to balance or not to balance

[sceptic]

[hv=d=e&v=n&n=skqt3h82d852caj85&w=sj85hkq3dkt9ct964&e=sa4hajt94dq643c73&s=s9762h765daj7ckq2]399|300|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

 

West North East South

 

 -     -     Pass  Pass

 1♣    Pass  1♥    Pass

 Pass  Pass  

[Walddk]

Definitely. 1♠ is clearcut. It is rarely right to let the opponents play in a suit contract at the 1-level. If they want to declare, they've got to bit more than this.

 

But 1♠ shows 5, doesn't it, you may argue. It does indeed, unless you don't have 5!

 

Roland

[Blofeld]

In the passout seat, and after you passed 1♣ I can't think that 1♠ promises 5.

[awm]

I would also balance, but I'm not convinced that 1♠ is a better call than double. It's pretty easy to construct hands for partner where he has only doubleton spade and you would be better off to play in another strain. Unfortunately, when you balance in 1♠ and partner has a fit for you, opponents usually compete another level -- whereas when partner has only doubleton opponents have a strange tendency to sell out and let you play 1♠ for minus 200 or 300 at vuln.

[coyot]

I would not worry about balancing with 1♠ here.

 

First, partner is not blind. He has seen me passing 1♣ - and I will NOT balance with a 5card that was not worth an one level overcall, so this is 99% 4card.

 

Second, I have a nice hand. If opps have 23 HCP, I don't fear going -200 or -300 any often. My clubs look good, my spades look good. Unless my partner happens to have totally useless cards, I assume that 6 tricks shouldn't be so hard to achieve.

[luke warm]

i would have overcalled 1s the first time... good preemptive value, good suit (lead directing, just in case partner leads)... yes, as roland says it does show 5 cards except when it doesn't

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

1S is ok, of course you could have made

the bid the round before.

 

Marlowe

[joker_gib]

Dbl is OK (I prefer than 1♠)

 

Alain

[TheoKole]

Definitely 1♠

 

Mike Lawrence has a book out on Overcalls which says an expert trick is to overcall on a GOOD 4 card suit with an opening bid when your hand is not suitable for a take-out double.

 

This just takes it a step further of balancing on a GOOD 4 card suit in the pass-out seat with a 10 pointer. You will not go higher than 2 spades, and even if they compete, and can push them out of their comfort zone (you have spades). :-)

 

Notice that you want a spade lead on any contract that they buy (the 10♠ makes a BIG difference in the quality of the suit).

 

If you pass these types of hands you will lose a lot of part-score battles.

 

Cheers :)

[helene_t]

It's IMPs, you're vulnerable. Partner could have doubled with 4-4 ♠♦ so the probability of a fit is not that great. It might be right to ballance but I think it's close. I would probably pass.

[Al_U_Card]

Since they don't have a fit (yet), maybe we don't either.......I prefer a double to reopen as pard will bid 1S with 3 (not so bad) or 1NT with H stops or 2D with 4 or 5, all of which are much nicer in case of spade shortage in his hand (he should know that you only have 4, which the dbl also pretty much guarantees).

[Limey_p]

eek! East passes a clear opening bid; West opens on pond scum. Well this isn't the expert forum. :P

 

I would pass as north the first round but reopen with 1S.

 

If E-W bid sanely, north will likely be silent after:

 

(1H) p (2H) ?

 

Takeout double here at imps, unfavorable? I don't think I could do that. Now it is up to south to act (which I consider aggressive but normal)

 

 

A

[MickyB]

He has seen me passing 1♣ - and I will NOT balance with a 5card that was not worth an one level overcall, so this is 99% 4card.

I would - in fact I can't imagine passing on this sequence holding xxxxx in spades and a few outside values.

[coyot]

With the knowledge that my p does not have an opener, I will reopen only if the risk of going -2 is not any great.

My point was that partner cannot EXPECT a 5card.

 

How do you mean "few outside values"?

 

If I happen to have AQxxx in spades, I don't need much more to overcall 1♣ against a passed partner... If I happen to have xxxxx in spades, I need 8 good HCP to stick my neck out in VUL against a passed hand. But in either case, the bidding so far tells me that my 1♠ bid will most likely push opps to 2nd level (and tell partner which suit to lead) - and if not, I'm ready to go down 1.

[Winstonm]

It seems obvious that West has opened a hand he considers sub-standard to protect a possible partscore - the pass of 1 heart says nothing about whether there is a fit but only that he does not want to encourage game or even a game try from his partner.

 

This could still easily be our hand and the only way to protect that position is to balance - there is no earthly way you will ever balance them back into game on this auction. Of the options, I prefer double, as this should be a weak takeout double of hearts, hence showing a least tolerance for clubs. If partner has a 5 card club suit I would prefer we compete in that suit as opposed to the possible 4/3 spade fit and it would be easier for partner to compete further after this action in either clubs or spades - 1S will usually push the opponents to a higher contract, but it somewhat puts all our eggs in one suit and leaves us without no good recourse without a spade fit should the opponents continue to 2H.

 

Winston

[Walddk]

It seems obvious that West has opened a hand he considers sub-standard to protect a possible partscore - the pass of 1 heart says nothing about whether there is a fit

I don't agree. Facing a passed partner, opener's pass should always show exactly 3-card support. With 4 he should support, and with less he must bid something else. It's a crime to pass with a doubleton, hence often violating Burn's excellent Law of Total Trumps.

 

Roland

[Winstonm]

It seems obvious that West has opened a hand he considers sub-standard to protect a possible partscore - the pass of 1 heart says nothing about whether there is a fit

I don't agree. Facing a passed partner, opener's pass should always show exactly 3-card support. With 4 he should support, and with less he must bid something else. It's a crime to pass with a doubleton, hence often violating Burn's excellent Law of Total Trumps.

 

Roland

You are right - I misspoke. The pass here shows a heart fit - what I meant to imply is that some play that this bid does not say anything about whether it is 3 or 4 card support, only that the hand is not interested in moving past 2H and feels it best not to encourage partner to make any sort of game try.

 

Winston