Winstonm Posted July 30, 2005 Report Share Posted July 30, 2005 [hv=d=s&v=n&n=s4ha1075dj764c10986&s=sk76hkj432dak9caq]133|200|Scoring: IMPBidding with East and West Passing throughout: S N2N 3C3H 4H The opening lead is the 3 of diamonds. You guess to play the 6 from dummy, East covers with the 10, and you win the Ace. Over to you. How do you play the heart suit?(Advanced may want to use hidden text.)[/hv] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceptic Posted July 30, 2005 Report Share Posted July 30, 2005 I would play AK first for 2-2 split straight away, if it split 3-1 or 4- 0 you still only lose 1 trx in trumps, then lead 9 diamonds ( at first opportunity) to take out wests Q diamonds and you make tha contract Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
temp3600 Posted July 30, 2005 Report Share Posted July 30, 2005 If you want to tackle the heart suit first, then small to the ace and small back to the jack seems best. You pick up Q third with East or endplay West when he has Qx. But i think small heart to the A followed by a spade towards the king is better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted July 30, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2005 I would play AK first for 2-2 split straight away, if it split 3-1 or 4- 0 you still only lose 1 trx in trumps, then lead 9 diamonds ( at first opportunity) to take out wests Q diamonds and you make tha contractSuppose you play as you say: A, K of hearts, and the hearts don't break. Now you lead either the A or the 9 of diamonds and either opponent wins...you can't get back to dummy right away. West wins the diamond, leads a spade to his partner's Ace, and now a club comes back....oops. If the club finesse loses, you have just gone down in a cold contract. Try again. Winston Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted July 31, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2005 If you want to tackle the heart suit first, then small to the ace and small back to the jack seems best. You pick up Q third with East or endplay West when he has Qx. But i think small heart to the A followed by a spade towards the king is better.Playing as you suggest, what happens with a heart to the Ace, then a low spade to the King and it loses to the Ace. Now West plays another spade and you ruff. I suspect now you would lead a diamond to the King and a diamond toward the J - but what if East wins this and leads a club? No problem, it would seem, but when you win the club Ace, cash a second high heart, West shows out. So now you lead a third round of spades and ruff in dummy, but Easts over-ruffs and cashes the Club K for down 1 - or win you lead a diamond to your King, West ruffs and leads a third spade and sits back and waits to score his King of Clubs. If you say you would instead finesse the diamond 9, West wins this and leads a third spade, which you ruff, but now the diamonds are blocked and you can't get back to dummy to enjoy the J of diamonds. Unlikely? Sure, but I wouldn't want to have to explain to my teammates how I went down in a cold game. Winston Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted July 31, 2005 Report Share Posted July 31, 2005 Heart to the Ace and then hook the Jack on the way back...The end play is too pretty to miss... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
temp3600 Posted July 31, 2005 Report Share Posted July 31, 2005 Winston : I'm still thinking about this hand ; i find it quite interesting. Let's call heart to the ace then heart to the jack line 1, and heart to the ace then spade to the king line 2.You seem to imply that in the example you gave (in which East has Qxx of trumps), line 2 fails whereas line 1 is cold (barring a bad split somewhere or an unlikely ruff, etc.). Are you sure about that ? Playing line 1, what do you do after the HJ wins and West discards ? I'm probably missing something but it seems to me the contract is not cold and you go down if you make the wrong guess(es). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted July 31, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2005 Winston : I'm still thinking about this hand ; i find it quite interesting. Let's call heart to the ace then heart to the jack line 1, and heart to the ace then spade to the king line 2.You seem to imply that in the example you gave (in which East has Qxx of trumps), line 2 fails whereas line 1 is cold (barring a bad split somewhere or an unlikely ruff, etc.). Are you sure about that ? Playing line 1, what do you do after the HJ wins and West discards ? I'm probably missing something but it seems to me the contract is not cold and you go down if you make the wrong guess(es).If the heart wins, you will lose at the most 1 trick in spades, diamonds, and clubs. After a successful finesse, draw the last trump with the King of hearts, then play the King and another diamond. At this point you have lost 1D and can afford to lose 1 club and 1 spade. You can trump 1 spade and throw the other losing spade on the good Jack of Diamonds. If the heart finesse wins, you will win 5 hearts in your hand, the A, K, and J of diamonds, the Ace of clubs, and 1 ruff in dummy. If the heart finesse loses, the hearts must be 2/2 and LHO is endplayed. No matter what he returns he gives up a trick. Like the post says: A Classic imp hand. This came from open room play 7/29/05. Winston Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
temp3600 Posted July 31, 2005 Report Share Posted July 31, 2005 All right, i surrender ! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted July 31, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2005 All right, i surrender ! :PHey, you did fine. :) The spade play is probably the second best line and one you would have to fall back on if LHO show out on the first heart. The key to seeing this is to think losers. You have one potential loser in each suit. Is there any way to guarantee one of those will go away? It's fairly easy to see that if LHO were on lead right then, he would have to give you a trick - and remember, 1 trick is all you need. This is imps - we are only trying to make our bid as safely as possible - overtricks are a luxury but never do we jeapardize the safety of the contract for a possible extra trick. Another way is to count winners - for some people this is easier than counting losers. As long as the hearts are not 4-0, you can count 4 heart tricks, 3 diamond tricks after the lead, 1 club, and 1 ruff in dummy. That is 9, so you only need 1 more...a successful heart finesses will give you 1 more...and....if it loses, guess who is left on lead? Winston Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Tu Posted July 31, 2005 Report Share Posted July 31, 2005 If the heart finesse loses, the hearts must be 2/2 and LHO is endplayed. No matter what he returns he gives up a trick. That trick may not help you... The HA to HJ line seems quite reasonable, and might well be best (didn't analyze too closely), but it's not 100%. You can still lose 1d, 1h, 1s, 1c, if RHO has SA, LHO has CK. LHO has to find the spade switch & RHO has to find the club through. Granted this is low probability, so if you are going to start by drawing trumps, it does seem clear to hook if RHO follows to the second trump. Also of course if RHO shows up with 1 small heart, you still have work to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Tu Posted July 31, 2005 Report Share Posted July 31, 2005 I put this hand into GIB, which is good at problems like these. It seems to think that heart to ace followed by spade is best. No problem, it would seem, but when you win the club Ace, cash a second high heart, West shows out. So now you lead a third round of spades and ruff in dummy, but Easts over-ruffs and cashes the Club K for down 1 - or win you lead a diamond to your King, West ruffs and leads a third spade and sits back and waits to score his King of Clubs. These situations don't occur too often. Spades are over 90% to break 6-3 or better. Singleton diamond is also unlikely. Someone's going to have to do a very careful analysis to prove superiority of one line or another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted July 31, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2005 I put this hand into GIB, which is good at problems like these. It seems to think that heart to ace followed by spade is best. No problem, it would seem, but when you win the club Ace, cash a second high heart, West shows out. So now you lead a third round of spades and ruff in dummy, but Easts over-ruffs and cashes the Club K for down 1 - or win you lead a diamond to your King, West ruffs and leads a third spade and sits back and waits to score his King of Clubs. These situations don't occur too often. Spades are over 90% to break 6-3 or better. Singleton diamond is also unlikely. Someone's going to have to do a very careful analysis to prove superiority of one line or another.Good point! However, there is also this: Heart finesse loses, spade to the Ace and a club back - win the Ace, play the K of spades, pitching a diamond, ruff a spade, then lead a club. If West wins this he is again endplayed and if he holds Jx the club is established for a pitch and there is still an entry to dummy. I believe the suggested line would lose only if RHO held the spade Ace and the club king with less than 5 clubs. Your point is very well taken. Suggested line wins whenever the hearts are 3/1 with RHO holding 3, when they are 2/2 and LHO holds the spade Ace, the club King, or the singleton J or Jx of clubs. Winston Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted July 31, 2005 Report Share Posted July 31, 2005 The endplay looks good at first, but seems useless when the opponents switch to a spade. If you can eliminate spades first though.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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