Liversidge

What would you bid here? [hv=pc=n&s=sj7hq874daqj97ca9&d=e&v=0&b=14&a=1n]133|200[/hv]

Thanks everyone. Your comments have been very valuable. Landy it is. The opportunity vs risk/effort of going further seems very marginal at our level.

PS: I passed. 1NT went one off. Partner had one heart, four clubs and 8 HCP, I think. We would probably have made 3♣. Both sides were non-vulnerable.

I am probably in too much of a rush, trying to learn from every game where I have struggled to find the best bid by rushing to my references (including BBO), and often I find there is a convention that good players would use. I am not experienced enough to make good judgments as to whether I should try to adopt the convention or just (as you say) just shrug and concentrate on other priorities with higher payback vs investment potential. To make the right judgment I need to weigh up how often that type of hand/auction is likely to come up, how complicated the convention is, and what the risk / opportunity is, and that's not easy for someone at my level. Last week I had this South hand which prompted my question: [hv=pc=n&s=st85hkj652dacaq96&d=e&v=0&b=14&a=1nppp]133|200[/hv] I have only six losers if we find a fit. What should I have bid? Thinking about what you have said, I am guessing that Landy is so highly rated vs Multi Landy because it is fairly straightforward, and it will usually be possible to find a safe resting place at the 2 level in a major, whereas Multi Landy is complicated for me (especially the responses to 2♦) and we could end up with a 3 level contract in a minor.

I should have said we play a weak No trump.

I have been studying Multi Landy quite a lot - it is recommended on the 'No Fear' bridge site. And it uses the Unusual No Trump for the minors, which partner and I also use over a suit opener showing the two lowest unbid suits. So it builds on what we currently play. But then I came across other conventions that are supposedly easier for a novice/beginner. One is Asptro, which gets a lot of mention, but it means ditching Landy, which we have just about got under our belt, although it does not come up often enough, and we are looking for a system that deals with Mm and mm two suiters. Then there is Astro, and Aspro, and others I am sure, which I haven't looked at yet. So I thought I'd check alternatives out before making a recommendation to partner.

My partner and I play Landy, but what is the best defense system for other two suited hands.

Tonight RHO opened 1♠, I passed, LHO bid 2♠. Partner had 6 clubs, 5 hearts and 17 points. His hearts were better than his clubs but he had honours in both. What should partner have bid? We wondered afterwards if he should have doubled, and settled at 3♥ if I bid diamonds. I had 4 points. Partner couldn't expect much more given the bidding.

I was not referring to this particular thread, and I was only giving Kickback as an example of terms used by responders on this Novice / Beginner Forum. I also mentioned the Unassuming Cue Bid, and Vampyr suggested that I should probably know about it. I have only just discovered it and noone at my clubs play it, and I suspect most have never heard of it. :o I play at three clubs, two social and one an EBU club where the standard is a bit higher. I have been playing bridge for two years and am probably the newest member at all three clubs. You may be surprised to know that very few players at any of the clubs know about splinters, Jacoby 2NT, Landy, Michaels, UNT, Puppet Stayman, Garbage Stayman, Unassuming Cue Bid, intermediate / weak jump overcalls, etc., though some have heard of them. Hardly anyone at the social clubs knows what a 'reverse' is, only one pair play KCB, and most have never even heard of RKCB. I have a few books on Acol. The 'beginner' books rarely mention any of the above. I have a couple of books for improvers, including one by Michelle Brunner (Acol bidding for Improvers), and the only conventions covered are standard Blackwood, Stayman and Intermediate/Jump overcalls. She does not cover red suit transfers. Only in her more advanced book ("for budding experts") does she introduce the systems I mention above. And yet these terms come up in postings on this board. I can totally understand why they do. Often the thread subject matter widens out and experts discuss among themselves, and it's difficult to know if they have novice me in mind at the time. Occasionally someone will say "I don't think this is suitable for the NBF, which helps. I try to follow as much as I can. But someone might say '"I'd double here" and someone else will agree. It doesn't look like a type of double I recognise, so I look it up. I then ask myself "should I have known this". Before you know it I am discovering that it is a competitive double, or a supportive double, or an optional double, or a reopening double, and my brain hurts. It's easy for you experts to recognise that some poster's suggestions are not for a novice/beginner and I should skip over them, but it's harder for me to recognise it. And who is to say what the boundary is between NBF material and IAF material? Vampyr's suggestion was spot on, though sometimes it's hard to know when to apply it.

It's also hard to know sometimes when to draw the line when I post a question that seems fairly straightforward and some answers refer to bid types and conventions (Kickback, UCB etc) that I have not come across and are probably for more advanced players than a novice/beginner. Overall I get terrific responses, much more informative than I can get from any other sources, but sometimes I can get drawn beyond my comfort / experience level without realising it.

Point taken. But this topic came up with my (more experienced) partner a few weeks ago when he doubled after we had both bid a suit, and when I was asked by opps what I took it to mean, I said I wasn't sure but assumed it was for penalties. I was gently admonished for not alerting (EBU rules). After the game partner explained that he was giving me the option of making a takeout or passing for penalties - he was stuck for a bid and he knew the opps were regular contract stealers and didn't want them to get away with it. I had not come across this sort of double - I just knew about takeout doubles including negative doubles, and penalty doubles. So when I read about competitive and support doubles on this board I thought I should find out more as it may come up again and I want to be a bit better prepared. (Partner and I play around 3 times a month and rarely get time together to refine our understandings - mainly brief discussions at the table or afterwards, or by email, so I often use this board to brush up on stuff when things go wrong on deals and I don't quite follow what helpful players are explaining.)

I have looked up 'competitive doubles' and if my original hand had 16+ points such a double would have been a good bid, showing a hand where we have the majority of the points and I would have bid 1NT after the RHO overcall I did not have good stops in the opponents' suit. One post referred to a support double and from what I can gather it shows 3 card support for responder's suit after a RHO overcall. I guess this means that you can't play both types of double and have to agree which one you will play.

That explains some of the differing guidelines I get on reverses depending on whether I am reading US or Acol sources. If I have a strong hand - say 17 points, partner responds at the 1 level, and I would need to jump in order to reverse (needs 19 points as I am pushing the bidding to the 3 level, how do I show my partner the strength of my hand on my rebid if a No Trump bid is not suitable? [hv=pc=n&s=sj86hak654daqj4cq&d=s&v=0&b=11&a=1hp1sp]133|200[/hv] Partner may only have 6 HCP and four iffy spades. [hv=pc=n&n=sq954h764d98ca875]133|100[/hv] But he may be stronger and game might be on.

My understanding is that you need 16+ HCP to reverse. Is this still the case after RHO has overcalled? Could you explain why 1NT is right for this hand? With two doubletons it doesn't fit the standard guidelines. Is it because with 13 points you have to open but don't think the clubs are good enough to rebid after a 1♠ response.

My understanding is that you need 16+ HCP to reverse. Is this still the case after RHO has overcalled? Could you explain why 1NT is right for this hand? With two doubletons it doesn't fit the standard guidelines. Is it because with 13 points you have to open but don't think the clubs are good enough to rebid after a 1♠ response.

Got that! So what sort of hand would a rebid of 2♥ show in terms of points and cards in diamonds and hearts, assuming it has some sensible meaning at all?

Or maybe not! On reflection the negative double is made by responder, so I don't think it applies here.

We have just started playing the negative double and I can now see that a double in this situation (when a minor and a major have been bid) shows 4 cards in the unbid major, so that seems to be the answer here.

The hand I had in mind when asking the question was as follows: [hv=pc=n&s=sq5ha975dq7ckq975&d=s&v=0&b=11&a=1cp1s2d]133|200[/hv] Without the overcall I would have rebid my clubs. If I bid 2♥ will I be misleading partner about my strength?

I play Modern Acol (though I suspect the answer might be the same in most systems). 1♣ -(P) - 1♠ - (2♦) - 2♥ I don't think it is a reverse with 16-18 HCP - I might have 15 HCP, five iffy clubs, four goodish hearts and a singleton spade. But with only 12 HCP I would be pushing partner too high if he only has four spades and 6 HCP, so would pass, as partner has another bid. So what would partner reasonably expect after my rebid?

The actual hand is as follows: [hv=pc=n&s=saqj9ha2d32caqj63&d=s&v=0&b=11&a=1cp1hp1s]133|200[/hv] Paul Mendelson is the Financial Times bridge correspondent and a major author on bridge in the UK. On this hand he writes: "Many players would jump in spades but there is no need. All possible games and slams are still available and 1S is 100% forcing. This leaves plenty of room for partner to rebid to describe his hand further, or to use Fourth suit forcing to elicit further information from you. To jump here would simply waste your own side's bidding space and make reaching the correct contract more difficult" I have a lot of books and other resources on bridge but have never heard of this before so thought I'd check it out before raising it with my partner.

In Paul Mendelson's book "121 Tips for Better Bridge' he says that 1♣- 1♦ - 1♠ is 100% forcing and he gives an example of a 19 HCP hand where opener rebids 1♠, without fear of partner passing, thus leaving more space to explore the best contract. Elsewhere I have read that opener's second bid should show his strength with a reverse, which a 1♠ rebid doesn't do. Paul's advice seems sensible, so long as partner knows he has to bid again, even if he has only 6 points and an unbalanced hand with 6+ cards in his first suit, so has to bid 1NT with no support for my first suit, good three card support for my second suit and a singleton or void in his second suit. I don't want partner to pass my 19 point hand saying he made a preference pass as I had not shown my strength with a reverse or a No Trump rebid, and he suspected a misfit.

Thanks for that clear explanation! :D

Partner and I have started playing Michaels and the Unusual No Trump. Most references I can find say not to use the UNT in fourth position after two passes, but don't say why. I am guessing that the rationale is that an immediate jump overcall in No Trumps shows around 20 HCP balanced with a stop, which is going to be very infrequent after an opponent has opened, freeing up the bid for a two suited overcall. But in the protective position it I assume the 2NT overcall can be used non-conventionally with a weaker balanced hand - say around 17 HCP balanced, which is more likely to crop up, so it is not such a good idea to give it up for the UNT convention. Is that it?