: publicity. If so, they certainly got it. In my view, winning the Venice Cup gives you just that. Your result at the bridge table speaks for itself. You don't need to add personal political statements. "We think Head&Shoulders is the best shampoo" is also a personal statement, but it doesn't have political undertones. Perhaps the management of "Wash&Go" will take offence, but hardly anyone else. :rolleyes: Roland

Something for the lawyers to interpret I suppose. Where is Mike Hargreaves when we need him? Anyway, whether they have violated any law or not it's my view, like Fred's, that the women showed "shockingly poor judgement". Roland

Well, you may argue that the championships are over before the presentation. It's a matter of interpretation. It is also a matter of interpretation regarding the Conditions of Contest: 6. Ethics And Deportment All contestants in World Bridge Championships are required to conform at all times to the highest standards of ethics and deportment.

My sources at the venue tell me that several players and officials were very unhappy with what they saw. If that is the case, the American women, in my opinion, have violated the Laws of Duplicate Bridge: Law 74 A. Proper Attitude 1. Courtesy. A player should maintain a courteous attitude at all times. 2. Etiquette of Word and Action A player should carefully avoid any remark or action that might cause annoyance or embarrassment to another player or might interfere with the enjoyment of the game.

Indeed, but a sad incident occurred during the presentation tonight. When the American ladies received their gold medals on the podium, they displayed a poster with WE DIDN'T VOTE FOR BUSH Hardly the place for a politcal statement in my opinion. I never thought that something like this would happen in bridge circles. The question is now whether the WBF/ACBL/USBF will take some kind of action. I would hardly call this a "sad incident". I don't have a problem if celebrities chose to take an active role promoting different causes. There have been times when I wished a celebrity would shut the ^*$#& up, however, that generally occurs when I (a) agree with their position and (;) think that they are being inarticulate The US women's team (apparently) felt strongly enough about this subject that they chose to display a poster. So be it... I would consider any kind of action by the WBF or the USBF completely unreasonable. For what its worth, if I were hiring pros, I'd be a lot more likely to hire a member of this team after the incident in question than before it. I think that there is a great danger that foreigners will stop distinguishing between American citizens and the idiots running the White House. its useful to remind them that not everyone agrees with the chimp... It's a sad incident because it's the wrong place for a political manifestation. Do it outside the White House in Washington or the Joe Louis Arena in Detroit; that would be perfectly legitimate. I am no Bush fan by any means, but it is plain stupid to display a poster on the podium during the World Team Bridge Championships in Shanghai. And I do indeed think that some sanction is in order. How can anyone think that it's appropriate to do a thing like this when you have been selected to represent your country? You are there to play bridge to the best of your ability, not to make political statements! Whether you like Bush as the president of the United States or not is beside the point in this context. Roland

Indeed, but a sad incident occurred during the presentation tonight. When the American ladies received their gold medals on the podium, they displayed a poster with WE DIDN'T VOTE FOR BUSH Hardly the place for a politcal statement in my opinion. I never thought that something like this would happen in bridge circles. The question is now whether the WBF/ACBL/USBF will take some kind of action. The incident in Shanghai reminds me of the Olympics in 1968 in Mexico when Tommie Smith and John Carlos raised their gloved fists in a Black Power salute and made an iconic image of the time. Roland

Thanks Fred. Time to catch up; I am about 60 hours behind as far as sleep is concerned, but it has been worth it. Fortunately I have all of next week off. Roland

As soon as the Norwegian victory was a fact I congratulated Harald and Norwegian bridge in a private chat message to skjaeran. We have a fierce (but friendly) rivalry among the Scandinavian countries, but if we can't win it ourselves, most of us root for our neighbours. There is absolutely no doubt that Norway played the better bridge in the final. They won 7 of the 8 segments. Norway is a huge country with a small population (around 4.5 million). A little more than 11,000 are members of the NBF. Norway has taken part in 6 of 8 World Championships since 1993 with impressive results: second in Chile in 1993, third in Tunisia in 1997, second in Paris in 2001 and third in Monaco in 2003. Helness, Helgemo and Grøtheim were finalists in 1993 and 2001, Brogeland and Sælensminde in 2001 whereas Tundal participated in his first final. They are not only great players but also the most pleasant guys you can imagine. Many congratulations! http://www.bridgefederation.no/t2.asp for a picture of the gold medalists. It is also appropriate to congratulate the United States on winning the Venice Cup and Senior Bowl. The most successful nation by far even without adding the well deserved silver medal in the Bermuda Bowl. Roland

"And now, the end is near ...". It's a farewell to the World Team Championships and Shanghai in a few hours. How was it for you back home in your office, bedroom, living room, wherever? We are obviously interested in presenting the best show possible, and there will always be things that can be improved on. Your feedback is much appreciated. We will read all of it, and I am sure that your input will help us for future broadcasts. I am now going to ask seven questions and give you three options. Please use one of the three when you reply. You are obviously very welcome to comment further. It would actually be very nice if you go into details. Excellent - Average - Disappointing - 1. How was the internet connectivity from Shanghai? - 2. How was the quality of the operators? - 3. How was the presentation from the venue regarding internet broadcast? - 4. How was the co-ordination away from the venue? - 5. 6 tables per session we had. Was that satisfactory? - 6. How did you like the commentary? - 7. Should we continue with multiple languages? "I did it my way". Now over to you. Thanks for your co-operation! Roland

Our matches Thursday Oct 11 in Shanghai are as follows: Finals, Segment 1: 8 pm Wednesday Los Angeles, 11 pm Wednesday New York, 05.00 Thursday Paris, 4 am Thursday London, 1 pm Thursday Sydney USA1 v Norway (BB), Germany v USA1 (VC), Indonesia v USA2 (SB) ... Finals, Segment 2: 11:20 pm Wednesday Los Angeles, 2:20 am New York, 8.20 Paris, 7:20 am London, 4:20 pm Sydney USA1 v Norway (BB), Germany v USA1 (VC), Indonesia v USA2 (SB) ... Finals, Segment 3: To be decided. .... Why not just write finals of all three series you may ask. Because we may get a couple of sessions from the play-offs. Venice Cup and Senior Bowl: 6 segments of 16 boards (Thursday and Friday). Bermuda Bowl: 8 segments of 16 boards (Saturday included). Roland

I agree with Fred entirely. JP Meyer is a very nice man and there is no reason not to be polite if you think he has made an error in judgement. We all make mistakes, and I am sure we will survive segment 1 even though we don't get a match from the Bermuda Bowl. Still five segments to go. I am convinced that we will get plenty of USA1, South Africa, Norway and Netherlands (the semifinalists in the BB) from segment two and onwards. Roland

What are you saying? The BB semis WONT be on BBO???? I am saying that Mr Jean-Paul Meyer from France has decided that BBO will not get a BB match in SF1 = first segment of the semi-finals. http://www.worldbridge.org/bulletin/07_2%2.../pdf/bul_10.pdf ... Page 1 Don't blame us, no one thinks it's a good idea to ask us. Not that it will help at this point (too late), but complaints should be addressed to JPM. jeanpaul.meyer@noos.fr This decision is so blatantly ridiculous that it defies belief. Roland

I have just been told that BBO does not have a say when we reach the semi-finals. All matches are selected by the organisers. Two competing bridge sites with a handful of spectators will broadcast the BB matches in SF1. Inexplicable, period. Roland

Now we agree completely. I think it's unacceptable that we don't get any of the two BB semi-finals in the first segment. Just for once (after all it's at 5 am for me) I think I will stay in bed. - 1. If I come online, I will get hundreds of private chat messages from users who don't understand a word. What am I supposed to say? - 2. I would also have a hard time getting enough commentators for two VC and one SB match. That would not have happened if I had been in Shanghai, but I am not. Roland

It is also my hope, but I don't think it will happen in all of the 6 sessions. Say the organisers choose a VC match as the official, then we can pick one of the BB matches but must negotiate with other sites about the third. They would obviously also like a BB match, so it could well happen that our third match in some sessions will be from the SB. Competing sites only broadcast one match. The question is whether it's fair that they must always get a match from the VC or SB. Frankly speaking, I don't think it's that bad to get matches from the VC and SB. We have reached the semi-finals, and all teams are therefore very good. That's why they are there and other teams are not. BBO does not have exclusive rights to broadcast certain matches. NBO's have the option of buying broadcasts which has happened on previous occasions (Italy, France and Poland). This is not the case in Shanghai. Roland

You are right an wrong at the same time. In Shanghai it works like this: - 1. We must broadcast the official vugraph match at the venue. - 2. We can choose one match for ourselves (certain restrictions though). - 3. We must negotiate with other bridge sites regarding our third match. Roland

Spot on, Nikos! What's the point of showing matches where one team is 100 or more IMPs ahead? So we haven't seen USA1, Norway and Netherlands much in the quarter-finals, but we will Tuesday and Wednesday. Roland

Excuse me, but this is the World Championships, not some social Sunday afternoon tournament in Outofreach. Heaven knows that I, on several occasions, have been critical of many of WBF's decisions, but this time I think they have done a fine job. So has Hervé Lustman (Zmud99) on behalf of BBO. No matter how hard you try, you can't please everyone. Let's face it and live with it. Constructive criticism is always welcome of course, but please bear in mind that you are getting all this for absolutely nothing. No offence intended, Denis, Dave and Bob, but how much do peope think they can demand free of charge? Most of the whiners are those who prefer to lean back, expect miracles without doing anything, visibly huffed when they don't get it their way constantly. And Bob, English is a must, so it's my job to toss a coin. Polish or Japanese in the other room? Japan lost, sorry, but I am in a no-win-situation. Either I must disappoint several hundred Japanese spectators, or perhaps even more Poles. I have said it many times before but I don't mind saying it again. As long as I am in charge of coordinating vugraph presentations, I will not allow a mixture of languages in one room. Roland