ATB new partnership missed nearly 100% slam

[P_Marlowe]

It's certainly not standard. Indeed, why would anyone play an agreement that doesn't allow South to cooperate with a slam try, and that doesn't allow South to show useful values in partner's likely side suit? Even the most religious first-round control bidder should show some flexibility here.

I think it makes a lot of sense to play 5C as some kind of Last Train, in major suit auctions, if there is only one cue bid possible, before bypassing

game, this is quite common, and you can certainly apply and extend this agreement to minor suit auctions.

[neilkaz]

I can see why South doesn't like his hand opposite N's splinter and cue, but if he decides he's will to try slam opposite 2 aces, then 4NT on the way to 5♦ is indicated.

[miamijd]

22 HCP slams generally aren't easy to reach. I think you can get to this one with some logic, but it's not a lock.

 

After 4S, what does South know?

 

1. North is interested in slam (else he would have bid 5D)

2. North has either a stiff As or else a void spade

3. North has good diamonds (South could just have Kxxx, and North just said he had slam intentions)

 

So no spade losers, one heart loser, no diamond losers. We need to find out if North has the club Ace, but unfortunately, there is no good way to do that. If you bid 5C, partner is likely to bid 5D, because he'll think you're looking for a heart control. And key-card won't tell us which black Ace partner has.

 

But do you really think North would go slamming if he were totally blank in clubs and had a stiff As and/or heart values instead? I kinda doubt it, don't you? So I think North has a spade void, AQd and Ac, in which case 6D ought to be gin.

 

That would be my call over 4S.

 

Cheers,

Mike

[fourdad]

My remark was connected to bidding 4N and getting a 2 ace response, which he doesn't get with that.

and why is 5C not an option over 4H?

[croquetfan]

South should probably bid the 6D but north cued spades. He needs to let partner know about the CA rather than cue spades again.

[Jinksy]

FWIW I posted south as a single-hand problem on bridgewinners, and 70% of the votes were for S signing off immediately in 5!D, including Phil Clayton's, the strongest player I know of to have voted in the poll:

 

https://bridgewinners.com/article/view/bidding-problem-2-6io0rdymql/

[cherdano]

What more is North looking for and how much worse could our hand be? I guess that it is possible to construct KJT4 K 7542 KQT4?

Here is just one example. Say mdgraham's memory is right and North actually had - xxx AJT9xx Axxx. Now our actual hand makes slam cold barring a 5-0 club break, but with KJT x KQxxx Kxxx it'd have no chance.

[cherdano]

FWIW I posted south as a single-hand problem on bridgewinners, and 70% of the votes were for S signing off immediately in 5!D, including Phil Clayton's, the strongest player I know of to have voted in the poll:

 

https://bridgewinners.com/article/view/bidding-problem-2-6io0rdymql/

 

This is very rare, but this is a case where I have no problem claiming that the BW majority is wrong. This is obviously a hand where the immediate reaction is to bid 5♦, but once you think about possible hands for partner, you realise how much useful stuff we have for partner, and how little more (beyond what he has already promised) we need from him.

[mikeh]

This entire thread shows why bidding is so difficult for most people. We all tend to evaluate our hand early and often allow that initial evaluation to colour how we see the hand later, even though all good players know that they are supposed to re-evaluate with every round of bidding. It is especially difficult, in my view, to change one's mind a second time.

 

Here, opener had a minimum opening bid, so was already inclined to be conservative in later action as of the decision to open.

 

The Michaels bid warns that the spade holding is of little use...a signal to downgrade. The splinter doesn't help much, since the splinter will usually be a stiff rather than a void. However, imo it should be gf: trying to land in 4m on this auction is threading too fine a needle for me.

 

The 4H call actually helps our hand, a bit. We have a stiff heart, partner has, we assume, a stiff spade. So what do his minors look like?

 

Possession of both Aces, along with 5 diamonds, makes 5D a good spot. The only opp who can have long clubs is RHO so we can never lose a club trick opposite, say, x Kxx Axxxx Axxx, which, you will note, is a borderline gf (or worse!) and has the wasted heart King.

 

So I think the first failure of imagination by South was the pass over 4H. Now, that was surely a forcing pass, but does South really want to defend? The opponents clearly have 9 spades (assuming north has a stiff) and one has to think that they probably have at least 9 hearts, else they'd play in spades. So partner, inferentially, has the 1=3=5=4 hand, or better, and while they probably can't make 4H if partner doubles, I'd be betting that we can make 5D. Having said that, I can't see this hand as good enough to pass and pull: so I think we ought to bid 5D.

 

North would surely tack on the 6th, since South cannot have 2 heart losers and bid 5D.

 

However, let's give South the right to pass 4H. Now North makes a slam try, announcing the spade void.

 

I think it obvious that if I think South should bid 5D opposite a presumed spade loser, then he should bid slam opposite a void.

 

The problem is that we tend to get mentally lazy, especially when our values are superficially soft. My wife and I are working hard on a partnership (I am a horrible partner for her, in the past at least, and so we have rarely played). We are practicing, in part, by my generating hands and bidding them. I continually ask her, on almost all rounds of the bidding: 'what's going on?'

 

Most players, in my experience, tend not to listen attentively to what both partner and the opps are telling them. In fairness, many players don't bid very well so it can be dangerous to draw inferences. Deducing that one's soft hand has grown up enormously requires faith in partner's bidding, and the courage not merely to draw inferences but also to base one's actions on the inferences.

 

Bidding 6D here would make most players nervous, especially in a new partnership, but it would reflect the sort of trust that one would like to have in a good partner.

[msjennifer]

Sir,we as SOUTH bid as follows over RHOs 4H bid.DOUBLE shows first round control.PASS shows a second round control and 5D as not having even a second round control in H.

[msjennifer]

Sir,we as SOUTH bid as follows over RHOs 4H bid.DOUBLE shows first round control.PASS shows a second round control and 5D as not having even a second round control in H.