Fluffy Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 IMPS N . - . S1♠ - 1NT3♣ - ?? ♠92♥K73♦J972♣KJ94 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 4C. False preference bidding is great, and if i were weaker 3S would be clear. But I have exceptional club support, and the heart king may or may not be working. I raise, and if he has manufactured a jump shift then he can bid 4S and I can pass. If he really has a black 2 suiter, we could be off to the races. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 3NT. The soft values in the reds drive me away from 4♣. If pard has a 55 he can always bid 4♣ himself, after which I'd be glad to oblige. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 4♣. Opener may have only 3 if he is too good to rebid 3♠, but in that case he will bid 4♠ next. No reason why he should bid 4♣ with 5-5 if I bid 3NT. This is all a matter of trust, and partner should believe that I have my values in the red suits if 3NT is my bid. My diamonds are too shaky for that. I would rather rebid 3♠ than 3NT. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PriorKnowledge Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 Another "Why bother having a partner" hands. Partner has bid 2 suits. Our first obligation is tell them which one we like best. Treating the 3C jump-shift as a relay to 3N makes no sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 Another "Why bother having a partner" hands. Partner has bid 2 suits. Our first obligation is tell them which one we like best. Treating the 3C jump-shift as a relay to 3N makes no sense. That you should give preference is a debatable point because you can hardly have 3 spades. Besides, you know opener has at best 20 points, so 3NT rates to be the top spot. Of course he can have AKxxxAQxxAQxx but that's the magic hand - one out of many. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PriorKnowledge Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 If opener did not want us to raise clubs with club support, maybe opener should just bid 3N? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoob Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 If opener did not want us to raise clubs with club support, maybe opener should just bid 3N? i would have to agree, as my regular partner has a serious hard-on for NT contracts whenever possible. for him to bid this way indicates a seriously unbalanced hand. i will raise ♣ and expect continuation to go 4NT, 5C all pass, making and being very thankfull that this isn't MPs as i suspect he's 6/5 and 4♠+1 at several tables. sigh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 If opener did not want us to raise clubs with club support, maybe opener should just bid 3N? No.. he wants you to raise clubs on a good hand. Something like xAxxJ9xxKJxxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al_U_Card Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 This is closer than it looks. 3S has merit, (as 3NT tends to deny a good doubleton)but the general value bid of 3NT (the 3C could be a 3 card suit) caters to pard being in the low end for his bid and needing a red suit stopper for 3NT. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 I watched this hand when Gonzalo played it and I thought he made a very imaginative bid and pre-apologized when he put dummy down. Very classy thing to do and reminded me of Fred when he has a difficult decision. I'm going to punt with 3S. Pard may have a 5224 where 3N might be right, or have a true 2 suiter (5 or 6 clubs) or an invented jump shift with a GOSH where 4S or maybe a magic 6S might be the spot. I will pass 3N, bid 4H over 4C or 4D (and continue with 5C over 4S) and pass 4S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 Well.. I think the point is what is our notion of the following bids 1♠ 1NT3♣ ..? I would say... 3♦ = long diamonds, concern over the heart suit3♥ = 5 cards. Trying to play 4♥ if opener has 5314/53053♠ = strong doubleton, concern over the red suits, especially hearts3NT = natural, misfit. Concentration of values on the red suits4♣ = good max, slammish hand for clubs4♦ = strange bid. Would take it as club splinter if it happened at table4♥ = as above4♠ = 3 cards, weakish 4333 hand (prefered to bid 1♠-1NT to 1♠-2♠) This is how I would see it. Of course other people see it differently and would respond differently to 3♣ :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 Another "Why bother having a partner" hands. Partner has bid 2 suits. Our first obligation is tell them which one we like best. Treating the 3C jump-shift as a relay to 3N makes no sense. That you should give preference is a debatable point because you can hardly have 3 spades. Besides, you know opener has at best 20 points, so 3NT rates to be the top spot. Of course he can have AKxxxAQxxAQxx but that's the magic hand - one out of many. 4CMany top class players open 1S with more than 20HCP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted June 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 Actually I don't have these problem on my partnership because 2NT rebid is Gf, and 3♣ is 5-5 at least, but playing natural aproach.... I think 3♥ should be a 6 card suit or a very good 5 card one, expect it to be raised with 2. BTW I forgot to say 1NT is forcing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 This is another reason why the "transfer preempt" that include a strong two suiter is good. Partner can not have a monster hand with both black suits. But, ok. The problem is how to bid this in standard. First, was 1NT "forcing" or natual. For this answer I will assume natural. If 1NT was natural there is no reason for false prefernce. So the problem as it was, should you bid 4♣, forever bypassing 3NT, should you bid 3NT, or should you bid 3D. The way I play (with transfer preempts), 3NT is fairly clear shot here. But in standard, I would have to bid 4♣ and hope partner is not 5-3-1-4 or 5-1-3-4 with a stiff red honor hand lots of hcp. If he one of those hands, in standard, hopefully he would have just blasted 3NT. Anyway, if he has only 4C, 5C should be close to laydown, and 6C might have some play if we have enough keycards. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 3NT = natural, misfit. Concentration of values on the red suits4♣ = good max, slammish hand for clubs Funny, if you hadn't specifically said you would bid 3N, I would have thought you bid 4C from your explanation of the bids :blink: You don't have a misfit, you have a great fit for partners suit and could easily have a DOUBLE fit or 9 card fit. You have half your points in clubs, a very very tenous diamond stop and a single heart stop. This isn't really a concentration I don't think... However, imo anyways, you do have a slammish hand for clubs. You make slam opposite alot minimum jump shifts and 5C could easily be a better game than 3N. FWIW I think alot of 5224 hands partner would (and should) bid 2N Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeartA Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 4C. WTP? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 You don't have a misfit, you have a great fit for partners suit and could easily have a DOUBLE fit or 9 card fit. You have half your points in clubs, a very very tenous diamond stop and a single heart stop. This isn't really a concentration I don't think... Someone said it for me - again; problem is I've been in Canada on a Muskie fishing trip for the past two weeks; I come back to discover posts with my name on them and the sensuous fragrance of L'Oranger Neroli Eau de parfum lingering like the misty form of a siren over my keyboard. Anybody have any ideas on what's going on? :D WinstonM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double ! Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 I voted for other, (you don't want to know my bid) but would not raise clubs because of possibility of a manufactured 3C bid on a spade hand that's not good enough for a 2C opener. This whole sequence is a problem for a system that can't rebid 3 of suit and have the bid be forcing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted June 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 Come on, tell us, it can't be as marginal bid as my 4♠ bid was, nobody has followed :-(. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 i'd bid 4c... btw what do you open when 5/5 in the blacks?... would anybody (else) play the 4c bid as rkc? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted June 8, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2005 i'd bid 4c... btw what do you open when 5/5 in the blacks?... would anybody (else) play the 4c bid as rkc? with 5/5 I open the same as with 5/7: 1♠ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double ! Posted June 8, 2005 Report Share Posted June 8, 2005 lolis this hand supposed to represent the counterpart of hand BPO-OO2 A? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted June 8, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2005 Nopes, it has nothing to do. This hand was played by me on BBO on Monday. Here the full hand [hv=n=saqj10xhqdkqxcaq10x&w=s87xxxhj8xxdxxcxx&e=skha10xxxdaxxxcxxx&s=s9xhkxxdjxxxckj9x]399|300|[/hv] I am not sure if the 3♠ bidders will end in 3NT or 4♠. I for sure ended on 4♠ bcause I bid them. It looks like in the ♠ game is the only one who can survive a missplaced ♠K, in practice it was teh only one to go 2 off after East found a very inspired ♥A lead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted June 8, 2005 Report Share Posted June 8, 2005 I think the ace of hearts lead is normal (underleading is pretty big). You hope to set up a ruff with pard as you have 3 tricks in your own hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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