Pavell

This is essentially what, 10+ HCP any shape? I can see how this might get good results when the opponents don't come in, but how would this do against breathing opponents? A good system doesn't just win bidding contests. - There is no problem with the preemptive at all, if they are below 3NT. B2 means Base # of 2, and do not have fixed HCP. ForcePoint doesn't work with HCP. It use Controls, HCP, Distributions, Negative, and transfer all of them to Base number. The sum of both partners B#s will give the Play Level for any particular bid. Obviously you didn't read a row of the system, and I do not know why you ask ?!

- Before I start, I have a question: How many pts require Moscito's 2♥ response? And do you think you filfull the Moskito's requirement for the opening bid of 1♠? - Despite of your answer I will tell you, that ForcePoint can not find this Slam if South is the opener. If North if the opener it is possible, because South will open in 3rd sit. I'll show it soon (my night shift just finish, and I'm going home), but the constructed games like this one are on practice probably 1 on a million, so it is possible even Fp not to be able to pespond properly. "NEVER" for most Developers usually means 1 on 100,000, and I didn't make an exception. I will answer you tomorrow... The bids will be: North - South Pass - 1♦ (B1+, 6+♦ or bi-color) 2♦(B1, 5+ ♦ Basic suit, free bid) - 2♥ (Relay for other 2 suits) 3♥ (red or black "CO" suits, excluding the color of the Basic suit with 6 card in ♦ by SCOR_SCOR Convention) - 3♠ (Relay for the longest suit, excluding the Basic ♦ suit) 3NT (I have Void in the suit I didn't mention, i.e. Void ♥) - 4♣(Repeating of the Relay for the longest suit, excluding the Basic) 4♠(shape4063) - 4NT (CPA for Controls) or 5♦, let me continue tomorrow.... - Now, If South continue with Control Points Asking (CPA), s/he risks to go over 5♦, and for security reasons South will bid 5♦ Signoff, instead of 4NT CPA, but if s/he is curious, the answer after 4NT will be: 5♣ (1 King, because of B1) - 5♦ (relay for the King's suit) 6♣ (K of ♣) - 6♦ (Signoff on 6th level) - How you can see , there wasn't enough Bidding space for low level Honors to be checked, and if North doesn't have the J of ♣ (or at least the TEN of ♣), the chances for Slam are Zero. - Led approach the problem moving only by the curiousity: North - South Pass - 1♦ (B1+, 6+♦ or bi-color) 1♥ (B1+, Relay, I'm curious to see what bi-color you have) - 2♦ (6 card ♦ suit) 2♥ (Relay for the other 2 suits, that was a true surprise) - 2♠ (I have "S" suit, Surrounding the Basic ♦ suit by SCOR-SCOR Convention) 2NT (Relay for the longest suit excluding the Basic) - 3NT ( I have Void in the suit I didn't mention, i.e. Void ♠ 4♣ (Repeating the Relay for the longest suit excluding the Basic) - 4♥ (shape of 0463) 4♠ (Relay for Controls by CPA) - 5♣ (1 Ace, because of B1) 5♦ (where?, Relay for the Ace's suit) - 5NT ( A of ♦) 6♦ - How you can see, even moving only by the curiousity, for ForcePoit was impossible to find the Q of ♣, because of lack of Bidding space. - A computer will stop on 5♦, but Human...

I really can't believe this, never say never. There has been hands posted in the past where even with the highest precision possible we couldn't find it. Somewhere in the non-natural system forum there's posted such hand, I'd like to see if you can find slam on that one (something with a ♠ void and perfect fitting honours if I remember correctly). Are you talking for this hand ? AQxxx.... Kxxx AKxx......Qxxx Ax..........Qxx xx..........AK If your hand has a ♠ Void, find it, I coudn't. I don't see any ♠ void in your hand... So this is clearly not the one I was talking about. The hand you suggest is piece of cake for MOSCITO, and several other systems as well. However I couldn't find the exact one, but I remember nobody found it, even with the best slam systems available! - Yah, it is a piece of cake. But read the MarceldB's post above yours, there are 4 more pieces of cake, although the last one is very hard to be swallow ! - And if you find the hand you are talking about some day, let me show to you that it will be another piece of cake for ForcePoint, too. Untill then, I can not help you <_< But you may want to try this one on Moscito: ................... 6 ................... KT976 ................... QJT ................... 6543 AQ75 ........................... KJ832 8432 ............................ QJ5 753 .............................. 642 J9 ................................ Q7 ................... T94 ................... A ................... AK98 ................... AKT84 - The original contract is 4♣. The game is published in the last Desember 2004 ussue of ACBL Bridge Bulletin in the "Partnership Bridge" section with all comments and sugestions. Hope you will enjoy. - Forgot to tell you that Fp easy reached 6♣. Salute

- The first 3 games are easy for Bidding. The 4th one can freeze the blood of any Bidding Developer, but not my. I hope to find some time in 24 hours and respond to you with the Bidding and complete explanations, so you will find out how the ForcePoints works... Let's start with it: I presume the opps pass throughout the Bidding, and West is the Opener. I you need East to be the Dealer on some of the games, ask me to correct the Bidding) West has 10+7+6+10=33 pts, so his B#=33/4-2=B6, and he has 30 Control Points (CP) Еаst has 0+0+1+2=3 pts, so his B#=3/4-2=-1, i.e. his Base is Negative, and no CP The Play Level (PL) is the sum of both partners B# AKxx-------- xx AJxx--------- xx KQ----------- Jxxxxxx AKx---------- Qx Q♠ + Q♣ investigated, if yes J♦ too? West - East 1♣(B2+, any shape) - 1♠(Negative, the presumption is ALWAYS for B(-1) 2♣(B5+, Relay for the Basic suit, the Play Level PL = 5 for now) - 2♦(2 or 5+ card suit) 2♥(Relay for the other 2 suits) - 3NT(3 equal length suits, shape of 2272) 4♣(Relay for CP) - 4♦(Zero CP) 4♥(Relay for 03/14/2/2 Queen(s) in the longest suit suit + the J in the longest suit suit) - 4♠(no Q in the longest suit, but may have up to 3 Honors around it including the J in the longest suit) 4NT(Relay for the J in the longest suit along with the Q in the side suit) - 6♣(J in the longest suit + Q♣) 6♦ NOTE: after 2♥ Relay for the 2 other suits the answers by SCOR-SCOR one only Convention will be: 1st step = 2♠ will show the 2 equal or with close length "S" suits (Surrounding the Basic ♦ suit, i.e for ♣ and ♥ with 2 or 5 card ♦ suit 2nd step = 2NT will show the 2 equal or with close length "CO" suits (suits with equal color, excluding the color of the ♦ Basic suit, i.e for ♣ and ♠ with 2 or 5 card ♦ suit 3rd step = 3♣ will show the 2 equal or with close length "R" suits (the 2 suits with equal RANK, excluding the RANK of the Basic ♦ suit, i.e for ♠ and ♥ with 2 or 5 card ♦ suit 4th step = 3♦ will show the 2 equal or with close length "S" suits (Surrounding the Basic ♦ suit, i.e for ♣ and ♥ with 6 card ♦ suit 5th step = 3♥ will show the 2 equal or with close length "CO" suits (suits with equal color, excluding the color of the ♦ Basic suit, i.e for ♣ and ♠ with 6 card ♦ suit 6th step = 3♠ will show the 2 equal or with close length "R" suits (the 2 suits with equal RANK, excluding the RANK of the Basic ♦ suit, i.e for ♠ and ♥ with 6 card ♦ suit - 3NT always show shape of 2227 or 2272 (for the Minor Basic suits only) ! 7th step = 4♣ will show 2 by 2 card length in the "R" suits (the 2 suits with equal RANK, excluding the RANK of the Basic ♦ suit, i.e for ♠ and ♥ with 6 card ♦ suit and 4 cards in ♣ suit, i.e. 2274 shape 8th step = 4♦ will show 3 by 3 card length in the "R" suits (the 2 suits with equal RANK, excluding the RANK of the Basic ♦ suit, i.e for ♠ and ♥ with 6 card ♦ suit, i.e. 3370 shape 9th step = 4♥ will show 2 by 3 card length in the "R" suits (the 2 suits with equal RANK, excluding the RANK of the Basic ♦ suit, i.e for ♠ and ♥ with 6 card ♦ suit, i.e. 2371 shape 10th step = 4♠ will show 3 by 2 card length in the "R" suits (the 2 suits with equal RANK, excluding the RANK of the Basic ♦ suit, i.e for ♠ and ♥ with 6 card ♦ suit, i.e. 3271 shape - The above bids are presented for demonstration of the SCOR-SCOR OneOnly Convention, which ForcePoint uses for all distribution (and Control) needs Note: after 4NT the steps answer will be: 5♣ = no J in the longest suit, but 3 Honors around it 5♦ = J in the longest suit , but no Q in the side suit 5♥ = J in the longest suit + Q♥ 5♠ = J in the longest suit + Q♠ 5NT = J in the longest suit + up to 2 more Honors around it 6♣ = (J in the longest suit + Q♣) - How you can see, although the SCOR-SCOR mechnism is ALWAYS the same, the ForcePoint's Bidding is for computers and Experts (of course, anyone can learn it as well) ********************* Let's start with the rest of the games: 3 ------------ AKQJ96 AK98753---- Q6 - ------------ T972 AJ743------- Q 7♠? West has 3+10+5+7=25 pts. His B#=25/4-2=B4 East has 15+2-2+3=18 pts. His B#=18/4-2=B2 The PlayLevel is B4+B2= PL 6, and because of the Super FIT, it will go to 7 West - East 2NT(B3+, bi-color with Void+Singleton) - 3♣(Relay for the Singleton's suit, the PL is 5 for now) 3♠(Singleton ♠) - 4♣(Relay for the bi-color suits by SCOR-SCOR. The PL is 4 for now, because of the Adjustment for King opposite a Singleton in ♠ suit. NOTE: 3NT ALWAYS will be Signoff ! ) 4♦(it is "S" bi-color, i.e. Surrounding the previously bid suit of♠, i.e. ♣♥ bi-color) - 4♥(Relay for 7 card suit) 4NT(it is ♥ suit) - 5♣(Relay for Control Points (CP), the PL is 5 now, because of the ♥ Super Fit) 5♠(16 CP. NOTE: The 1st step is for the value of 3 Kings, because of B3 of the opener = 12 CP) - 5NT(Reley for the King's suit. The PL is 6 now, because West easy can find and correct his partner's B#. The pts are 3 (for the Singleton) + 5 (for the Void) + 16 (CP) = 24. B# = 24/4-2 = B4 ) 6♥(King of ♥ - ? (Pass, 6♠, 7♥ or 7♠? That simply your choice, you have PL 6 and 35 CP. ForcePoint explicitly shows to you that you are short of 1 CP (you have only 9 CP for the Void in ♦ suit, not 6+4=10 CP for the real Controls, and your ♥ PL = 6. And you need both requirements to be fulfilled (PL & and 36+ CP) to go for Grand Slam ! Let's count the PL for ♠ suit: - By all you know for your partner he has 3+10+5+6=24 pts, so his Base number = B4. You have B2. The PL in ♠ suit is: 4+2-1(for Trump Misfit)+1(for 2nd Fit in ♥)= 6. You do not have the right (by Fp's Rules) to play 7♠ at all (how you can see by the actual diagram, you risked to be Trumped in ♥ right away on the attack). The computer will bid Pass and will play 6♥, but even an Expert Player may ignore the ForcePoint's precautionary ban. If you ask me personally, I can choose to bid Pass or to bid 6♠, but NEVER 7. NOTE: On 6th level there are no Relays by ForcePoint's Rules, so any bid by the Quest is absolute Signoff ! ************** Axx--------- xx Axx--------- xxx AKQx------- xx xxx--------- AKQxxx J♦ investigated? If yes 5NT still playable? West has 6+6+12-2=22 pts. His B#=22/4-2=B3, and although there are enough Controls for CPC (Control Points Correction) which can eveluate the B# to B4, there are not all requirements fulfilled. East has 0-2+0+12=10 pts. His B#=10/4-2=B1, because of CPC (Control Points Correction). NOTE: Do not ask me for the CPC, it is an inner circle's information only ! The PlayLevel is B3+B1= PL 4, and because of the Super FIT, it will go to 5 West - East 1♣(B2+, any shape) - 1♦(waiting, B(0)+, any shape) 1NT (B3, any shape) - 1NT (PL 4 for now, 1 Round Forcing, Relay because East can not make a free bid with 6+ suit. NOTE: Without 6+ card suit and B(0) he will be obligated to show his 2 (if no 5 card suit) or 5 card suit) 3♦(absolute balance shape of 3343) - 3NT (ALWAYS an absolute Signoff. PL = 5, so it is meaningless to ask for any CP) NOTE: Suppose that J of ♦ was in Weas hand. His pts will raise from 22 to 25 ( 1 pt for the J + 2 pts for the Master Sequence in ♦, so his B# will be B4, not B3, and the PL will go to 6. Let's make the Bidding in this condition: 1♣(B2+, any shape) - 1♦(waiting, B(0)+, any shape) 1♠(B4, any shape) - 1NT(1 Round Forcing, Relay because East can not make a free bid with 6+ suit. NOTE: Normally, without 6 card suit and B(0) he will be obligated to show his 2 or 5 card suit) 3♦(absolute balance shape of 3343) - 3♥(CPA, it is late for free bid, and I saw the ♣ Super Fit, the PL = B4+B1+ SupFit = 6. NOTE: CPA = ControlPoints Asking) 4♦(22 CP, obviously 3 Aces+1 King). NOTE: The 1st step will be for the value of 4 Kings, because of B4, i.e. for 16 CP, and every next step add 2 CP - 4♥(Relay for the King's suit) 5♦(King of ♦ - 5♥(Relay for the Q in the longest suit) 5NT(1/4 = Q of ♦ or up to 4 other low level Honors including the J of ♦ - 6NT (PL 6, CP = 32). NOTE: On 6th level there are no Relays by ForcePoint's Rules, so any bid by the Quest is absolute Signoff ! ***************** - Let's finish your games: Axx--------- xxx Axxx-------- xx AKJx-------- Qxxxxx Ax----------- xxx Do you know the 6th♦ for 3NT? If yes the Q♦ too? West has 6+6+11+6=29 pts. His B#=29/4-2=B5 East has -2+0+2-2=-2 pts. His B#=-2/4-2=B(-2), but the partner will be aware only of B(-1) by Fp Rules. The real Play Level (PL) = B5-B2 = PL 3 West - East 1♣ (B2+, any shape) - 1♠ (Negative Base, B(-1) or less) 1NT (Relay for Basic suit, the PL = 4 for now) - 2♦ (2 or 5+ card suit, length's priority) 2♥ (Relay for the other 2 suits) - 3♥ (red or black, color "CO" suits, excluding the color of the Basic suit, with 6 card ♦ suit) by SCOR-SCOR Convention) 3NT (The PL = 5, because of the ♦ Super Fit, or less if my partner's B# is below B(-1). I have 26 CP, and my partner ststistically with B(-1) or less will have Zero Controls. So, I can relay on 9 tricks) - The answer to your question is: No, I do not even need to know if my partner has the Q of ♦, because I do not have PL of 6 or more for Slam, nor I can I collect 30 CP. ForcePoint won't ask for Controls or low level Honors if the requirements for Slam are not fulfilled. - I think, Marsel, you may be satisfied on all 4 games by my answers. Thx for your concern.

- You do not need to read enyting else for ForcePoint except the first 2 Chapters and implement them to your own system. This is less then 2 pages. But I have an exceptional Control Points Asking (CPA), which you maybe will miss. The system's bids are for the computers and Experts, which want to put the Blue Team in their pocket, so most of us won't need them, because we will not be able to find enough money for such invitation, and how you maybe probably suspect already, no one will invite other to be beat by him. - So, my only chance is to go against GIB and JACK, if somebody decide to finish my source code. Zaro probably can do that, he is an exellent programmer, and some day ForcePoint may elope to ZAR. Only then the Zar ForcePoint's Team of 6 Experts will have the necessary invitation's money ;). Uday and Fred or GIB can do that also, so BBO ForcePoint or GIB ForcePoint are not excluded. Only JACK won't be able to do anything (I mean to keep the 1st place on the World Bridge Computer Championship). Watch the Vugraph.

- First of all, let me remind you that I have said: "You will Never miss a Slam". So, I didn't said: "Never miss a Grand Slam". If opps open or overcall with 3NT or above, it is possible, although unlikely ForcePoint to miss a Grand Slam. After this reminder, I can start: 1. Let's North open 4♦ and then overcall West's Double (X) with 5♣. With opening or overcalling on lower levels all be easier. - The X on 2nd level or up ALWAYS asks for Control Points (CP), and the steps answers ALWAYS start from 3 or 4 CP or nothing (1 Singleton or 1 King or nothing). The 2nd step will show 5 or 6 CP (1 Void or 1 Ace ), the 3rd step will show 8 CP (2 Kings), the 4th step = 10 CP (1 Ace + 1 King) and so on... - The Abbr will be: B# for Base number, CP for Control Points, S for Singleton, V for Void, X for Double - By Fp Counting : North has 6+6+2+8=22 pts (22/4-2=3, Base number of 3) East has -2-2+0+5=1 pt (1/4-2=-2, Base number of -2, i.e. B(-2) South has -2-2+5-2=-1 pt (-1/4-2=-2, i.e B(-2) West has 15+15+10+5=45 pts (45/4=1=9, i.e. B9) - The Bidding will be: North - East - South - West 4♦ - pass (B2 or less) - pass - X (Relay for CP with B5+) 5♣ - X (1 Void or 1 Ace) - pass - 5♦(Relay for the Basic suit) pass - 6♥(bi-color ♥♠) - pass - 7♠ NOTE: If the East's hand had a shape of any 4432 it is possible ForcePoint to be unable to find a Grand Slam. But if North open below 3NT or didn't bid 5♣, there won't be a problem to reach any Slam. Also you maybe already mentioned that the B# of the ForcePoint's overcallers must be at least 1 less that the Level of the Opening to bid someting different than Pass, and it must be at least 1 more than the Level of the Opening (but not less than B5+) to bid X for the Control Points Asking (CPA)

You are a liar. No bidding method never misses a slam--even "Bid a slam on every hand" will sometimes fail by getting you to the wrong slam! Thank you Do you want to try this one with ForcePoint (the opps are pass thrughout the Bidding): Axx AKQJxx Axx AJx xxx xx xxx KQxxx And for your information I will tell you that the ForcePoint's bids are ALWAYS strictly synonimous, so you can be sure that I won't be able to improvise. ForcePoint's Slams can fail in one condition: if you do not know the system.

I really can't believe this, never say never. There has been hands posted in the past where even with the highest precision possible we couldn't find it. Somewhere in the non-natural system forum there's posted such hand, I'd like to see if you can find slam on that one (something with a ♠ void and perfect fitting honours if I remember correctly). Are you talking for this hand ? AQxxx.... Kxxx AKxx......Qxxx Ax..........Qxx xx..........AK If your hand has a ♠ Void, find it, I coudn't.

C-SAYC web page - You can find all information for the Counted SAYC (C-SAYC) using the link above. Also you can find the Counting alone here in the Forum/ Expert section / "A new system. Do you need it?" The Counting's explanation is in the first 2 Chapters of the Topic. You can use it with any system to evaluate your Contracts' assurance. Of course, you may continue to use the same system bids and Conventions you like. The counting alone is very simple and may only help you.

- I will answer to you although I think that there is no big sense in the bare advertising. You have to try the horse, before you buy it 1. You do not need to evaluate your hand, it is automatically done with simply aritmethical aproximation 2. ForcePoint uses whole Honor's numbers 3. Anyone can use the bare Counting and implement it to own system 4. If you decide to use the original ForcePoint's bids, you will discover your partner's EXACT shape below 4♣ with its dynamic OneOnly Convention for all your distributions and Control's needs 5. The system doesn't need additional Conventions, it uses only one 6. It has highly aggresive opening bids for the Majors suits 7. You will NEVER miss a Slam 8. The original Control Points Asking (CPA) will permit you to discover your partner's number and kind of Controls simultaneously with OneOnly Question. 9. You will have enough Bidding space to discover not only the Control's suits, but even the Queens + the Jack in the longest partner's suit (if you need that) 10. The system accuracy is over 83% for the billions of hands distributions (but you have to check at least 0.000001% of them to believe me) - So, any Beginer will immediately evaluate his/her Bidding to the Expert's level, despite the unability to play good (but that's another question, Augustin Madala has played perfectly even before 16, some players like me continue to try it even over 55)

Yes, this gives a 5/3/1 system of distribution which I advocated for some time on this forum. I have no idea why Pavell doesn't value doubletons at all. Error = (frequency)*(real-predicted)^2 where frequency is the whole number percent of that hand pattern occurring. 4333 is 10.54, 4432 is 21.55, etc. Tysen - I will tell you why I do not want to evaluate the Doubletons. I went all this way, which TSP use. The Doubletons are tricky. You can have AK, AJ, Ax, Qx, Jx, QJ, xx and so on... and have to pay an additional attention to the possible bad suit's comunication. If you are willing to pay a separate attention to each of them, you probably will have better results, but I found it too borring. I simply didn't want to overload the regular players with this additional evaluation. 4 or 5 pts Base is enough wide to swalow the Doubleton's evaluations. The only thing I'm applying to ForcePoint for hand with Void, Singleton or Doubleton is when the reminder of the division's result is 2. For such hands I simply approximate the division resuilt up for the upper B# (I'm doing it also if no pseudo suits appear at all, but only if I have "enough" Control Points (CP) with conjunction with my particular B#. What is "enough" is not published here, and may be discussed only privately). That's my opinion, you are free to disaggree and correct it

Any chance that you would be willing to implement this as a web based application? I don't install random executables on my PCs and I STRONGLY recommend that others adopt similar policies - You can find all on http://bullbridge.com alond with a ForcePoint's Demo instalation program, which will do all the Counting for you. Sorry, no auto Bidding yet (if you use the "autoBid" button, it will supply wrong bids), and be aware that all hands are face up.

Nice score by pavell. - Thank you. And you can add that ForcePoint use ONLY whole Honors numbers, which is easier than the other Countings by the above chart. Also you DON'T need to make any evaluation of your hand, because it is already automaticaly included by the approximation of the division result (when you divide your Total pts by 4 and subtract 2 to find your B#). All this combined, along with the aggresive openings (sometimes even more aggresive than ZAR's) assure a competitive, but very easy Counting even for Beginers. If you use the elementary Adjustments (for Super Fit, Misfit and for Void/Singleton opposite 6 or 7 card suits), you can find your Play Level (PL) with over 83% warranty for all of the billions card distributions. - The simplicity without loosing the accuracy was the MAIN GOAL for this this system. You will tell if I succeded to achieve it.

- You have to do it 1 more time (I'm sorry, I forgot to add the vital information for the Negative (N) pts. It is already done. And do not forger, that I greatly prefer to sacrifice some explicity by using the whole numbers Honor's Counting, instead to make Human players crazy and very :) !!!

Sure you are. You're taking a point total, and dividing by 4. You end up not only with half tricks, but with quarter tricks. You can arbitrarily declare that a 3/4 of a trick is a full trick, but that's still dealing with them. I didn't do anything fancy- you add up all your numbers and then divide by four, I just divided by four first. That made the numbers equal to tricks, and therefore (for me) easier to understand. Let me challenge you on two things, and have you refute them. That might get the ball rolling: You claim that a singleton ace is worth 9 points, or the full value of the ace plus the full value of the singleton. You claim that a singleton king is worth 3 points, or only the full value of the singleton. This is very different from most methods. Most consider A singleton to be worth 2 tricks- 1.5 for the A, only .5 for the singleton, because the ace isn't helping lower cards. The King is worth 1.5 tricks- the singleton king may help your partner take tricks, and may win a trick on defense. In contrast, in Midmac a singleton generally ends up worth 2 more than a doubleton (they count shortness and length, and it adds one to both sides). A singleton king subtracts one point. from a normal king. A singleton ace ends up being worth about 6, a singleton king about 4. So, in your system, a singleton A is worth three times as much as a singleton king. In MIDMAC and most other counting systems, the difference is half that: a singleton ace is worth 1 1/2 times as much as a singleton king. That's a heck of a big difference. Can you explain, mathematically or otherwise, the reason for this disparity? I'm trying to compare your system to Zars, which is tough because you use 4 points per trick, he uses 5. However, it appears the biggest difference is that you value HCP a great deal more than he does- he tends to evaluate distribution stronger. You're both using 6421, but you're dividing by 4, and he's dividing by 5. Have you read the math on Zar points? What do you think are its biggest flaws? http://www.bridgeguys.com/pdf/ZarPoints2003.pdf - We are friends with Zaro. It was a pleasant surprize when we have discovered each other 1-2 years ago with almost equal Countings. I have tried his 5 pts step and I have 5-6 versions of Demos on my http:/bullbridge.com site with 5 step for a trick Counting. They proved to me that the simple Counting method I'm using (read for the later added Negative pts, I forgot to mention them in the 1st post's issue, sorry about that) is enough stable. I do not know why a Counting difference for the Singleton Controls occured. The Double Dummy's checking showed me that. I'm still unaware of MIDMAC (recently I didn't find time to go there after your reply, but I'll do that in the future). By the way, those ForcePoint Singleton's Countings immediately become unstable with 5 pts step for a trick. I have tried to find their whole numbers value, but it proved to be impossible (I'm against the overloading even with the use of 0.5 values). You told me that I'm using even 0.25 value when I divide by 4 and have a reminder, but that's not really true, because Im watching ONLY if I'm inside the Base's range, approximating the division result without remembering the part values for future use. This is easier than the counting of the part's values, and you can do it absolutely mechanically. You say we both, I and ZAR, use 6421 Counting for the Honor's value, that's right, but if I didn't make a mistake, I think, 2 year ago, before we met, ZAR didn't count the Control's value, and I was pleased recently when I visited his page (I remember he had tried to evaluate the hands by some other very difficult, by my opinion, methods, I even do not want to remember them. - Now, about the difference between ForcePoint sytem and ZAR "system". ZAR doesn't have a system at all, at least for now, because he doesn't have any Bidding (recently he tryed to make something in this dirrection). When I publish Chapter 3, you will be able to check the original ForcePoint's Bidding, if still interested (you can find it in separate GUI programs, if you download the free Demo, simply start the file "Sysnotes.exe"). But do not forget, it is for computers and Experts, although the regular players can use it, too. It is very easy for the Answerer, because s/he bid what s/he see, but require a great concentration by the partner, who has to imagine the EXACT Answerer's shape. The other systems work with partially shape's explanatons, ForcePoint doesn't, that's why with it, you would refuse to bid a Slam (or NEVER will miss one). It is not easy to explayn everithing to you, you have to try it... Download the free Demo, it will do all the Counting for you (there is not an "auto" ForcePoint Bidding, enter your bids manually, using your own system and compare your shoosen Play Level (PL) with the PL which Fp will suggest to you by adding the both partners B# and using some Adjustments, if necessary. All of it is on the http://bullbridge.com

Dont leave pls B) You just have to understand that many can say thier system is the best, by saying that you dont add anything to how i see your system. You can be just a kid who think he invented the world and no one else know anything, i dont know you. I'm 55 and have made the Bidding of ForcePoint for 12 of the last 15 years

Dont leave pls B) You just have to understand that many can say thier system is the best, by saying that you dont add anything to how i see your system. You can be just a kid who think he invented the world and no one else know anything, i dont know you. - It is not necessary to know me, simply try the Counting for now, with all hands face up (you can download such a Demo from my site), despite what system you use. Or forget about me, it is OK, too.

- Probably you will be right if you read only first 2 Chapters. Wait to post the next two Chapters, and the difference between the Hand Evaluation System and the ForcePoint Bidding will appear. Then you will see how to discover your patrtner's EXACT shape below 4♣ (you will do that dynamically, almost not using static bids, even after opps preemtive overcalls), and how to discover your partner's Controls with One Only question, all that leaving more than enough Bidding space for discovering their suits, along with the Queens and the Jack in the longer partner's suit (of course, if you need that information). First two Chapters alone (although they are included in all versions of ForcePoint), are for players who want to streighten their assurance for the final contract's Level, using their bidding system. The original Fp bidding will start with Chapter 3. That will be enough for everyone to understand why this system differ from all other systems.

I think you are now ready to open a web site and flood some forums with it too. :P - Thank you. I did it 3 years ago, immediately after the 12 years that I have spent to create this system. But I think that a Forum there won't be useful. You can not argue competently before you try it, and when you try it, you will not want to argue anymore. :D Its just too hard for me to understand ppl like you who have this huge confident that they know the best, are you a world class player ? - I'm not a famous Player, I'm a theorist. Probably you know who was Goren and what he did for the bridge world ? But do you know his players qualification ? I'll leave you to discover it alone :P

- Obviously you didn't understand the main advantage of this Counting: You will NEVER need anymore properly/ improperly to evaluate your hand :P

- Of course, you need also a Bidding mechanism, not to mention the Playing, which is ALWAYS your own responsibility :P .

- Obviously you do not like even the simple aritmethic. Even for the points count judgment you are totaly right ! But, there is one BUT, only when you do not use with/ or do not have appropriate opening and responding bids. Nor Zar, nor Milton, nor Bergen, nor even your Binky Points suggest the appropriate bidding, that why I told you, you are right. I won't suggest to you to try again, but someone will do that for sure. Your advice looks like the old senturies religious suppressions on the forbiden books :blink: . Very interesting.

I think you are now ready to open a web site and flood some forums with it too. :blink: - Thank you. I did it 3 years ago, immediately after the 12 years that I have spent to create this system. But I think that a Forum there won't be useful. You can not argue competently before you try it, and when you try it, you will not want to argue anymore. :blink:

- Thank you. After your post I took care of that, but you can find it all on my front page http://bullbridge.com :blink:

- Probably you are not. But I'm not working with 0.5 tricks, nor you can bid 3.5 ♥. :blink: