Evaluation

[FelicityR]

Competing in a small IMPs (3 table) match at our club, playing basic 4M Acol and a weak NT, no light openers in 1st position, what do you feel is the right bid here, and would it make any difference if you were playing MPs.

 

(N.B.) Partner does not open 1NT with 5♣ 4M, and cannot be 4414 shape (as he would have rebid 1♥). A 1NT rebid by opener in Acol would show 15-16 though the emphasis is finding a fit as opposed to rebidding generally to show HCPs.

 

[hv=pc=n&s=sj9hkt8dk98764ck6&d=n&v=b&b=13&a=1cp1dp1sp]133|200[/hv]

 

And, as always, thank you for your replies.

[Cyberyeti]

Is 2♥ F1 or FG ? I evaluated this as 11, K&R said 10.95.

 

I can bid 2♦ as constructive here or 2♥ F1 but without those options marginally prefer 2N to 1N

[eagles123]

1N for me

[Cyberyeti]

1N for me

 

More inclined to do that at MPs

 

Q10xx, Qx, QJ, Axxxx is a really horrible opening bid but likely to make game (admittedly if you bid 2N you play there), there are better opening bids that fit much less well, but at teams I think I want to be there opposite many 13 counts and most 14s so 2N for me if I don't have other options.

[Tramticket]

2NT. The king of cubs will often be an imporrant card.

[FelicityR]

Is 2♥ F1 or FG ? I evaluated this as 11, K&R said 10.95.

 

I can bid 2♦ as constructive here or 2♥ F1 but without those options marginally prefer 2N to 1N

 

We play 2♥ FSF as GF here though having 2♥ as only a F1 on this hand may make life easier - that's what I felt initially - but obviously you can't have both.

 

Though I wasn't entirely sure whether a 3♦ rebid here was invitational or forcing, as you have FSF (2♥) followed by 3♦ as a GF option.

[gszes]

went with 2n at MP since minors rarely score well and the lighter p opens the less inclined I am to uptick this hand further. IMPS 3d We still have many places to play and the minors are not the pariah they are at MP. we warn p of the invitational nature of our hand (we had a 2h fsf available) AND our long suit so they know to steer clear of game (most of the time) when they do not fit us well.

[HeavyDluxe]

2NT for me... I'll bid my hand and expect partner to figure out their own. :)

 

I should note that I don't play enough MPs to get really strategic about bidding differences. So, take that with more than a grain of salt.

[msjennifer]

MADAM/SIR, The points are useful ones and the 10 of hearts may be the key.My bid at both MP AND IMP is 2NT.

[nekthen]

More inclined to do that at MPs

 

Q10xx, Qx, QJ, Axxxx is a really horrible opening bid but likely to make game (admittedly if you bid 2N you play there), there are better opening bids that fit much less well, but at teams I think I want to be there opposite many 13 counts and most 14s so 2N for me if I don't have other options.

 

So many times the result is either 2N +1 or 2N-1. If you can set up diamonds you make 3 and if opps can take 4 heart tricks first you may go down.

So at imps I bid 3N. I only need to be right about 30% of the time.

 

Ideally, you play xyz, in which case, you can show an invitational hand with 2♣ partner 2♦ and you 3♦

 

I think also that there is a case for treating this hand (vul) as a weak jump shift and bidding 2♦ instead of 1♦

[rhm]

2♦ for me, particularly at MP.

 

If opener is minimum he is unbalanced, very likely short in diamonds. At best opener will have a doubleton in both red suits

If opener has more and support for diamonds (Hx is sufficient) he should raise, since a 2♦ rebid is wide ranging.

If opener passes 2♦ how likely is it that 3NT is a good contract?

 

Q10xx, Qx, QJ, Axxxx is a really horrible opening bid but likely to make game (admittedly if you bid 2N you play there), there are better opening bids that fit much less well, but at teams I think I want to be there opposite many 13 counts and most 14s so 2N for me if I don't have other options.

Playing weak notrumps with Q10xx, Qx, QJ, Axxxx the only opening I can stomach is a weak notrump, even if you do have the agreement that 5422 is generally not considered balanced.

 

Rainer Herrmann

[FelicityR]

This is the actual hand.

 

[hv=pc=n&s=sj9hkt8dk98764ck6&w=sq8h96532da5cj942&n=sak42h7dqj2caq853&e=st7653haqj4dt3ct7]399|300[/hv]

Additional questions (sorry!)

 

1. Do you think it's easier to find the reasonable 5♦ contract rather than the doomed (on a ♥ lead) 3NT contract if my partner reverses and bids 2♠ rather than 1♠ on the first round? p.s. Do you think the hand is worth a reverse, too?

 

2. If South rebids 2NT on the bidding given (1♣ - 1♦ - 1♠ - 2NT) what do you think North's next bid should be a) 3♦ b) 3NT c) other

[Cyberyeti]

 

2. If South rebids 2NT on the bidding given (1♣ - 1♦ - 1♠ - 2NT) what do you think North's next bid should be a) 3♦ b) 3NT c) other[/b]

 

Isn't 3♥ this hand ?

[nekthen]

This is the actual hand.

 

[hv=pc=n&s=sj9hkt8dk98764ck6&w=sq8h96532da5cj942&n=sak42h7dqj2caq853&e=st7653haqj4dt3ct7]399|300[/hv]

Additional questions (sorry!)

 

1. Do you think it's easier to find the reasonable 5♦ contract rather than the doomed (on a ♥ lead) 3NT contract if my partner reverses and bids 2♠ rather than 1♠ on the first round? p.s. Do you think the hand is worth a reverse, too?

 

2. If South rebids 2NT on the bidding given (1♣ - 1♦ - 1♠ - 2NT) what do you think North's next bid should be a) 3♦ b) 3NT c) other

 

Although the ♦ fit is a bonus, I want more power to bid 2♠. The hand demonstrates what a blunt tool 2N is. 3♦ is not forcing and we want to be in game. Partner may have only 4♦ so what choice do we have but to bid 3N?

 

As I said xyz makes it easy

 

[hv=d=n&v=b&b=13&a=1cp1dp1sp2cp2dp3dp5dppp]133|100[/hv]

[Tramticket]

1. Do you think it's easier to find the reasonable 5♦ contract rather than the doomed (on a ♥ lead) 3NT contract if my partner reverses and bids 2♠ rather than 1♠ on the first round?

 

2♠ is forcing to game. You are quite a bit short of values for this.

[rhm]

This is the actual hand.

 

[hv=pc=n&s=sj9hkt8dk98764ck6&w=sq8h96532da5cj942&n=sak42h7dqj2caq853&e=st7653haqj4dt3ct7]399|300[/hv]

 

1♣--1♦

1♠--2♦

3♥--5♦

 

Simple and easy.

Opener has extra and is distributional and he knows from opponents silence that responder is unlikely to be broke.

If 3♥ is not a splinter I would bid 4♦ with openers hand.

 

Rainer Herrmann

[Cyberyeti]

1♣--1♦

1♠--2♦

3♥--5♦

 

Simple and easy.

Opener has extra and is distributional and he knows from opponents silence that responder is unlikely to be broke.

If 3♥ is not a splinter I would bid 4♦ with openers hand.

 

Rainer Herrmann

 

2♦ is drop dead with no WJS being played in most of the UK, it's how you bid a 6 count not a 10 count.

[pescetom]

2♦ is drop dead with no WJS being played in most of the UK, it's how you bid a 6 count not a 10 count.

 

I see 2♦ as drop dead independent of WJS.

More important I agree with those suggesting XYZ, which resolves this (1♣ 1♦; 1♠ 2♣; 2♦ 3♦; ...) and many other dilemmas.

[rhm]

2♦ is drop dead with no WJS being played in most of the UK, it's how you bid a 6 count not a 10 count.

This is nonsense.

 

It is a hand which ranges from a minimum response to a hand just short of an invititational jump rebid.

Same suit rebid shows a six card in the range between 5-10 HCP

If 4th suit is forcing to game there is often no other way to show such hands.

 

Same suit rebid by responder is not encouraging, but this is not the same as drop dead.

Drop dead bids tend to occur only if opener has strictly limited his hand like after a notrump bid.

 

On the actual layout opener can see that 5♦ might have play opposite KTxxxxx in diamonds and little else.

But opener can only evaluate his hand properly if you rebid your six card suit. 2NT will not do and the suit is not good enough for a jump rebid in diamonds.

If there is no fit you want to stop in 2♦.

 

Rainer Herrmann

[rhm]

deleted

[Cyberyeti]

This is nonsense.

 

It is a hand which ranges from a minimum response to a hand just short of an invititational jump rebid.

Same suit rebid shows a six card in the range between 5-10 HCP

If 4th suit is forcing to game there is often no other way to show such hands.

 

Same suit rebid by responder is not encouraging, but this is not the same as drop dead.

Drop dead bids tend to occur only if opener has strictly limited his hand like after a notrump bid.

 

On the actual layout opener can see that 5♦ might have play opposite KTxxxxx in diamonds and little else.

But opener can only evaluate his hand properly if you rebid your six card suit. 2NT will not do and the suit is not good enough for a jump rebid in diamonds.

If there is no fit you want to stop in 2♦.

 

Rainer Herrmann

 

It's not nonsense at all, don't assume your system is played by Brits, many people here DO NOT play 4SF FG at the 2 level. 2♦ is about 5-8 to many here, either you bid 3♦ with 9-11 and the suit isn't good enough for that or you bid 4SF and follow with 3♦ if you play it NF (which is what we would do).

 

Rebidding 2♦ will attract a pass with many non fitting 15-16s where 3N is good, Axxx, Qx, A, AQxxxx for example (how good is that hand opposite ♦KQJxxx and out).

[GrahamJson]

I prefer a1NT rebid, although I agree 2NT is also reasonable. So how about 1C-1D-1S-1NT-2D-4D-5D or 1C-1D-1S-2NT-3D-4D-5D?

[Tramticket]

I prefer a1NT rebid, although I agree 2NT is also reasonable. So how about 1C-1D-1S-1NT-2D-4D-5D or 1C-1D-1S-2NT-3D-4D-5D?

 

The second of these auctions is interesting. What does the 3♦ bid show?

 

 

3♦ is not forcing and we want to be in game.

 

Nethken certainly thinks it non-forcing. I tend to agree in Acol, but I can't see that it is particularly usefeul to have a non-forcing 3♦ and maybe it should be forcing?

 

 

Isn't 3♥ this hand ?

 

If 3♦ is non-forcing, Cyberyeti suggests that we should bid 3♥ with this hand. Acol can be very fuzzy about these bids of the fourth suit. I'm not sure that it necessarily shows diamond support, but rather a general force and probably doubt about the heart suit for no trump purposes. This might imply some diamonds, but I don't think this is guaranteed.

[P_Marlowe]

1NT, showing 6-10.

 

For any upgrading feature you may detect, the weak suit should be enough to

cancel those feature, it is a 6 carder, but that is all.

But obviously 2NT is an alternative.

 

In a weak NT context I want my 25HCP for being in 3NT.

 

With Kind regards

Marlowe

[P_Marlowe]

Addon Question:

 

#1 I dont understand the "reverse", a 2S bid instead of 1S is game forcing, which is a bit much facing a mere 6 Count.

A possible follow up after 1NT is 2D, this showes the shape and additional values, and will give you the Chance to get to 5D.

2D gets more interesting, if you regular bid 1H with 44 in the reds, since now it is quite likely that you have 5+ Diamonds,

or 3+ Clubs.

 

#2 After a 2NT rebid, 3D is again an Option showing the shape, …, it may be a bit murky … but I dont think it makes sense to Play 3D

as NF, you dont have a sure Diamond fit, and playing 4C instead of 2NT ( or 3D in 7 Card trump fit ) Looks a bit questionable.

 

With Kind regards

Marlowe