diamonds

[jillybean]

[hv=pc=n&n=sq7hdakqjt93c8654&d=s&v=b&b=7&a=p1h?]133|200[/hv]

 

MP's

 

Do you start with a double or some number of diamonds?

[pescetom]

Do you start with a double or some number of diamonds?

 

No

[nullve]

[hv=pc=n&n=sq7hdakqjt93c8654&d=s&v=b&b=7&a=p1h?]133|200[/hv]

 

MP's

 

Do you start with a double or some number of diamonds?

This is a textbook 3♥ overcall.

[jillybean]

Asking for a ♥ stopper?

[nullve]

Asking for a ♥ stopper?

Yes.

[jillybean]

No

I assume you bid 3♥ too.

(I have to read those textbooks)

[TMorris]

This is a textbook 3♥ overcall.

 

The complete abscence of stoppers in the other suits makes it a diamond preempt for me.

[TMorris]

This is a textbook 3♥ overcall.

 

The complete abscence of stoppers in the other suits makes it a diamond preempt for me.

[mw64ahw]

This falls into Intermediate Jump Overcall territory so 3♦ seems appropriate. For 3♥ I need another entry

[mikeh]

I assume you bid 3♥ too.

(I have to read those textbooks)

Run…run as hard as you can from any textbook that says that this is a 3H overcall. It’s written by someone with no clue about the game.

 

A textbook 3H bid looks roughly like this: Kx x AKQJxxx Axx

 

Can one sometimes stretch? Yes, but one should always have at least one side suit stopped and have a little something in the other. Say Qx x AKQJxxx Axx. Now as little as Jxx in spades will stop them running that suit.

 

Bear in mind that after (1H) 3H (p) 3N, opening leader will rarely underlead the heart ace, since he ‘knows’ that he’s likely giving up by doing so.

[mikeh]

As for what I bid over 1H…..partner is a passed hand, LHO is unlimited. I think bidding 2D or 3D gives too much room. If either opp has short diamonds and extras, I’d be giving them a cheap cuebid. Or if LHO a good hand with spades, and I let them bid 2S or 3S, opener may be able to cue diamonds in support. Yes, I can double slam for a heart lead, but I can’t do that against 4S.

 

So I bid 4D.

 

At any form of scoring.

 

As is often said, if mostly by me (lol), bridge is a game of percentages. 4D could go horribly wrong, but so could any action. Meanwhile, as I say less often but just as accurately, bridge is a game of mistakes.

 

We learn to bid so as to avoid disasters, but the modern expert game is also in part about creating opportunities for the opps to go wrong. 4D will, more often than not, put huge pressure on the opps. As an example, good luck finding the right contract if they belong in spades. Good luck differentiating between a ‘slam interest’ 4H raise and a ‘have to stretch with my limit raise’ 4H bid, etc.

[jillybean]

Run…run as hard as you can from any textbook that says that this is a 3H overcall. It’s written by someone with no clue about the game

Still suffering from Covid, or not, I'm happy to see it hasn't affected your sense of humour and witty rebukes. :)

[pescetom]

I assume you bid 3♥ too.

(I have to read those textbooks)

 

I would, even though it's not the textbook example, as mikeh points out.

But 4♦ is not going to elict much interest from partner, and if he has a hearts stop then he quite likely has another suit stopped too.

Certainly not great odds, but worth a try I would think (would be interesting to simulate).

I might chicken out to diamonds if mikeh was declarer or 3NT was doubled B-)

[smerriman]

But 4♦ is not going to elict much interest from partner, and if he has a hearts stop then he quite likely has another suit stopped too.

Certainly not great odds, but worth a try I would think (would be interesting to simulate).

If it were an 8 card diamond suit, maybe. But you need 2 tricks from partner, so pretty much need all three suits stopped, and even that might not be enough.

[LBengtsson]

.So I bid 4D.

 

That was the first bid that came into my mind opposite a passed partner red/red before I read any of the replies.

[pescetom]

If it were an 8 card diamond suit, maybe. But you need 2 tricks from partner, so pretty much need all three suits stopped, and even that might not be enough.

 

You're right and I read it as 8 cards.

My notorious vulnerability to equal spaced 10 rather than T.

[DavidKok]

For hands with a long suit: count the remaining cards, not the long suit.

[jillybean]

[hv=pc=n&s=st9hq8743d64cjt72&w=sakjhat952d8caq93&n=sq7hdakqjt93c8654&e=s865432hkj6d752ck]399|300[/hv]

 

I played in 5♦X -800 but had plenty of good company. Unfortunately no one found the 6♠W ;)

[pescetom]

For hands with a long suit: count the remaining cards, not the long suit.

 

Sound advice.

Alternatively, convince platforms to use T or at least to kern 10 (and Q).

[mikeh]

I would, even though it's not the textbook example, as mikeh points out.

But 4♦ is not going to elict much interest from partner, and if he has a hearts stop then he quite likely has another suit stopped too.

Certainly not great odds, but worth a try I would think (would be interesting to simulate).

I might chicken out to diamonds if mikeh was declarer or 3NT was doubled B-)

I don’t think simulations help on hands like these

 

Yes, you can identify the double dummy chances of various contracts, but it’s really very difficult…to the point of impossibility on many hands…to reliably determine how the hands would or should be bid. Or, often,how the defence might go.

 

It advances us not at all to find, for example, that west is cold for 6S. Nobody in the world is finding 6S by west.

 

Btw…if I were your partner and did bid 3N over your 3H, you’d pull….only if I were declarer? I’m hurt. Or maybe you’ve seen me declare before? 😀

[pescetom]

Btw…if I were your partner and did bid 3N over your 3H, you’d pull….only if I were declarer? I’m hurt. Or maybe you’ve seen me declare before?

 

Nooo. I was saying that if you were declarer (or if the result mattered more than having huge fun or provoking Jillybean, for that matter) I would avoid 3♥.

BTW, I suspect that a few decades ago you would have been happy to bid 3♥ all the same :)

[mikeh]

Nooo. I was saying that if you were declarer (or if the result mattered more than having huge fun or provoking Jillybean, for that matter) I would avoid 3♥.

BTW, I suspect that a few decades ago you would have been happy to bid 3♥ all the same :)

Believe it or not, I’m more aggressive these days than I was a few decades ago. As one ages, there’s less time left to get to bad contracts, so I don’t like to waste opportunities, lol.

 

Also, and more importantly, I now play generally a more aggressive method.

[jillybean]

Nooo. I was saying that if you were declarer (or if the result mattered more than having huge fun or provoking Jillybean, for that matter) I would avoid 3♥.

BTW, I suspect that a few decades ago you would have been happy to bid 3♥ all the same :)

I'm not so sure how to respond to this, and some other similar, recent posts but it certainly has me thinking of avoiding forums as a method to discuss bridge stuff.

I'm not looking for a ego boost, don't want responses. :)

[sfi]

No

2NT both minors? Always a good choice on your 2084 hands.

[LBengtsson]

I'm not so sure how to respond to this, and some other similar, recent posts but it certainly has me thinking of avoiding forums as a method to discuss bridge stuff.

I'm not looking for a ego boost, don't want responses. :)

 

Please stay jillybean. We need you here! Your posts are interesting discussion points. I have spent a hour searching the net for clarity on this subject. The 3♥ bid is known as a "Jump Cue Overcall or Bid" and the three examples I could find all say that the other two suits (other than the long minor suit) need to be stopped. The wikipedia entry is below and has probably been taken from the Official Encyclopaedia of Bridge.

 

The jump cue bid

The immediate jump cue bid of opener's suit has a specific meaning. It is typically a long totally solid minor with stoppers in the other two suits. Partner is asked to bid 3NT with a stop in the suit opened or else to bid four or five clubs (pass or correct).

 

I know of the Gambling 3NT opening bid where opening with a long minor does not promise these stoppers, effectively a preemptive opening bid, but this is a different circumstance bid in a competitive auction.