Now suddenly worth a game force?

[helene_t]

Bizare overbid. Or did my pass somehow show values?

 

http://tinyurl.com/yau7banw

[DozyDom]

I wasn't aware forcing 3!S bids were forcing to game when you have a 9-card minor fit. Your pass doesn't show extra values, but 3NT certainly does.

 

N has a singleton and 5-card support for your suit; why should it be reluctant to get to the 4-level?

[helene_t]

I wasn't aware forcing 3!S bids were forcing to game when you have a 9-card minor fit. Your pass doesn't show extra values, but 3NT certainly does.

 

N has a singleton and 5-card support for your suit; why should it be reluctant to get to the 4-level?

Thanks, that makes sense.

 

South could have KQxx-Axxx-xxx-KJ, although I suppose it is unlikely given opps' bidding. So I would think 3♦ would be plenty. But presumably the sims show that 5♦ could make if South has a suitable hand.

[steve2005]

Give Helene a break.

Helen passed with 14 hcp. Helene could easily have a 11 hcp hand in 3rd seat even with 3♦ occasionally.

The four level isn't going to be safe opposite 12 hcp either. <edit> and pass already says there is no realistic chance for game.</edit>

The actual hand 14 hcp has 4 top losers in 4♦.

After a pass by Helene forcing to 4-level the question is why?

Opposite a pass 5♦ seems unlikely.

3NT will take a perfect hand. opposite 8 hcp.

After pass by Helene 3♦ is plenty.

[smerriman]

Yeah, GIB's definitely at fault on this one. In many occasions, it doesn't put a limit on passes - sometimes this is correct (eg you can still have a strong hand when passing after an overcall), but here it's not (the description for pass shows up to 21 points).

 

Additionally, the descriptions for 3♦ and 3♠ both show 5+ diamonds and exactly 10 total points. This isn't a simulation bid; it just doesn't know how to choose from the bids it has. There is no reason to force to 4♦ when you can simply bid 3♦.