fromageGB

Agree with everything so far ... I guess the style disagreements are pretty fundamental.

I don't think it matters what you play, provided you agree with partner (assuming this is not a scratch one-off partnership). I know some prefer support X to be always with 3 and to bid the suit with 4, but my partnerships play support X shows one fewer than needed for simple support according to LOTT, and also shows that the partnership holds at least half of the hcp in the hand. This then enables partner to make a later penalty X more easily. So in your example, with partner showing an agreed typical minimum 6hcp sort of hand, the X is 2 spades and a 14+ count. An immediate 2♠ would be 3 spades. I don't like doubling opponents for penalty at the 2 level when they have supported, as there is often an option to pass if partner reopens with X on a goodish hand. A support double makes it easy for him to take action when he has more than 5 spades. However, if in this situation partner would jump to 2♠ with 6, rather than bid 1♠, then there is an implication of just 5 spades, and the support double is of not much use. I would then prefer it to show 2 spades and some diamonds, saying nothing about strength -ie takeout with tolerance.

I think this applies just as well to amateurs/team-mates as to pro/client. How will team-mates react when you come back with a negative score - will they go through the maths and agree with you? Mine wouldn't.

So you don't have to kickback if you have a good reason to cue. In your example, if you have reached 4♠ you have already made that decision to not kickback. So 4NT is for me ace asking. But you would not be getting here if you felt likely to not be able to manage the response. You are no worse off that those who do not play kickback. Indeed you are better off, because you have had a choice of approaches - full details of aces, trump honours and side kings that is inaccessible to 4NTers, or cue bidding and asking like the 4NTers.

Yes, better, and even simpler <_< I don't play this meaning for 3♣, but my point was that the follow-ups depend on the meaning of 3♣.

Maybe I don't understand. My approach is to achieve the "impossible" and let the weaker hand decide the contract. 2♣ 2♦(negative), 3NT(balanced 26/27) "decision", including Stayman and transfers. Not a perfect description of 27 balanced, but 26/27 should be enough.

Give me the corners every time. Roundabouts aren't too bad, it's the traffic lights I hate. No, kickbackers have no trouble cueing when majors are trumps, a cue starts with/or a bid above non-serious 3NT when spades are trumps, or a non-serious 3♠ when hearts are trumps. It's the minor contracts we are reluctant to cue. We (my partnerships, I don't mean all kickbackers) play 3NT as natural, so there is not the benefit of the non-serious or its bypass. However, we do forgo kickback if we have a hand that (very rarely) particularly wants to cue a 4M rather than ace ask, then 4NT after that is plain RKCB. Rules 6 and 3 are all you need, on the whole.

Yes, we agree that 2NT shows reds, in a weak hand or a strong hand, and that 1♣ is treated as natural. So of course 3♣ by advancer MUST be artificial. Partner has announced a definite 2-suiter, so why would you want to play in clubs with no fit and opponent sitting over you? If you have good clubs, you could try 3NT, but not 3♣. So given that 3♣ is artificial, what does it mean? When you have a meaning, only then can you decide on what the follow-ups are. (1) If you use 3♣ to split up the weak range, you must be strong enough to want to go game, so Zel's seems fine if you can remember that level of detail. (2) If you use 3♣ to mean "equal length in your suits (advancer weak or strong)" then the obvious follow-ups are 3red = weak range, 4red = strong range, bidding the longer/better suit, or as in this case we have a major and a minor, if overcaller is equal length he bids hearts for the better score. (3) if you use 3♣ as game invitation in hearts, then this would be a game invitation for the weak range, so overcaller bids 4♥ or 3♥ depending on whether he thinks he is good or bad in the weak range. A strong range overcaller will ask for aces or cue bid. (4) If you use 3♣ an a general purpose invitational bid with advancer making no statement as to his holdings, then a follow-up without the refinements of Zel's would be that a poor weak range bids 3red (diamonds only if longer), a good weak range bids 4red (diamonds only if longer), and a strong range can temporise with 4♣ for advancer to nominate the suit. So the follow-ups must necessarily be dependent on what the 3♣ bid means. If you actually have a good hand with a control in clubs (the other possible interpretation on what 3♣ means), then the initial 3♣ should be treated as one of the above (your choice) and then when overcaller has bid a suit you can show the club control. So it does not make sense to treat the initial 3♣ as a control cue.

Playing normal methods, yes, certainly kickback by my rules. 3♦ is the obvious bid with diamond support, so 4♦ cannot be anything else other than ace asking in clubs. But I do remember from an earlier thread that many think it is natural.

With my Twalsh bidding, opener has not rebid spades but clubs. As responder I know we have a 6-2 fit in clubs and you will agree that there is no way I can rebid NT. It is MP, so I show my 6 card suit rather than passing 2♣. Playing natural methods and a 1♠ opener rebid, 1NT is certainly possible, but I prefer to show a 6 card heart suit, so I think 2♥ is better. Presumably opener can easily have 2 (or 3!) hearts. One fewer heart and one more spade, and I rebid 1NT. If he has 3 hearts with a diamond shortage he should put me back to hearts.

♦8. You might need to take/set up a diamond before it is lost on the spades.

With a random partner it is a guess. I would bid 3NT and hopefully from his length in hearts he will know it to be not natural, and therefore be both minors. If he bids one, I raise to game. If you think 3NT could be taken as natural, you could bid 4♥. He will probably NOT take that as natural, so will probably bid 4♠. Then 5♣ from you should make him think, and probably deduce you have both minors. If you think that is too risky, then just 4♦. You may get an opportunity for 5♣ later.

I think the feeling is that your 3♦ bid was wrong. The way I play, this can be passed. Without splinters you need to set up a forcing situation and bid diamonds later, so North's first rebid could be 2♠. Better, if you play splinters, 3♠ to show the spade shortage AND agree your partner's diamond suit, all in one bid. If you don't want to play 4NT ace ask over a minor (and I don't blame you) you need to agree that before making a unilateral decision. But the bidding would have been different anyway, had you not bid 3♦.

I'm sure you weren't directing. But it was a long time ago.

Gnasher said it well. I remember missing the motorway exit while getting to the Great Northern Swiss Pairs, arriving too late for the first round, and being awarded 10/20 for the starting point on the next round, and this seemed sensible. 12/20 would not be. However, I was actually awarded half(or a quarter) of a green for the missed round (which you would get for a 10/10 draw) which made me think the best way to increase your greens would be to enter for lots of events and not turn up. :D You'd need to be Abramovich, though.

I think the disadvantages of a 3 point range have been explained, and I much prefer the accuracy of 1C 1x 1/2NT compared with 2NT that leaves responder in the dark (and unable to determine the best contract) as much as it does the opponents. In the old days I used to play a 19/20 as many did here, and now much prefer the minimum to be 20 or 21. But 21 doesn't work if your partners don't like responding to 1♣ on a 5 count. I think that determines the minimum. "What is the maximum you can have with a balanced hand for opening 1♣ where you can miss game if responder passes with a maximum pass balanced hand?"

1♣ 1♦(hearts), 2♣ 2♥, 2♠ 3♦, 5♣ I think. 2♣ is a safe rebid by N as with our style S will not have spades if not intending to bid again. I would like to emphasise the clubs before showing the spades, and don't think it has enough values for a reverse, regardless of the distribution.

I don't see how a bye is worth anything like 12 out of 20. However, it is arguable that you should get more than just an average 10, so I would say a third of the cube of pi is about right.

I would play A, so probably the finesse is right.

If you are using X as Stayman, then it should be whatever it means for you after normal Stayman. 5 card diamonds, other major? But I don't like Stayman after their bid.

Absolutely, surely it must. Responder has long diamonds and happy to play opposite a doubleton. "Auto-agreement". No, this can't work. Opener does not know responder's length, or how many tricks are there, or whether there is a heart loser. It has to be responder that asks for aces and kings. So much better, surely, to have 4 diamonds as "possibly useful hand, agree your suit, go ahead and ask for aces" and then responder's next step (4♥) asks. Of course you have a probable agreement that opener does not show ♥K. This is excluded by the initial 3NT bid ... and also suffers from the fact that opener cannot ask for aces, as above. Face it - whether you normally play 4NT only, minorwood or whatever, in this sequence responder has be the one to ask. While you could say 4♠ invites a 4NT ask, much better to say 4♦ invites a 4♥ ask.

It probably doesn't make much difference in practice, because your original 4th highest is likely to be a small card. Presumably if you started with 3, you would lead original second highest, as I would in my QT3 example (highest remaining). I tend to think in terms of lo/hi because I normally play attitude leads (lo is good) rather than length. I prefer lo to say "lead it back, please". Partner does not need to know the length.

I have no agreement (see next paragraph), but in our style, when partner is auto-forcing diamonds, and 4NT is the ace-ask, 4♦ is no major A, and 4M the cheapest A. It does not apply to me, because with kickback, 4♥ would be ace asking, so if opener has delayed diamond support he bids 4♦ so responder can ask. Therefore if opener bids a 4♥ it emphasises that hearts are OK for NT, but leaves the choice to partner, 4♠ suggests an alternative contract, and 4NT is to play.

Solve all the problems and open 1♥ when you have 5 ! :P

I have known declarer to open 1NT with a low doubleton in a suit, I have done it myself, so it is possible partner started with K985, for example. Standard, I think, is to play a small one back if you want partner, when he wins a trick later in the auction, to lead one back. Conversely, a high one tells him that if he does, he is likely to give a trick away. So here, lead the smallest, the 3. There is another aspect to this, with which it fits, and that is blocking. You need to lead a small one so that when he wins a later trick and returns, starting with the highest of his remaining two, you can run the remainder of the tricks. If your holding was QT3, you need to lead the T at trick 2, which avoids blocking the suit. Later, when in again, you can then lead the 3. You don't want him to lead the suit again because he will be leading into Jx(x) from his K9(x). The high lead tells him this.