dave_w

After discussing this hand for a while last night (I'd thought not much everyone thought it was an auto double - tap them out at trick 1) here's a few random thoughts that I think haven't been covered by anyone else (but they might not be relevant). 1) The tap is only good if it's the long trump hand - if declarer is 5413 then this 4♠ is making - maybe with an overtrick. 2) Our offensive/defensive potential is a lot different depending on partner fragment/side suit. If partner is a 0742 or a 0724 will make a lot of difference (we could easily make 6♥ opposite the 0742 but that's not really possible opposite the 0724). Similarly, on defense our QJT of diamonds is a trick if partner is 0724 but not 0742. This is also relevant opposite 08(32). 3) What on earth do the opponents have? How can the 1♠ bidder be worth 4♠ now? If he has a 5/5 then why didn't he Michael's? If he has a 5(431) then where are all the HCPs coming from that he thinks 4♠ is a good idea. His shape could be 5044 (double is a big winner), 54(31) - double looks like a big loser here. 53(14) doesn't seem so likely but even so he's looking good - he's picked his partner's shortage. 51(34) - double is a big winner again, but if does seem like an overbid on an 8 card fit with only half the HCP. 4) A problem with defending with JTxxx/T9xxx or showing this as a stopper for 3NT is that partner has no wastage in the opponent's suit. There will be a lot of total tricks on a hand like this and slam is a possiblity when this is your holding in the trump suit. Compare with QJxx or KQxx where there will be very few total tricks (People who believe in the Law of Total Trumps will have difficulty understanding this, but there's more to determining the number of tricks on a hand than counting the trump fits). 5) Has no one brought up that pass can be right? Even though pass will never be right on the actual hand (either 4♠ is making and we should bid or it's going down and we should double), if we don't know which of those two is happening pass can still be the winning (percentage) action!! Also, I don't think that the actual hand (posted above) matters. Sure, some action will have been right. And those who chose that action can go away and congratulate themselves on what good bridge players they are, and how they'd have made the right bid _this_time_. But, it's the argument which matters. I won't ever hold this hand on this bridge deal, but I wonder what we can learn and what things we should be thinking about. I thought the doublers were right. It was automatic. Now I'm not so sure.

Thanks for this! That's an excellent explanation of his position and it makes a lot of sense. Now I'm not sure what's best. I'm still not sure that 4351 opposite 45xx always plays better in spades, but the bidding out shape at such a low level makes a lot of sense. Pffft points who cares you've shown an opening hand (or if you are jlall something close to an opening hand). Definitely food for thought and required reading. I'm sending it to my partner!

Depending on what your 2♥ rebid shows (eg what do you bid over 2♦ with a 3514 minimum). I play that 3♠ shows 6♥ but a suit not good enough for a 3♥ bid. That way you get the extra strength across and the shape.

I'm surprised at this. Firstly, I'm not sure 4♠ will play better with those hand shapes (the discards on the long Hearts are going to be of long diamonds!). In fact 4♥ could easily play better throwing losing spades on the long diamonds. It will matter what the texture of the two hands is. Secondly, having a reverse which takes up room (admittedly not much room here) not show extras means it's harder for opener when they do need to show extras later. It's not like you'll always miss a 4-4 spade fit (the auction is GF and responder can always introduce them later). I'd agree with your style in a strong club but I'm not sure it's best in a standard system (although I do think it's playable - lots of top pairs do play 2/1 with those agreements).

I'd be interested in the continuations if you can bother to dig them up 6S-4C wants to go past 3NT regardless of strength. Partner is either bal (we have a spade fit) or has 5+ clubs (opposite a 6-4 we must be close to slam regardless of pd's strength).

Well on this hand I don't think it matters what you do. You'll have 9 (of course MP considerations come in to it). I'd play small to the King and small to the Queen. The cards the opponents play are mostly irrelevant, otherwise you'll pay out to false carding (small to an honour the second time is superior to small to the 9 as you can pick up Jx but not Ax). So I'd try and drop the doubleton Jack. Also this reminds me of an expert story (I think they were Polish) dummy had KQJ9x of a suit and no outside entry. Declarer with xx leads small to the King and the expert won the Ace. On the second round they played small to the 9 (it had to be singleton Ace or they would have ducked to cut him off from dummy) and lost to the Ten (AT doubleton originally), and took no tricks in the suit.

Line E is the worst. Playing for RHO to be not-vul vs vul with a 5611 and no defence (QJ in Hearts and no guarantee a Spade is cashing). I'd put the odds of this working at close to 0%. Line D also gets home where line B does - whereas the same is not true (line B can suffer a ruff). So line B isn't best. Line C picks up 3 doubletons, Line D (with a little variation ***) picks up 12 doubletons + if they midefend. So I'd say line D is better than line C (it's winning so far). And line A picks up 4 of the 20 3-3 breaks, as opposed to 14 of the 30 4-2 breaks. And given that they can break up the squeeze when RHO is 4513, it must be worse than that. Line D is the winner: [h]A, [d]A, [d]Q and exit in . Ruff the return, cross to [h]K, ruff a [h], cross to [c]A, ruff a [h], and exit in [c] (no guess needed). *** Line D (modified): when crossing to the [C]A if LHO plays an honour then lead up to the Jack of Clubs - either LHO has Hx and unblocked or he'll win this trick and (hopefully) have no more Clubs to play.

Not switching to a club is hardly a misdefence: 1) With the ♠Ace RHO might have won the spade, thus making it impossible for LHO to switch to Clubs. 2) With KTxx in Clubs, it's a clear error for LHO to switch to Clubs - swap the ♣J and ♣Q in the two hands and a Club switch allows a contract home that would otherwise have gone off (declarer could make double dummy with that layout - but he's hardly going to). And the only thing to gain from a Club switch - saving partner from misdefending (which I must say is a reasonable reason to do it - but not with these risks).

Well it's not my fault - I wouldn't have bid the slam! But I don't understand your point - taking the Heart hook requires hearts to be 3-3 or a squeeze. Taking the diamond hook requires the heart hook (or if I choose a squeeze). Neither finesse gives you 12 tricks. Probably the Heart hook is better - you make if diamonds or hearts are 3-3 or if LHO has 4-4 in the reds. But I reckon it'd be close (I don't have a calculator handy - oops bad excuse I'm on a computer ... okay I'm just lazy ...)

The best line in the diamond suit alone is to finesse the Ten. This might not allow you to check for Hearts 3-3 (you'll block diamonds and need the Hearts as a re-entry). I prefer the Diamond finesse to th Heart finesse - at least if thee Diamond finesse wins you'll most likely have 5 diamond tricks. So I'd play a diamond to the Ten at trick two and then play a spade.

It's complicated by the fact that if you play a club up and they play low they probably don't have the King. So I'd always try the Ten (which is very unlikely to hold the trick - hopefully it loses to the King!). And before number crunching what about line 4: play 3 rounds of Hearts and if LHO has 4 (such that a diamond/club squeeze isn't very likely against LHO anymore) then play a club to the Ten and play for diamonds 3-3 or a squeeze (which might be an unlikely Diamond-Heart squeeze).

You make a valid point. However, 1=4=3=5 is more likely than 1=2=5=5 (a priori and we have no evidence to suggest otherwise) AND 1=3=4=5 is mor likely than 1=2=5=5. So the combined chance of 1=4=3=5 and 1=3=4=5 must be much greater than playing for specifically 1=2=5=5.

4NT. Partner didn't have to start cue bidding (he could have raised to 4[hearrts] with a bad hand) and I want to make bidding 7♥ easy. (I'll bid it opposite the 3 key cards playing partner for the Spade or Diamond Queen). I can't imagine that 6♥ isn't good if partner has his bidding (ie the cue bid of 3♠).

I think the problem is the 3♥ call. Partner thought you were trying to get to 3NT and he had enough extraa to want to play 6NT. You don't have enough values to want to get to 3NT. I'd have bid 3♠ and left furthre moves to partner (probably 3NT from him which should show interest in contracts beyond 3NT - else he wouldn't have bid 3♦ first). If we have a club fit and partner raises us to 4♠ on Hx, it's not all bad. We might even have play!

Why is it that every time someone gives me a suit combination I learn how ridiculous the assumptions behind the "best way" to play the suit is. For instance - with this combination you play small to the 9 and it holds the trick and so you lead small to the Queen and it loses to the King!! What do you do now? If you don't finesse the Ten then LHO might hold KJxx and will take two tricks! But I've never met anyone who defends like that. The "best" play is small to the 9. If it holds then small to the Queen (if this loses to the King then you have to pay off to the opponents hoolding KJxx and cash the Ace!). When small to the 9 loses to the Jack then the two cass are a bit different: if you have small cards you should lead low towards the ATx. You'll make 3 tricks with KJx onside or KJ tight. if you have the 7 then you should lead the Queen towards the ATx (and finesse). The reason is that KJ8xx is more likely than KJ tight (perhaps the rest of the hand will suggest that this suit isn't 5-1 however which would change the correct play). Here are two great sites for analysing card combinations: www.suitplay.com - a downloadable program for windows. Enter in the two hands and it'll play the hands for you (you have to go through the different combinations of plays yourself to work out what it thinks the line is). http://www.rpbridge.net/xcc1.htm - Richrd Pavlicek's card combination analyzer. Put in the suit combination and it'll give you the odds of all the different breaks. Go through each of them and tick the box if your line of play works - and it'll add up the percentage of that line of play. Be careful though - you have to realise when the opponents can falsecard you to give up tricks (eg it's "right" to duck th Jack with KJxx sitting over Q9x in this combination in order to get two tricks!!!). I find that if I want to learn a suit combination that I'll use Pavlicek's site because it makes you think about which hands the different lines work on - why the different lines gain tricks - which can be very useful (eg learning which line is better when you expect RHO or LHO to be longer in a suit). Or for instance learning that you should play the Queen to pick up KJ8xx which is more likely than KJ tight (but perhaps not when the whole hand is considered!). So from now on you can do all your own research in to card combinations because they are a lot of work and I don't want to do it for you again ;-)

Win the ♠J, Cash the [diamond King] (I'm very happy if they want to win this - so I assume it holds) Then ♣K. If the Club Queen, Jack or Ten falls then ♣A and another club, otherwise duck a club. I guess a Spade comes back - so I win my King. If I haven't already cashed the ♣A then I do so now. If I have 3 clubs, 2 spades, one heart and 1 diamond (with a stranded spade trick in dummy) then I think I'm going to make - I exit with the ♦Q and hope that they have to give me a diamond or a heart trick on the return (and possibly an entry) or I might get lucky with a doubleton ♦J. If I only have 2 club tricks then: If West has 4 clubs - I play East for being 3442 with the ♦A and ♥K, and play a small Heart to the Queen, cash the ♠A and play ♥A and another Heart (or equivalent line if he wins the Heart King earlier) losing 2 Hearts, 1 club, 1 Diamond and winning 3 spades, 2 clubs, 2 diamonds and 2 Hearts. If East has 4 clubs then either East is 3244 or 3424: I don't like my chances with the former ... either way I lead the ♦Q hoping for a doubleton Jack (or to cut communications). This hand has got a little bit complex! How am I doing? (there are so many variants depending on who has what cards).

Unfortunately the ♥Q might confuse partner too (I don't mind the lead - it could be a big winner). As for Heart layouts - this wasn't as important as the rest of the hand. Us Heart leaders are trying not to blow a trick on the opening lead. If dummy has the ♥A and we lead a Spade or a Diamond then declarer might now have 9 tricks. And if partner has the ♥A then we've found partner's entry - hoorah - what a great lead. The worst layout is dummy has the AK, declarer has 7 clubs and claims - when we could have cashed out Diamonds or Spades (or maybe both!!))

And what about when you hold a void in the opposite Major. Or perhaps one wishes to split the HCP of the various splintrs (using 3OM to show a 13-15 HCP splinter and the direct 4 level to show a 10-12 splinter). Whatever methods you choose are always a compromise - but I think this discussion is valid whatever methods one uses. For example: your auction on the first case would go 1S-3H (unspecified splinter) 3S ask, 4H showing a Heart splinter. 5D cue bid. Or maybe you'll tell me that 3NT is used for the Heart splinter since that saves room ... what about the auction: 1H - 3S (unspecified splinter) 3NT- 4D (diamond splinter) 5C Now this auction is the same as Andy's simplified 5 level auction and your system isn't unambiguous. Sorry for the long, slightly off topic reply, but I don't think that conventions have a place in a discussion about bidding system principles. (People's conventions are interesting, and I in fact agree with using somthing similar to your idea but I don't think this thread is the place for it).

The diamonds must be Kxx opposite AQT9x or KT9x(x) opposite AQx(x) or else the play of the King doesn't make sense. The diamond discard is from either of these holdings also (with T9xxx in Clubs and Qxxx in Hearts West would want to pitch from diamonds even though it's his shortest suit). So West is 1345, 1435, 1255. The first two shapes are much more likely than the third - don't play an opponent to hold ten cards in two suits unless they've bid (or unless it's the only layout that allows you to make). So I guess I'm cashing the last trump and playing West for the ♥Q. I've read a few posts about this meaning that East has misdefendd (underlead the Diamond Ace to get partner to cash the Club). I wouldn't play for anyone to defend that well. If they do then I doubt it matters how I play this hand - I won't be winning the event!

Case 1: (Last train at the 5 level) I can't imagine not bidding slam when I have the club control. So I'm not sure that 5H is last train. I think it's 1st round heart and 1st round club looking for 7S. (6C would be first round club, but not first round heart) and 6H I guess would be the same as 5H ... so maybe 5H is last train after all - I just can't imagine needing it. Case 2: (Last train at the 4 level) I play that the last train cue bid promises the denied control, but says nothing about the suit bid. (so in your example the 4H cue bid would show cllub control and not say anything about hearts). I think 5C should show Heart and Club control - but a hand that isn't sure about slam (eg lots of Controls but no tricks). Case 3: I don't think 4D is a cue bid! It's natural slam try. 4H would thus promise heart control. (In this auction you can make slam tries with a source of tricks - bid the suit or with Heart Control - bid 4H). Case 4: Expert standard depends on who you ask. Best if you ask your partner. If we'd agreed last train and case 2 came up I'd bid last train with the missing control (unsure if I was promising Heart control) - but partner should also be UNSURE whether it promises Heart control and only know it promised the missing control and would have to bid with this uncertaintity

Great - we doubled because we didn't know what to lead and partner helped us by ... passing. I lead the ♥T. Because (1) it might hit partner's suit, (2) it's unlikely to give up th 9th trick (though it could give up a tempo) (3) partner won't play us for the ♥J like they would if we lead the Queen (4) partner won't play back a heart (from dummy and their hand they'll know the Ten was a short suit lead and will hopefully find the spade switch).

Yes I think I prefer your order of play: ♥K, ♣A, ♥A and then: if hearts are 2-2: Cash ♣K, play a club and claim unless East has 5 clubs: in which case finesse West for the ♠Q if West has 3♥: Cash ♣King, ♦A, ruff a club, ruff a diamond, ruff a club (ruffing finesse if that's shown to work). When East also has 5 clubs, then run trumps and I think playing the show-up squeeze is best here: There's one vacant space difference to favour West having the ♠Q (6-5) but the show up squeeze picks up Qx with West and any Queen with East.(see note below) if East has 3♥: ♦A, ruff a club, ruff a diamond, ruff a club. If the club doesn't get overruffed then we are home unless East has 5 clubs and 3 hearts: finesse West for the ♠Q. When East has 3 hearts then we can't combine chances very well, and I don't think anything can be done about this. The best line for the show up squeeze is NOT to cash the ♠A, but bring the position down to a 4 card ending of ♠AJxx opposite ♠KTx ♣K where East is known to have ♣Qx (or we can keep the ♣J and claim!). Then cash the ♠K, ♣K, ♠A (unless there is a marked finesse). This has a 61% chance of working as opposed to playing west for the ♠Q which works 54.5% of the time. (Note that this is AFTER hearts are 3-1 and clubs are 2-5).

So at some point in the fairly distant future BBO will need to be ported to HTML5. Possibly making it usable on mobile devices. BBO moved from a stand-alone application to being Web-based with very few dramas. Moving from one web based technology to another is something that many people wouldn't even notice! Also, this is a long way from being an issue. Flash isn't about to disappear overnight.

Then I go down. I said my choice was the show up squeeze at the position I arrived at. Pointing out a losing case for that position doesn't make it a bad play. I could NOT cash the ♠A and claim that I would guess the position at the table. That way I'll never be wrong in the forum ...

9 - ♠A 10 - Cash trump East must keep Qx of clubs (so pitch the Club Jack) and play a Spade to the King.