Badmonster Posted May 30, 2005 Report Share Posted May 30, 2005 Most people play weak twos. My problem is, they don't seem to be playing the way I learned it. It was my understanding that if you respond with 2n they are required to respond with a feature, or a rebid, if they have no feature. However, more people I encounter pass my 2n, which ends badly. What is considered standard over 2n? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted May 30, 2005 Report Share Posted May 30, 2005 Feature, shortage, Ogust (suit quality and range). Some play that you must have a maximum in order to show a feature. Passing 2NT is not on option in standard responses to a weak two. The only bid that should be non forcing is raising the opening suit to the 3-level, also known as RONF = Raise Only Non Forcing. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted May 30, 2005 Report Share Posted May 30, 2005 something that's worked out nicely for me is 'defined' ogust... it depends on your weak 2 range... using 3-9 after 2any : 2nt: 3c=3-5, 1 honor in the suit3d=3-5, 2 honors3h=6-9, 1 honor3s=6-9, 2 honors3nt=top 3 honors Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted May 30, 2005 Report Share Posted May 30, 2005 3-9 is a range too wide for me. 5-9 makes it a lot easier. By the way, you may consider playing 2♦ (Multi) as weak weak with either major (can even be 5 cards). Then 2MA are always constructive. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badmonster Posted May 30, 2005 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2005 Is it necessary to play ogust? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted May 30, 2005 Report Share Posted May 30, 2005 No. I mentioned feature or shortage. That will work equally well. Some hands are best suited for Ogust, some for feature and some for shortage. You can't get it all. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P_Marlowe Posted May 30, 2005 Report Share Posted May 30, 2005 Is it necessary to play ogust? Hi, if your weak 2's are crap, and wide ranging regarding suit quality,you need to play Ogust, because in this case your partner sometimesneeds to know about the quality of your suit. In this case it makes also sense, to play new suits as nonforcing. If your suit quality always satifies certain criterias, you do not need to play Ogust.In this case it makes not really sense, to play new suits as nonforcing. With kind regardsMarlowe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted May 30, 2005 Report Share Posted May 30, 2005 3-9 is a range too wide for me. 5-9 makes it a lot easier. By the way, you may consider playing 2♦ (Multi) as weak weak with either major (can even be 5 cards). Then 2MA are always constructive. Roland i agree, it is maybe too wide... the good thing about ogust is, it's sometimes helpful in deciding whether or not to play nt... 'course the same can be said for feature ask Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigpenz Posted May 31, 2005 Report Share Posted May 31, 2005 anymore weak twos have turned into crap shoot. Originally were contructive to getting to 3NT or 4 of a major....but some have become so destructive that partner cant even make an intelligent deciscion anymore :) Now I am talking about 1st and 2nd seat openings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted May 31, 2005 Report Share Posted May 31, 2005 anymore weak twos have turned into crap shoot. Originally were contructive to getting to 3NT or 4 of a major....but some have become so destructive that partner cant even make an intelligent deciscion anymore :) Now I am talking about 1st and 2nd seat openings. For a completely different take; in first and second seat think about not opening weak 2 bids with a side A or K or (poor suits, (unless Fav.)). Try it and see if you are happy with results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reisig Posted May 31, 2005 Report Share Posted May 31, 2005 The opening weak 2 bidder is NOT the captain of the team ..the responder is. So, when responder asks a question (whatever is requested)...you WILL answer. Passing 2N is like passing a Stayman bid (2♣) with a minimum NT and 5♣. Nobody has asked your opinion! Just try to remember what 2N asks ..feature, shortness, Ogust, etc. and nod and show what's asked. My experience is that opening terrible WEAK 2's opposite an unpassed partner leads to .....a new partner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted June 1, 2005 Report Share Posted June 1, 2005 wayne (cascade) is teaching on this on bbo in 12 minutes, if you're a member of the bil club... better hurry :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigpenz Posted June 1, 2005 Report Share Posted June 1, 2005 For a completely different take; in first and second seat think about not opening weak 2 bids with a side A or K or (poor suits, (unless Fav.)). Try it and see if you are happy with results. yes i have tried it different ways, but the question is when people play this way they should let the opponents know that their methods are destructive or constructive. Its great to put the opponents to the guess but when partner gets caught in it too, thats not good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chamaco Posted June 7, 2005 Report Share Posted June 7, 2005 No. I mentioned feature or shortage. That will work equally well. Some hands are best suited for Ogust, some for feature and some for shortage. You can't get it all. Roland Some people play that responder may use:- 2NT as feature ask- 3C as either "Ogust" or asking for shortness, or even asking for losers Basically, responder would commonly use 2NT with a 3NT-oriented hand, and 3C with a suit-oriented hand. This gives up the "natural" 3C response (when is the last time you used it ? :o ), but does allow responder to use 2 different useful tools :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double ! Posted June 8, 2005 Report Share Posted June 8, 2005 ahafeature-ogusthow well does it work?and, do the benefits of RONF out-weight the liabilities? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chamaco Posted June 8, 2005 Report Share Posted June 8, 2005 ahafeature-ogusthow well does it work? It works ok.Nothing spectacular, I have to say, so far I never won or lost a board because of this agreement. I never regretted the "natural" 3C bid either, so far. So I think it's just a matter of tastes. and, do the benefits of RONF out-weight the liabilities? If using "normal" weak 2s, I think RONF works well. If using Fantoni-Nunes or EHAA or Ekren weak 2s, alternatives to RONF seem worth investigating, IMO. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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