No, I hadn't missed the discussion, it's just that I can't think of much to contribute. I did some calculations that are accurate if BBO Archives and Excel are to be believed, and drew a couple of conclusions from the results. Nothing in this thread makes me want to back off from those conclusions, although I will admit that there are some points made here that I simply don't understand. The analysis that I did is fairly important to me, because there are probably people in the world who are thinking: "Fantoni and Nunes are such great bridge players: think of what they could achieve if they played a normal system!" I am totally convinced that their system is one of the reasons for their greatness, rather than something that holds them back. Most of that belief stems from my own experiences with the system, for which I kept substantial statistical records that I chose not to publish in the book, although they can be found elsewhere on the internet if you are a REALLY good searcher :) Cheers ... Bill