Cyberyeti Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 [hv=pc=n&s=sA3h74dakt62ca642&d=e&v=b&b=10&a=2h]133|200[/hv] E opens a 6-10 weak 2♥ - as the poll says, X/3♦ Follow ups to follow, if it matters you play reverse leb over 2♥-X-P 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nullve Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 2N Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberyeti Posted December 15, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 2N Added as an option, categorically shows a stop for us Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LBengtsson Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 3♦. If partner has ♠ he will bid. too strong for pass. shape wrong 2254 for X (3154,3244 I would X) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberyeti Posted December 15, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 3♦. If partner has ♠ he will bid. too strong for pass. shape wrong 2254 for X (3154,3244 I would X) How much more would you need to feel you were too strong for 3♦ ? as it is Kxx, xx, xx, Kxxxxx or Kxx, xxx, x, KQxxxx you might be struggling in 3♦ (or 2/3N if you overcalled 2N) with 5♣ cold Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulg Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 How much more would you need to feel you were too strong for 3♦ ? as it is Kxx, xxx, x, Kxxxxx you might be struggling in 3♦ (or 2/3N if you overcalled 2N) with 5♣ coldI would bid 3♦ too. I think to double I'd need a hand where I am comfortable with passing or bidding on if the auction goes (2♥) - Dbl - (4♥) - 4♠ which is more likely than missing a club game. In my younger days I used to worry a lot more about getting the best result: nowadays I just try to bid my hand and leave everyone else to bid theirs. I have more than sufficient complaints about my bidding with this philosophy to worry about :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gszes Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 I like these questions that leave room for imps and MP I chose P in survey because That would be my choice at IMPS where I do not wish to lose the match by bidding in this very dangerous position while I still have a partner that will balance with any reasonable semblance of a hand. What I would do if it goes 2h p p x seems like a more interesting question :)))))))))))))))))))))))))) (3H) I expect pass to be unpopular since it goes along with my theory of imagining the best hand p can have and still pass (in the direct seat and acting accordingly in the PO seat. At MP I would hazard a 3d bid mainly because it dangerous to leave the opps in what looks like an easy 2 level spot. If we get clobbered it is only 1 board and we probably will lose only 30 MP while picking up 70 MP is hardly out of the question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberyeti Posted December 15, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 I like these questions that leave room for imps and MP I dealt it in practice so it could have been either, I thought it was an interesting problem. Btw have you discussed how forcing 2♥-P-P-2♠-P-3♦ is ? As an aside, I play very wide ranging weak 2s (although this one was perfectly normal) and we make most of our gains when people overcall 3♦ on hands like these. Either partner has the hand and doubles or they play 3♦ going off when 2♠/3♣ is the right spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TylerE Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 3♦ for me at all forms of scoring and vulnerability, and frankly I don't think it's close. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 I dealt it in practice so it could have been either, I thought it was an interesting problem. Btw have you discussed how forcing 2♥-P-P-2♠-P-3♦ is ? As an aside, I play very wide ranging weak 2s (although this one was perfectly normal) and we make most of our gains when people overcall 3♦ on hands like these. Either partner has the hand and doubles or they play 3♦ going off when 2♠/3♣ is the right spot.In what universe can we reach 2S or 3C? If we pass, and partner reopens with 2S, we’re hardly passing, so you’re not discussing that. So you’re arguing for double. That’s silly. If we double, which is a monstrous overbid imo, you suggest passing 2S? If partner bids 2S, he has a weak hand, and you may notice that we have short spades. He’s not bidding 2S with as many as 6 unless he’s truly broke, which is possible but improbable. His normal strength rates to be around 6-10 hcp. If we double and he uses reverse lebensohl, to get out in 3C, that would be pretty good, but just think of the likelihood that he does that. You seem to suggest that it’s more likely that he has 6 clubs and a stiff diamond than that he has, say, 3=3 or 3=4 minors. That’s nonsense. Plus, of course, double is not going to work well ifLHO raises hearts and partner introduces a 4 card spade suit at the 3 or 4 level. Want to talk about missing games? You double, LHO bids 4H and partner has Jxxxx x QJx KQxx. He should and would bid 4S, almost surely losing a heart and 3 spade tricks, almost cold for 5D, where you’d be if you overcall 3D. Yes, 3D is hardly risk-free. But passing is cowardly, and doubling fundamentally misguided, imo. It’s not as if you have any clear action if partner reopens with 2S. 3D is certainly, then, constructive but partner should never play you for 7 controls! KQ10xx xx Qxx Kxx is a decent game yet he can’t bid over 3D. KQxxx x xx KQxxx even worse. Now you play 3D, with 6C pretty good. Note that over a 3D overcall, he bids 3S, you bid 4C and you reach game (slam is too tough) I could go on, but anyone can construct hands to ‘prove’ a point. Suffice it to say that I’d bid 3D at any form of scoring, because, while it is dangerous to do so, passing seems to me to be a bit more dangerous. Doubling, without spades and with only a modest 5 card suit, is nuts, imo. It’s far worse than passing. As for 2N, I’ve seen inexperienced players play this as showing the minors. I don’t think I’ve ever heard of, let alone seen, a good pair use it that way, over a weak two. If intended as natural, it’s ridiculous. Yes, we may belong in 3N, but (if so), it’s extremely likely that we need partner to declare. And we’ll usually get there after a 3D overcall. Btw, I do think this is a good problem, and that I’d hate holding this hand at the table. I’d be nervous if I bid, and even more nervous if I passed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberyeti Posted December 15, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 3♦ for me at all forms of scoring and vulnerability, and frankly I don't think it's close. One of the next two hands is something like: [hv=pc=n&n=skq765ha32dqj987c]133|100[/hv] Better hope it's the right one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TylerE Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 Your're result merchanting in the worst way. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberyeti Posted December 15, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 Your're result merchanting in the worst way. Actually no, I'm making a serious point, overcalling 3m on a 5 card suit has had disastrous results over many years against my weak 2s, it's a big area of scoring for us and yes we've had 1400s and 1100s aplenty. It's one of the main reasons we play the particularly horrible style of weak 2s we do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 Actually no, I'm making a serious point, overcalling 3m on a 5 card suit has had disastrous results over many years against my weak 2s, it's a big area of scoring for us and yes we've had 1400s and 1100s aplenty. It's one of the main reasons we play the particularly horrible style of weak 2s we do.It seems to me that the point you’re trying to make us how wonderful you are for playing your style of weak two bids Of course, if partner is the one holding that hand you showed, I am mistaken😀 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AL78 Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 One of the next two hands is something like: [hv=pc=n&n=skq765ha32dqj987c]133|100[/hv] Better hope it's the right one I'm not sure what your point is. Bidding 3♦ is wrong because there exists a layout where it goes horribly wrong? So what, there exist layouts where it works out beautifully as well, and passing is not without risk. Bridge is a probabilistic game, so it comes down to what is most likely to get a decent, or at least satisfactory result, which cannot be diagnosed by looking at individual deals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberyeti Posted December 15, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 It seems to me that the point you’re trying to make us how wonderful you are for playing your style of weak two bids Of course, if partner is the one holding that hand you showed, I am mistaken😀 It was actually partner that held a hand not quite as extreme as that, the weak 2 we would have found too good for our style (xx, KJ109xx, x, KQxx) we'd open 1 as it's rule of 19 with all the points in long suits, the actual hand opposite was K108xx, AQx, Qxxxx, void and if you double, pass or bid 2N you can have some interesting issues, 3♦ should get you to at least 6, 7 is excellent and makes with spades 4-2 and trumps 2-1. And no it was not particularly promoting our style of weak 2s, it's a lot easier for partner to double if he knows I have something, but we get a lot of +200s and 300s on nothing boards in auctions like 2♥-3♦ end, and this makes me much more reticent to do it when we hold similar hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mycroft Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 I'm sure you know my answer to this. And the answer to "how much stronger would you have to be to double?" Well, it's all controls, but it isn't extra HCP by any means. Say a round K at least? Yeah, we go -110 and -140, or even +100 into +110, a lot against preempts-all-pass. But we don't go -100 (or -200, or -500) into +110 or +140 very often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcphee Posted December 16, 2020 Report Share Posted December 16, 2020 Although I have only 5!D and my suit isn't great passing carries too much risk of missing game. Sure some days you may go for a digit so what, it happened before. I cant imagine passing at any form of scoring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberyeti Posted December 16, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2020 In what universe can we reach 2S or 3C? If we pass, and partner reopens with 2S, we’re hardly passing, so you’re not discussing that. So you’re arguing for double. That’s silly. If we double, which is a monstrous overbid imo, you suggest passing 2S? If partner bids 2S, he has a weak hand, and you may notice that we have short spades. He’s not bidding 2S with as many as 6 unless he’s truly broke, which is possible but improbable. His normal strength rates to be around 6-10 hcp. If we double and he uses reverse lebensohl, to get out in 3C, that would be pretty good, but just think of the likelihood that he does that. You seem to suggest that it’s more likely that he has 6 clubs and a stiff diamond than that he has, say, 3=3 or 3=4 minors. That’s nonsense. Plus, of course, double is not going to work well ifLHO raises hearts and partner introduces a 4 card spade suit at the 3 or 4 level. Want to talk about missing games? You double, LHO bids 4H and partner has Jxxxx x QJx KQxx. He should and would bid 4S, almost surely losing a heart and 3 spade tricks, almost cold for 5D, where you’d be if you overcall 3D. Yes, 3D is hardly risk-free. But passing is cowardly, and doubling fundamentally misguided, imo. It’s not as if you have any clear action if partner reopens with 2S. 3D is certainly, then, constructive but partner should never play you for 7 controls! KQ10xx xx Qxx Kxx is a decent game yet he can’t bid over 3D. KQxxx x xx KQxxx even worse. Now you play 3D, with 6C pretty good. Note that over a 3D overcall, he bids 3S, you bid 4C and you reach game (slam is too tough) I could go on, but anyone can construct hands to ‘prove’ a point. Suffice it to say that I’d bid 3D at any form of scoring, because, while it is dangerous to do so, passing seems to me to be a bit more dangerous. Doubling, without spades and with only a modest 5 card suit, is nuts, imo. It’s far worse than passing. As for 2N, I’ve seen inexperienced players play this as showing the minors. I don’t think I’ve ever heard of, let alone seen, a good pair use it that way, over a weak two. If intended as natural, it’s ridiculous. Yes, we may belong in 3N, but (if so), it’s extremely likely that we need partner to declare. And we’ll usually get there after a 3D overcall. Btw, I do think this is a good problem, and that I’d hate holding this hand at the table. I’d be nervous if I bid, and even more nervous if I passed. I wasn't actually arguing for anything, I was playing devil's advocate. I'm interested that you consider it self evident that 2♥-P-P-2♠-P-3♦ was NF, if it is then you can't pass, I wasn't sure. I'm also not sure exactly what 2♥-P-P-2♠-P-2N shows. I assumed 2N was 15-17 bal in my comments to the poster who suggested it. I know almost nobody who plays it as minors. I think I probably bid 3♦ at the table, but hate it and was trying to see if there was any alternative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nullve Posted December 16, 2020 Report Share Posted December 16, 2020 I assumed 2N was 15-17 bal in my comments to the poster who suggested it. It was. If intended as natural, it’s ridiculous. I tried my best and failed. Here 1. Q J 8 5 K 9 6 A 3 T 7 4 2 K 6 Q J T 9 8 3 7 4 A 5 2 8 7 5 Q 4 A K T 6 2 J 9 3 K 9 7 5 J 8 A 6 4 2 Q T 3 2. K 4 2 Q 8 5 A 3 J T 9 7 6 A J K Q 9 6 5 2 7 4 T 8 3 J 9 8 3 5 4 A K T 6 2 Q 7 K J T 9 8 3 A 6 4 2 Q 7 5 3. Q J T 9 4 2 8 6 A 3 K 7 5 Q J 5 A 9 8 6 3 2 7 4 K T 8 5 7 4 A K T 6 2 Q J 9 3 9 8 Q J T A 6 4 2 K 7 5 3 4. Q 9 8 7 5 J 6 A 3 K T 4 2 Q J T 6 K 9 8 5 3 2 7 4 A 7 5 J 9 A K T 6 2 Q 8 4 3 T 3 Q J 5 A 6 4 2 K 9 8 7 5. T 8 2 J 7 A 3 K Q 9 6 5 4 J T 3 2 K Q 9 8 6 5 7 4 A 9 8 3 Q J 5 4 A K T 6 2 7 K 7 3 T A 6 4 2 Q J 9 8 5 6. K Q T 5 J 8 A 3 9 7 6 4 2 A K 9 5 Q J T 8 3 2 7 4 6 8 4 J 7 A K T 6 2 Q 9 5 3 Q J T K 8 7 A 6 4 2 9 5 3 7. Q 7 6 8 4 2 A 3 K J T 9 5 A T 8 5 K Q J 9 3 2 7 4 6 8 7 4 9 3 A K T 6 2 Q J 5 T 7 3 Q J A 6 4 2 K 9 8 5 8. K Q T 9 4 2 6 5 A 3 J 8 7 K J 8 2 A Q T 6 5 3 7 4 9 8 3 A K T 6 2 Q J 9 7 5 4 J 5 T 9 8 3 A 6 4 2 K Q 7 9. K Q 6 4 2 5 A 3 J T 9 8 7 J T A Q 9 8 5 3 7 4 K 6 2 3 J 7 4 A K T 6 2 Q 9 8 5 Q J 9 7 5 K T 3 A 6 4 2 8 10. K Q J T 8 7 6 5 2 A 3 9 4 Q A K J 6 5 2 7 4 T 9 8 3 Q 4 3 J 7 5 A K T 6 2 9 8 Q 9 7 J A 6 4 2 K T 8 5 3 11. T 7 6 4 2 Q J 8 A 3 K 9 5 A K T Q J 8 6 5 2 7 4 9 3 8 5 4 Q A K T 6 2 J 9 7 3 K J 9 8 5 A 6 4 2 Q T 7 3 12. J T 6 4 K 7 A 3 Q 9 8 5 2 9 6 A Q J T 5 3 7 4 K 8 2 Q 8 7 9 4 3 A K T 6 2 J 5 K T 7 3 8 5 A 6 4 2 Q J 9 13. J T 9 8 4 A 3 K Q 7 6 5 2 T 3 A K 9 8 6 5 7 4 Q J 2 J 8 7 4 9 A K T 6 2 Q 5 3 K T 9 7 Q 8 5 3 A 6 4 2 J 14. K Q J 8 7 T 9 5 A 3 6 4 2 J T 8 A K 9 6 5 2 7 4 Q 3 5 4 Q 9 A K T 6 2 J 8 7 3 Q J 7 5 3 A 6 4 2 K T 9 8 15. J T 9 6 2 - A 3 K Q 8 7 5 4 A 9 K J T 5 3 2 7 4 Q 8 6 7 5 4 Q 8 3 A K T 6 2 J 9 J T 5 K 9 7 3 A 6 4 2 Q 8 16. K Q 9 2 T 7 4 A 3 J 8 6 5 3 2 Q J T 9 8 6 7 4 A K 5 9 7 4 J 8 A K T 6 2 Q 5 3 J 9 8 5 Q 3 A 6 4 2 K T 7 17. Q J 9 7 T 4 2 A 3 K 8 6 5 A 3 2 Q J T 9 6 5 7 4 K 8 8 3 J 7 5 A K T 6 2 Q 9 4 J T 8 5 Q A 6 4 2 K 9 7 3 18. Q 8 5 J T 7 A 3 K 9 6 4 2 A Q J K 9 8 5 3 2 7 4 T 6 Q J 9 4 8 A K T 6 2 7 5 3 T 9 8 K J 7 A 6 4 2 Q 5 3 19. Q 7 5 2 T 9 4 A 3 K J 8 6 9 6 K Q J T 8 3 7 4 A 5 2 8 4 9 7 A K T 6 2 Q J 5 3 9 8 7 5 3 J T A 6 4 2 K Q 20. Q J T 8 2 6 A 3 K 9 7 5 4 J 8 A K T 9 6 3 7 4 Q 5 2 8 7 4 Q J 9 5 3 A K T 6 2 - Q T 7 3 A 6 4 2 K J 9 8 5 21. T 9 8 7 6 5 K Q 4 A 3 J 2 K Q J T 8 6 3 2 7 4 A 9 5 5 4 Q A K T 6 2 J 9 8 7 3 K T 3 Q 7 5 A 6 4 2 J 9 8 22. Q T 9 8 6 J A 3 K 7 5 4 2 8 K J T 6 5 2 7 4 A Q 9 3 9 4 Q J 8 7 A K T 6 2 5 3 K Q J 9 7 T 8 A 6 4 2 5 3 23. Q T 9 7 6 5 8 2 A 3 K J 4 - A Q T 9 6 3 7 4 K J 8 5 2 Q 8 J 7 A K T 6 2 9 5 4 3 Q J T 9 5 K 8 3 A 6 4 2 7 24. K J 7 4 Q 9 6 A 3 T 8 5 2 Q J 8 K T 9 6 5 2 7 4 A 3 J 9 7 8 A K T 6 2 Q 5 4 3 K 9 8 Q T 3 A 6 4 2 J 7 5 25. T 9 6 8 5 A 3 K Q J 7 4 2 9 K Q J 6 3 2 7 4 A T 8 5 Q 8 7 4 3 J 5 A K T 6 2 9 Q 9 8 5 J 7 3 A 6 4 2 K T 26. Q 8 6 4 K J A 3 T 9 7 5 2 A J 9 8 6 5 3 2 7 4 K Q T J 9 5 3 Q 7 A K T 6 2 8 4 K Q 9 J T 5 A 6 4 2 8 7 3 27. K T 9 4 J 6 5 A 3 Q 8 7 2 A J K T 9 8 6 2 7 4 Q 5 3 J 8 7 3 Q A K T 6 2 9 5 4 K 9 3 Q J 5 A 6 4 2 T 8 7 28. T 8 5 2 K J 9 A 3 Q 7 6 4 K Q 8 J T 9 6 5 3 7 4 A 2 J 4 5 A K T 6 2 Q 9 8 7 3 J 8 7 5 K Q 3 A 6 4 2 T 9 29. K J 9 8 6 4 5 2 A 3 Q T 7 - A J 8 6 3 2 7 4 K Q T 9 5 J 8 5 Q 7 3 A K T 6 2 9 4 K 8 7 5 J 9 A 6 4 2 Q T 3 30. Q 9 8 7 5 6 2 A 3 K J T 4 5 3 2 A K Q J T 6 7 4 9 8 J 4 3 9 8 7 A K T 6 2 Q 5 J 3 T 7 A 6 4 2 K Q 9 8 5 31. Q J T 9 6 K 5 2 A 3 8 7 4 K 8 Q J 9 5 3 2 7 4 A T 6 J Q 7 5 A K T 6 2 9 8 4 3 K T 9 5 3 7 A 6 4 2 Q J 8 32. K Q J T 9 6 5 8 4 2 A 3 7 T A J 9 5 3 2 7 4 K Q 8 6 9 4 3 7 A K T 6 2 Q J 8 5 Q J K 9 3 A 6 4 2 T 8 7 5 33. J 9 4 2 K 7 5 A 3 Q T 8 6 A K Q J 9 8 6 3 7 4 T 5 2 J 8 5 4 A K T 6 2 Q 9 7 3 K Q T 8 J 9 3 A 6 4 2 7 5 34. K J 8 4 2 Q 7 6 A 3 T 9 5 A T 8 Q J 6 5 3 2 7 4 K 9 Q J 3 8 A K T 6 2 9 7 5 4 7 5 K T 9 A 6 4 2 Q J 8 3 35. K 8 6 5 4 2 Q 7 A 3 J T 9 K Q 8 3 2 A J T 9 6 5 7 4 - - J 8 7 A K T 6 2 Q 9 5 4 3 J 9 T 3 A 6 4 2 K Q 8 7 5 36. K Q T 4 J 9 7 A 3 8 6 5 2 A J T 3 K Q 9 8 5 2 7 4 6 8 7 5 4 A K T 6 2 Q J 9 3 K Q T 7 8 A 6 4 2 J 9 5 3 37. J 9 8 7 6 4 Q T 5 A 3 K 2 Q A K J 9 5 2 7 4 T 8 6 3 Q J 3 7 5 A K T 6 2 9 8 4 Q 9 3 T 5 A 6 4 2 K J 8 7 38. K 8 5 4 Q 6 2 A 3 J T 9 7 2 A J T 6 5 3 7 4 K Q 9 8 Q J 5 3 7 4 A K T 6 2 9 8 K T 9 3 Q 5 A 6 4 2 J 8 7 39. J T 9 8 7 6 2 A 3 K Q 5 4 Q 6 3 K T 9 8 5 2 7 4 A J Q 9 8 7 4 3 A K T 6 2 J 5 3 K Q 8 A 6 4 2 J T 9 7 5 40. J T 9 7 6 2 K Q A 3 8 5 4 3 Q T 9 8 5 2 7 4 A K J 6 7 4 9 5 3 A K T 6 2 Q J 8 K T 9 7 Q J A 6 4 2 8 5 3 41. K Q T 5 2 7 A 3 J 9 8 6 4 A Q T 5 K J 9 8 6 3 7 4 2 J 3 Q 5 4 A K T 6 2 9 8 7 Q 9 J T 8 A 6 4 2 K 7 5 3 42. K Q T 4 J 9 5 A 3 8 7 6 2 8 3 K Q T 6 5 2 7 4 A J 9 9 7 4 3 Q A K T 6 2 J 8 5 J T 9 Q 5 3 A 6 4 2 K 8 7 43. Q J T 7 K 9 2 A 3 8 6 5 4 A K Q 9 8 5 3 7 4 J T 6 2 Q J 5 4 3 7 A K T 6 2 9 8 J 5 3 T 9 8 A 6 4 2 K Q 7 44. J 8 6 5 Q 9 4 A 3 K T 7 2 2 A Q T 9 6 5 7 4 K J 8 3 9 8 4 J 7 3 A K T 6 2 Q 5 Q J 9 8 3 5 A 6 4 2 K T 7 45. 9 T 7 4 A 3 K Q J 8 6 5 2 9 3 A K T 8 6 2 7 4 Q J 5 9 8 5 4 Q J 3 A K T 6 2 7 Q J T 8 7 5 3 A 6 4 2 K 9 46. K J 9 6 5 T 8 7 A 3 Q 4 2 A T 5 3 K Q 9 8 6 2 7 4 J 9 3 Q 5 A K T 6 2 J 8 7 4 8 5 J 3 A 6 4 2 K Q T 9 7 47. Q 7 5 2 J 8 4 A 3 K T 9 6 A 6 5 K J T 9 8 2 7 4 Q 3 9 8 5 J A K T 6 2 Q 7 4 3 9 8 3 Q T 5 A 6 4 2 K J 7 48. K Q 7 5 2 J T A 3 9 8 6 4 6 A K J T 9 5 7 4 Q 8 3 2 Q J 8 7 9 A K T 6 2 5 4 3 K T 3 J 9 7 5 A 6 4 2 Q 8 49. J 9 7 4 2 T 8 A 3 K Q 6 5 8 5 K Q T 9 6 2 7 4 A J 3 Q 9 7 5 4 J A K T 6 2 8 3 Q K J 5 3 A 6 4 2 T 9 8 7 50. K 8 6 5 J 9 A 3 Q T 7 4 2 9 8 6 K Q J T 5 3 7 4 A 2 5 J 8 4 3 A K T 6 2 Q 9 7 Q J 8 7 3 5 A 6 4 2 K T 9 51. Q 8 7 6 4 2 A 3 K J T 9 5 K J 5 3 A Q T 8 6 2 7 4 9 Q 3 J 9 8 5 4 A K T 6 2 7 9 5 T A 6 4 2 K Q J 8 7 3 52. Q J 9 5 4 2 K 6 A 3 T 8 7 T 8 A Q J 9 5 3 7 4 K 6 2 Q 9 7 8 5 3 A K T 6 2 J 4 T 8 5 3 A 6 4 2 K Q J 9 7 53. K Q J 9 T 7 2 A 3 8 6 5 4 Q 9 8 J T 6 5 3 2 7 4 A K 8 7 9 A K T 6 2 Q J 5 4 3 J 9 7 3 K Q 5 A 6 4 2 T 8 54. K Q 4 2 J 9 8 A 3 T 7 6 5 Q 8 2 A T 9 6 5 3 7 4 K J Q 9 7 J 8 5 A K T 6 2 4 3 K T 8 3 A 6 4 2 Q J 9 7 5 55. Q 8 7 2 T 9 5 A 3 K J 6 4 Q 9 A 8 6 5 3 2 7 4 K J T Q J 9 8 3 - A K T 6 2 7 5 4 K 9 Q J 8 5 A 6 4 2 T 7 3 56. K Q T 5 6 4 2 A 3 J 9 8 7 J A K T 9 5 2 7 4 Q 8 6 3 J 9 8 7 4 5 3 A K T 6 2 Q J 9 8 Q 5 A 6 4 2 K T 7 3 57. Q T 9 7 2 J A 3 K 8 6 5 4 K J 8 A Q T 6 3 2 7 4 9 5 3 8 7 4 A K T 6 2 Q J 9 5 K T 8 5 Q J 7 A 6 4 2 9 3 58. J 8 6 5 4 K 7 2 A 3 Q T 9 K 9 5 A Q T 6 3 2 7 4 J 8 Q 8 7 9 A K T 6 2 J 5 4 3 T 3 9 8 7 A 6 4 2 K Q J 5 59. 8 6 5 4 9 2 A 3 K Q J T 7 K 8 6 5 A J T 9 3 2 7 4 Q 9 7 4 Q 8 A K T 6 2 J 5 3 J 9 Q 8 7 A 6 4 2 K T 5 3 60. Q J 9 8 5 2 K A 3 T 7 6 4 A T 9 Q J 8 5 3 2 7 4 K 6 9 J 8 7 5 3 A K T 6 2 Q 4 Q T 5 7 A 6 4 2 K J 9 8 3 61. 9 7 K 2 A 3 Q J T 8 6 5 4 Q 9 K T 8 6 5 3 7 4 A J 2 Q 9 8 5 J 7 4 A K T 6 2 3 K 8 7 5 3 Q 9 A 6 4 2 J T 62. T 6 4 2 Q 8 A 3 K J 9 7 5 Q J 9 6 A T 8 5 3 2 7 4 K J 5 4 3 Q A K T 6 2 9 8 7 5 T 9 8 7 A 6 4 2 K Q J 3 63. J T 2 7 4 A 3 K Q 9 8 6 5 K 9 Q J T 5 3 2 7 4 A 8 6 J 9 8 5 4 Q 3 A K T 6 2 7 7 5 3 K T 9 A 6 4 2 Q J 8 64. K J 8 7 6 Q 4 A 3 T 9 5 2 - A J 9 6 5 3 7 4 K Q T 8 2 8 3 J 9 7 A K T 6 2 Q 5 4 K Q 9 8 7 5 J T A 6 4 2 3 65. Q 9 7 6 2 T 5 A 3 K J 8 4 8 2 K Q J T 9 5 7 4 A 6 3 J 9 8 5 7 A K T 6 2 Q 4 3 K T J 9 5 3 A 6 4 2 Q 8 7 66. Q J 7 4 9 8 A 3 K T 6 5 2 A K 3 Q J T 8 5 2 7 4 9 6 9 8 7 J 4 A K T 6 2 Q 5 3 J 7 5 K Q 9 A 6 4 2 T 8 3 67. K J T 9 8 5 7 6 2 A 3 Q 4 Q T A K J 9 8 5 7 4 6 3 2 J 8 7 4 9 3 A K T 6 2 Q 5 5 Q 7 A 6 4 2 K J T 9 8 3 68. K 7 T 4 2 A 3 Q J 9 8 6 5 Q 2 A K J 9 6 3 7 4 T 8 5 Q J 9 7 4 8 3 A K T 6 2 5 J T 9 3 7 5 A 6 4 2 K Q 8 69. K Q 5 9 8 A 3 J T 7 6 4 2 T 9 A K J 6 5 2 7 4 Q 8 3 Q J 9 7 5 4 3 A K T 6 2 8 Q J 9 8 5 7 A 6 4 2 K T 3 70. K J 9 7 2 T 8 6 A 3 Q 5 4 6 5 K Q J 9 8 2 7 4 A T 3 8 J 9 4 A K T 6 2 Q 7 5 3 J 9 8 7 3 K A 6 4 2 Q T 5 71. K T 7 6 4 2 J 9 5 A 3 Q 8 5 2 A Q J T 6 3 7 4 K 9 8 7 3 8 A K T 6 2 Q J 9 5 4 Q J 9 T 8 5 A 6 4 2 K 7 3 72. J T 8 6 4 2 Q 7 A 3 K 9 5 A K 9 8 6 5 3 2 7 4 Q J T 9 5 4 J A K T 6 2 Q 8 7 3 5 3 K T 9 7 A 6 4 2 Q J 8 73. J 9 8 5 Q 6 A 3 K T 7 4 2 K Q J T 9 8 5 2 7 4 A 6 3 Q 4 3 7 5 A K T 6 2 J 9 8 8 7 5 3 K Q 9 A 6 4 2 J T 74. 9 6 Q 7 A 3 K J T 8 5 4 2 A 3 K T 9 8 5 2 7 4 Q J 6 J 8 7 Q 9 5 3 A K T 6 2 4 K Q J T 8 7 9 A 6 4 2 5 3 75. Q 7 5 2 9 8 A 3 K J T 6 4 A Q 6 2 K J 9 8 5 3 7 4 T 9 8 3 Q J A K T 6 2 7 5 4 T 8 Q 9 5 A 6 4 2 K J 7 3 76. T 9 8 7 6 2 K 5 4 A 3 Q J J 9 K T 8 6 5 3 7 4 A Q 2 7 4 J 3 A K T 6 2 Q 9 8 5 K J T 9 3 A 6 4 2 Q 8 7 5 77. Q J 8 T 7 2 A 3 K 9 6 5 4 J 9 5 A Q T 8 6 3 7 4 K 2 9 8 5 J A K T 6 2 Q 7 4 3 J T 8 3 Q 7 5 A 6 4 2 K 9 78. Q J T 7 5 A 3 K 9 8 6 4 2 K Q J 3 A 9 8 6 5 2 7 4 T J 3 5 4 A K T 6 2 Q 9 8 7 T 9 8 K J 7 5 A 6 4 2 Q 3 79. Q T 7 4 2 K 6 A 3 J 9 8 5 A K 9 2 Q J T 8 6 5 7 4 3 J 7 Q 9 8 5 A K T 6 2 4 3 K 8 J A 6 4 2 Q T 9 7 5 3 80. J T 7 4 8 A 3 K Q 9 6 5 2 A J 8 K Q T 9 6 3 7 4 5 2 J Q 8 3 A K T 6 2 9 7 5 4 K T 9 5 3 Q J 7 A 6 4 2 8 81. K J T 9 6 Q A 3 8 7 5 4 2 6 2 A Q J 9 8 5 7 4 K T 3 J 7 3 8 5 4 A K T 6 2 Q 9 K T 3 8 7 5 A 6 4 2 Q J 9 82. K T 9 5 8 6 A 3 Q J 7 4 2 A K Q J T 9 8 2 7 4 6 5 3 J 8 5 4 9 7 A K T 6 2 Q 3 K 8 3 Q J 9 A 6 4 2 T 7 5 83. K Q T 5 4 8 7 A 3 J 9 6 2 9 6 5 2 A K J T 8 3 7 4 Q 9 8 5 4 3 A K T 6 2 Q J 7 T 3 J 8 A 6 4 2 K Q 9 7 5 84. Q T 9 6 4 2 J 7 A 3 K 8 5 6 5 A Q J 8 3 2 7 4 K T 9 J 9 4 3 A K T 6 2 Q 8 7 5 K J 9 8 T 3 A 6 4 2 Q 7 5 85. K 7 2 T 6 A 3 Q J 9 8 5 4 A 9 6 K Q J T 3 2 7 4 8 5 Q 7 5 J 9 8 A K T 6 2 4 3 J 8 7 3 Q 9 A 6 4 2 K T 5 86. K J 9 8 7 2 A 3 Q T 6 5 4 Q J 8 A K T 6 5 3 7 4 9 2 J 5 Q 8 A K T 6 2 9 7 4 3 K T 9 3 J 7 5 A 6 4 2 Q 8 87. Q J 6 5 4 K T A 3 9 8 7 2 A 8 5 K Q T 9 6 3 7 4 J 2 9 8 5 J 4 A K T 6 2 Q 7 3 Q 8 J T 7 A 6 4 2 K 9 5 3 88. T 5 2 Q 6 A 3 K J 9 8 7 4 K Q J T 9 8 2 7 4 A 6 5 3 J 9 7 5 Q 8 3 A K T 6 2 4 K Q T 8 5 9 7 A 6 4 2 J 3 89. K Q T 6 5 4 A 3 J 9 8 7 2 K Q 2 A J 9 6 5 3 7 4 T 8 9 8 Q J 7 5 3 A K T 6 2 4 K T 9 7 A 6 4 2 Q J 8 5 3 90. K Q 7 9 8 4 A 3 J T 6 5 2 3 A Q J T 6 5 7 4 K 9 8 2 8 7 5 4 Q 9 3 A K T 6 2 J K Q 9 8 5 T A 6 4 2 J 7 3 91. K Q 9 6 5 4 T 7 2 A 3 J 8 Q 9 3 A K J 8 6 2 7 4 T 5 Q 7 J 8 3 A K T 6 2 9 5 4 8 7 T A 6 4 2 K Q J 9 5 3 92. K Q 6 2 T 9 5 A 3 J 8 7 4 6 2 K Q J 9 5 3 7 4 A T 8 Q J 9 7 5 4 3 A K T 6 2 8 J Q 9 3 A 6 4 2 K T 8 7 5 93. Q J T 8 5 K 6 4 A 3 9 7 2 J T 9 3 A Q 8 6 5 2 7 4 K J 3 8 5 A K T 6 2 Q 9 7 4 T 8 9 5 A 6 4 2 K Q J 7 3 94. T 8 7 2 9 6 4 A 3 K Q J 5 A 3 2 K Q J 9 8 5 7 4 T 6 Q 8 J 9 5 A K T 6 2 7 4 3 J 9 8 5 3 A 6 4 2 K Q T 7 95. J 9 6 2 Q 8 4 A 3 K T 7 5 K Q A J 9 5 3 2 7 4 T 8 6 Q 7 5 3 A K T 6 2 J 9 8 4 K Q 8 5 3 T 7 A 6 4 2 J 9 96. K Q T 9 6 8 A 3 J 7 5 4 2 J 8 2 A K Q T 5 3 7 4 9 6 Q 8 7 3 A K T 6 2 J 9 5 4 K Q J T 7 5 3 A 6 4 2 9 8 97. K Q 8 5 7 4 A 3 J T 9 6 2 K Q T A 9 8 5 3 2 7 4 J 6 J 7 3 9 8 A K T 6 2 Q 5 4 J 7 5 K 9 3 A 6 4 2 Q T 8 98. J 6 5 K T 8 A 3 Q 9 7 4 2 A 9 8 5 K Q J 6 3 2 7 4 T 9 5 3 8 7 A K T 6 2 Q J 4 K 8 3 J T A 6 4 2 Q 9 7 5 99. K J 8 7 6 4 T 5 A 3 Q 9 2 K 3 A Q J 9 8 2 7 4 T 6 5 J 8 7 5 Q A K T 6 2 9 4 3 J T 8 5 3 A 6 4 2 K Q 9 7 100. 9 8 4 Q T A 3 K J 7 6 5 2 A Q 6 K J T 9 8 2 7 4 5 3 J 8 4 Q 7 A K T 6 2 9 5 3 K T 8 7 Q 9 5 A 6 4 2 J 3 Generated 4074 hands Produced 100 hands Initial random seed 1608121362 Time needed 0.004 sec are 100 deals using predeal south SA3,H74,DAKT62,CA642 condition hcp(east)>=6 and hcp(east)<=10 and hearts(east)==6 and spades(east)<4 produce 100 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagles123 Posted December 16, 2020 Report Share Posted December 16, 2020 I'm surprised at the vote, I would pass in a flash and don't consider it all that close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas43 Posted December 16, 2020 Report Share Posted December 16, 2020 Nobody likes these decisions, It's why weak two's are effective. If this hand's partner has the second hand shown, then a 3D overcall is a good route to the 6D contract. If it's over us, then we've just got to hope that we can scramble to our (10?) card club fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gszes Posted December 19, 2020 Report Share Posted December 19, 2020 I dealt it in practice so it could have been either, I thought it was an interesting problem. Btw have you discussed how forcing 2♥-P-P-2♠-P-3♦ is ? As an aside, I play very wide ranging weak 2s (although this one was perfectly normal) and we make most of our gains when people overcall 3♦ on hands like these. Either partner has the hand and doubles or they play 3♦ going off when 2♠/3♣ is the right spot. FWIW the belated 3d bid would be strongly suggestive but also spade discouraging so I would not make that bid with this hand but go to 3h which is primarily asking for a heart stop for 3n purposes (the inference being I have a long suit and a good hand but one that I could not x with nor feel safe to overcall). I admit that will get me too high sometimes but it is worth small losses sometimes to give us the best chance at being in the right strain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberyeti Posted December 19, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 19, 2020 FWIW the belated 3d bid would be strongly suggestive but also spade discouraging so I would not make that bid with this hand but go to 3h which is primarily asking for a heart stop for 3n purposes (the inference being I have a long suit and a good hand but one that I could not x with nor feel safe to overcall). I admit that will get me too high sometimes but it is worth small losses sometimes to give us the best chance at being in the right strain. I will be discussing this with my partner, our meta agreements suggest 3♦ would be forcing and 3♥ would be a good spade raise. I'm not sure what a delayed 2N does or should mean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidKok Posted December 19, 2020 Report Share Posted December 19, 2020 (2♥)-P-(P)-2♠; (P)-? I think it is unwise to play 3♦ in this position as forcing. Partner may have balanced on a mediocre hand, and your failure to overcall on the first round limits your own holding. It is very plausible neither of you have opening strength. Personally I play 2NT 9-11 balanced with a solid heart stopper (typically KJx or better, although sometimes you have to pick the smallest lie) and typically at most 2 spades, 3♣/3♦ as natural NF and 3♥ as a limit raise or stronger in spades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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