Chamaco Posted September 7, 2005 Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 Hi all, in the book "For experts only", edited by the Granovetters, there is a chapter by Kokish about "rediscovering 1NT forcing". One of the issues he addresses is how responder could be able to bid (discriminate) weak and goodish hands. He suggests the use of some specific sequences, which at first sight might seem unnatural, but that after some thinking I was able to remember under the "lebensohl" heading.The first "free" suit at the 2 level except a preference to opener's major, would be Lebensohl, forcing a puppet to next suit, followed by pass/correct. There are a few sequences (when opener openes 1S and rebid H or S) when no "Lebensohl" is available, as 2NT is the only step.It is conceivable, IMO, to use 2NT as Leb even in that case, since when we do have a balanced invite, we can play 3M in a 6-2 fit Some examples 1S:1NT:2C....-2D "Leb"= Puppet to 2H, then P/C....-2H= normal....-2S= 8-10 with doubleton spades (weak 3 card raise would go via 2D"Leb")....-2NT = natural invite....-3x = natural invite (the weak hand would go via leb) 1S:1NT:2D....-2H "Leb"= Puppet to 2S, then P/C....-2S= 8-10 with doubleton spades (weak 3 card raise would go via 2H"Leb")....-2NT = natural invite....-3x = natural invite (the weak hand would go via leb) ------------------------------------- It seems to me that this fits well in the 2/1 version whenre 2/1 is absolute GF, since it becomes easier to show unambiguously the invitational 1-suiter without bidding a 2/1. I'd like feedback from anyone ! :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted September 7, 2005 Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 This seems to have some virtue, as long as you don't play Gazilla or Riton 2♣, where you can simply bid your suit, saving 2nt for relay. But then, of course, 2♦ would be weak, so 3♣ by responder or 2♥ by responder probalby would end the auction anyway. My solution, is quite different. I use 2♣ response for BALANCE hands (or fit, or true 2/1 GF). The implication of this is 1NT followed by 2NT is lebehnshol to get out in despirately wek suit (or vise versa depending upon your preference). I also use direct jump over 1M (other than 2♠ over 1♥) as invitational but not forcing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chamaco Posted September 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 This seems to have some virtue, as long as you don't play Gazilla or Riton 2♣, where you can simply bid your suit, saving 2nt for relay. I am planning to play it in a strong club context, where "Gazzilli" (not Gazilla ! :) ) or "Riton" would make less sense :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted September 7, 2005 Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 Hum.. I don't think I like this Kokish gadget. It doesn't let you stop in 2H in 1S-1N-2D and doesn't solve responder's problems when he has 10-11 and 5 hearts. Maybe other methods are better. Can you enlighten me on those godzilla.. err.. gazzilli :) 2♣? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chamaco Posted September 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 Hum.. I don't think I like this Kokish gadget. It doesn't let you stop in 2H in 1S-1N-2D and doesn't solve responder's problems when he has 10-11 and 5 hearts. Maybe other methods are better. Can you enlighten me on those godzilla.. err.. gazzilli :) 2♣? Nuno, you can find some description at:http://forums.bridgebase.com/index.php?showtopic=7444 Also, you can find at Dan Neill's system page a writeup in italian, as well as a description into the system "Ambra". :-) BTW, Gazzilli was the name of a player from Milan :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted September 7, 2005 Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 Ok, I had a look at it. Gazzilli from milan seems better than Kokish from canada :) I might adopt parts of it at some stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted September 7, 2005 Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 My quick thought: has advantages over a 2C rebid, not so much a 2D rebid. Also keep in my that 1S-3H can be used as a natural invitational bid. Winston Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted September 8, 2005 Report Share Posted September 8, 2005 I like the idea, but don't you have 2 ways to show weak hand with ♥ after 2♣? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred Posted September 8, 2005 Report Share Posted September 8, 2005 I like the idea, but don't you have 2 ways to show weak hand with ♥ after 2♣? No. After: 1S 1NT2C 2D is artificial and shows 5+ hearts2H is an artificial relay to 2S I hope my buddy Kokish gave me some credit in his article since I was the one (along with George Mittelman who was my partner at the time) who developed most of this system :) Fred GitelmanBridge Base Inc.www.bridgebase.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted September 8, 2005 Report Share Posted September 8, 2005 fred, could you post the complete structure (with followups) sometimes when you have a chance? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chamaco Posted September 8, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 8, 2005 I hope my buddy Kokish gave me some credit in his article since I was the one (along with George Mittelman who was my partner at the time) who developed most of this system :) Fred GitelmanBridge Base Inc.www.bridgebase.com Uh-oh...I guess someone should change the name of the thread :-) (BTW, I don't have the article here, I'll check during the weekend if Kokish gave credit to you and Mittelman) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred Posted September 10, 2005 Report Share Posted September 10, 2005 fred, could you post the complete structure (with followups) sometimes when you have a chance? Thanks. I made a Full Disclosure file containing description of how the system works after a 1S opening. 1H is also interesting. I will make a file for that available when I get a chance. In order to open the file you much have Full Disclosure installed on your PC. The following link will take you to a recent post (as of Sept 9, 2005) where you can download and install this free program. If you have a version earlier than 1.0.5, I suggest you get the latest. Click here for Full Disclosure post! Once you have FD installed, the following link can be used to download the file with the system description: Click here to download a description of the convention! Fred GitelmanBridge Base Inc.www.bridgebase.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted September 10, 2005 Report Share Posted September 10, 2005 sweet, thx. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted September 10, 2005 Report Share Posted September 10, 2005 Fred, I have a complaint about FullDisc :) I downloaded version 1.0.3 and it doesn't let me make 'enter' in the description of a bid (closes window). That's bad because I wanted to make 3 separate lines for 3 meanings of a bid and couldn't :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted September 10, 2005 Report Share Posted September 10, 2005 Fred, I have a complaint about FullDisc :) I downloaded version 1.0.3 and it doesn't let me make 'enter' in the description of a bid (closes window). That's bad because I wanted to make 3 separate lines for 3 meanings of a bid and couldn't :) Oh Whereagles, for heavens sake, try Ctrl+Enter as in most pc applications. (edited by rain) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted September 10, 2005 Report Share Posted September 10, 2005 hoggie, I make my own conventions. (edited by rain) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted September 10, 2005 Report Share Posted September 10, 2005 hoggie, I make my own conventions. I don't use Ron Klinger's one's (like you... lol). It shows in your answers. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted September 10, 2005 Report Share Posted September 10, 2005 (deleted by rain Can we keep things civil please?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred Posted September 10, 2005 Report Share Posted September 10, 2005 Fred, I have a complaint about FullDisc :) I downloaded version 1.0.3 and it doesn't let me make 'enter' in the description of a bid (closes window). That's bad because I wanted to make 3 separate lines for 3 meanings of a bid and couldn't ;) Oh Whereagles, for heavens sake, try Ctrl+Enter as in most pc applications. Your pc knowledge seems equivalent to your knowledge of Bridge conventions. :) Unfortunately I suspect that for every Windows user who knows about Control-Enter, there are 100 who do not. As such, it might be better to make the Enter key create a new line in the description area and enable things like Alt-O for people who want a keyboard shortcut for the OK button. If there is a good answer to this problem I has escaped me! Fred GitelmanBridge Base Inc.www.bridgebase.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted September 10, 2005 Report Share Posted September 10, 2005 > Can we keep things civil please? Yeah, sorry. I got carried away by a childish provocation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted September 10, 2005 Report Share Posted September 10, 2005 Fred: freeing up the enter key would be most helpful, yes. By they way, FullDisc is a great program (albeit I found it a bit unintuitive at the beginning). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLOGIC Posted September 6, 2012 Report Share Posted September 6, 2012 nice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 niceYou couldn't wait a few more days for an even seven years? The impatience of youth :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nige1 Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 Uh-oh... I guess someone should change the name of the thread :-) And change the forum -- unless, in 2/1, artificiality is natural :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMoe Posted September 8, 2012 Report Share Posted September 8, 2012 I made a Full Disclosure file containing description of how the system works after a 1S opening. 1H is also interesting. I will make a file for that available when I get a chance. In order to open the file you much have Full Disclosure installed on your PC. The following link will take you to a recent post (as of Sept 9, 2005) where you can download and install this free program. If you have a version earlier than 1.0.5, I suggest you get the latest. Click here for Full Disclosure post! Once you have FD installed, the following link can be used to download the file with the system description: Click here to download a description of the convention! Fred GitelmanBridge Base Inc.www.bridgebase.com Fred, The link above for Full Disclosure 1.0.5 gets me to a BBO error page.Is there a corrupt link here? Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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