Unlucky or poor judgement?

[AL78]

MPs, Acol (I was North):

 

[hv=pc=n&s=s2hajt42dkj2caq98&n=skj63hk9863dac753&d=n&v=b&b=13&a=1hp3sp4dp4np5hp6hppp]266|200[/hv]

 

I won the diamond lead and played a heart to the ace with West showing out, so that was one down when the club finesse worked. The slam is not good but is it reasonable for South to take a shot or was it asking a bit much? The problem is the hands don't mesh very well and the 3-0 break in the wrong direction (typical I cash the wrong honor first) kills it immediately.

[smerriman]

North should be bidding 4♥ here. South asked you to revalue your hand opposite spade shortness; you had an 11 count to start with, your KJ of spades is wasted, and you have no club help.

 

Continuing after a splinter tells partner the hands *are* meshing well - shift those wasted values into your club suit, and you'd have a 4♦ bid, and want to be in slam. So South's bidding seems fine.

[akwoo]

Do you have a forcing raise that is not a splinter? Most 2/1 partnerships would agree that the South hand is in fact too good for a splinter - the fact that North is a subminimum after the splinter and slam still isn't hopeless shows that point.

 

Assuming you agree that South is too good for a splinter, then North should bid 4H over the splinter given that 4 of his hcp have become worthless. If your splinters are unlimited, then you have more of a problem because showing the diamond ace could be crucial.

 

Just to show off some tools, my partnership with the most tools bids:

 

1H - 2S (inv+ heart raise)

2N (minimum) - 3D (overstrength splinter)

3H (I might be interested; which suit?) - 4C (spades)

4H (not interested) - P (South can still override with a really good hand at this point, but won't)

[LBengtsson]

Without knowing the whole bidding structure of Acol perhaps I should not comment. But I guess a 2m response after 1M is very like SAYC and shows 10+ HCPs? That said after opening 1♥ with the North cards, what do you then bid if partner bids 2♣ or 2♦?

 

I honestly do not think you have a good rebid as North, and whilst players are aggressive and open most 11 counts these days, because you have just 2 honor tricks and poor suits, you can be a discretion player and decide to 'Pass' instead of opening imo.

 

Beyond that, I think we need to know how your partnership bids splinters as South's hand is imo "more than a splinter" (as akwoo said) and smerriman indicates that the 4♦ bid after a splinter seems wrong when you are very minimum.

 

It is good to be able to reach a small slam with a 10 card trump, and just 26 HCPs but the hands need to "mesh - fit neatly into on another" After the splinter your ♠KJxx is worth less. Change those 4HCPs into ♠Axxx and it changes the hand completely.

[eagles123]

agree with smerriman, North to blame here, KJxx is an awful holding opposite a splinter, we have a clear 4H bid rather than 4D.

[AL78]

Fair enough, I had it in my mind that showing a control below game level didn't show extras, so yes I should have dampened any slam aspirations by bidding 4♥. I am really rusty on some aspects of slam bidding because it hardly ever comes up.

[mw64ahw]

Unlucky with the 3-0 break and the wrong choice, but I'd likely be in 6♥ too looking for the ♣ finesse to make

[AL78]

Unlucky with the 3-0 break and the wrong choice, but I'd likely be in 6♥ too looking for the ♣ finesse to make

 

One other pair also went down in 6♥ after a more crash bang wallop auction (South went straight into Blackwood I think). I still should have put the brakes on the auction.

[nullve]

 

I won the diamond lead and played a heart to the ace with West showing out, so that was one down when the club finesse worked.

East didn't overcall and was therefore the opponent most likely to have 3 hearts.

[bluenikki]

North should be bidding 4♥ here. South asked you to revalue your hand opposite spade shortness; you had an 11 count to start with, your KJ of spades is wasted, and you have no club help.

 

Continuing after a splinter tells partner the hands *are* meshing well - shift those wasted values into your club suit, and you'd have a 4♦ bid, and want to be in slam. So South's bidding seems fine.

The message of the splinter should be "Don't think of slam unless you hold X hcp outside my short suit." The value of the number X needs to be specifically agreed by the partnership.

 

I can't believe anyone would agree X = 7 if they thought about it.

[mikeh]

East didn't overcall and was therefore the opponent most likely to have 3 hearts.

I don’t think that’s a good inference. The opps have only 8 not very strong spades and 9 very weak diamonds and are vulnerable. While there is some small merit in arguing that east might bid with a void in hearts, there’s the contrary argument that west might double 3S with decent spades and a heart void. Neither argument, imo, has any real weight due to the factors I mention earlier.

 

It’s difficult to criticize the bidding constructively without knowing the partnership agreements…I don’t play Acol and it’s underlying philosophy seems, to me, very unsound.

 

If splinters are unlimited (which is a dreadful treatment, imo) then it behooves the partnership to have further agreements for when north, as here, has what might be a ‘useful minimum’. Picture x AQJx KQxx Axxx for the unlimited splinter. Slam isn’t cold but it’s reasonable. Compare to KQxx KJxxx xx Kx.

 

The answer is pretty simple: 3N is an idle bid…you won’t give up anything meaningful by defining 3N as artificial…whether you play it as ‘serious’ (making 4D a cuebid while denying a good hand) or ‘frivolous’ (making the sequence 3N 4C 4D as showing a non-horrible hand) is not particularly important.

 

If I had these hands playing 2/1, responder is far too strong for a splinter. 1H 2N 3C (showing a non-awful minimum) 3D (relay) 3N (stiff diamond) 4C 4D (cuebids…3N denied a void hence we show the stiff diamond Ace) and now responder is at a decision point

 

It comes down to which black king opener has…club king, slam is very good. Spade king…decent but not good.

 

I think responder should cuebid spades (for me, since we play kickback, where 4S is keycard, we’d bid 4N but it doesn’t matter). Then opener would bid 5C with the club king and we bid slam. When opener bids 5H, we pass.

[akwoo]

Fair enough, I had it in my mind that showing a control below game level didn't show extras, so yes I should have dampened any slam aspirations by bidding 4♥. I am really rusty on some aspects of slam bidding because it hardly ever comes up.

 

I wouldn't say showing a control below game level shows extras - but in this case, it's not that you don't have extras - you don't even have an opening hand given the splinter.

[jillybean]

My auction would have been;

1♥:2nt

4♥