BPO-001-E

[inquiry]

[hv=d=w&v=n&s=s6542h62daq6cat43]133|100|Scoring: IMP

BPO-001-E

West North East South

   1♠    2♠    Pass   ?

 

Of course, 2♠ is Michaels cue-bid in BBO-Advanced.

[/hv]

[hrothgar]

2NT.

 

Isn't this hand the reason that sane people play good/bad Michaels? I have a wonderful hand for partner. Give him the expected 1=5=5=2 with a couple red suit Kings and my first round controls make for a powerful offensive holding. At the same time, I'm unwilling to try for a perfect 5m with 18 HCP... Preempting with a pass or correct 4C is a losing proposition. My Spade length makes it less likely that the opponents can compete in Spades. 4C will hopelessly jam our own constructive auctions if partner has the strong hand type (if partner has a storng hand, slam is a possibility)

[mike777]

2NT

 

EXPECTING OUR FIRST UNANIMOUS POLL ANSWER.

 

With strong P does not rebid minor at 3 level but shows major. Assume this is standard but look forward to other methods.

[luke warm]

2nt also

[pclayton]

2N - but those that think this is an easy hand are kidding themselves.

 

Wouldn't I also bid 2N on: xxxxx, xx, xxx, xxx? If so, partner can't get too excited even with the strong variety of Michaels. So I'll know partner's minor, but won't have a clue to his strength, unless he has a mountain and doesn't bid 3 of a minor.

 

Much better to play 2N to clarify partner's hand (3♣ / 3♦ = weak, 3♥ / 3♠ = strong with corresponding minor) and minor and 3♣ as pass / correct.

[Free]

3♣ P/C

[jillybean]

3♣ - 2nt would confuse both me and my p ;)

[Fluffy]

I voted for 3♣ but I don't really see the difference with 2NT, except the fact that you give LHO 2 options to bid. Those of you who have talked about this situation, what is the difference between them?

 

Now I think a bit on it, it seems like similar to multi, you could bid 2NT with verylong club hoping to have another bid, while you could do the same with 3♣ if you held ♦. Therefore 2NT should show better ♣ than ♦ when you were weak.

[HeartA]

Wow, I am the only one voting for 3♠.

[awm]

Of the poll questions, this seems like the one that's closest to being a question about system rather than judgement. It seems like there are two popular treatments:

 

(1) 3♣ is pass/correct to play in partner's minor. 2NT is some sort of asking bid for strength.

 

(2) 2NT is asking for partner's minor. 3♣ is natural and suggests playing there.

 

I voted for 2NT, since I believe (2) is more standard. Also, it may be reasonable to push on to five of a minor with this hand, especially if partner's minor is clubs and he has a non-minimum. If 2NT is asking strength/shape then I can bid on opposite a max, and if 2NT is just a minor ask I can raise 3♣ from partner to 4♣.

[Guest Jlall]

Fluffy: what if you are not weak? Do you really want to play 3C if partner has hearts and clubs? game is very good opposite as little as

 

x

AQxxx

xx

KQxxx

 

And is 3C not just clubs?

[inquiry]

Wow, I am the only one voting for 3♠.

You will have some esteemed company shortly... :-)

[inquiry]

2NT

 

EXPECTING OUR FIRST UNANIMOUS POLL ANSWER.

 

With strong P does not rebid minor at 3 level but shows major. Assume this is standard but look forward to other methods.

Another prediction bites the dust...

[hrothgar]

Fluffy: what if you are not weak? Do you really want to play 3C if partner has hearts and clubs? game is very good opposite as little as

 

x

AQxxx

xx

KQxxx

Hand looks a bit strong for 2NT...

[mike777]

Fluffy: what if you are not weak? Do you really want to play 3C if partner has hearts and clubs? game is very good opposite as little as

 

x

AQxxx

xx

KQxxx

 

And is 3C not just clubs?

This is really the main issue on hand, what the heck does p have for michaels bid.

On bbo and in real life it seems 99% say weak or strong but then have int hand such as Justin's example. Hope the panel speaks on what is common expert practice.

[Double !]

2NT

please tell me your minor?

see what partner rebids

[P_Marlowe]

I voted for 3♣ but I don't really see the difference with 2NT, except the fact that you give LHO 2 options to bid. Those of you who have talked about this situation, what is the difference between them?

 

Now I think a bit on it, it seems like similar to multi, you could bid 2NT with verylong club hoping to have another bid, while you could do the same with 3♣ if you held ♦. Therefore 2NT should show better ♣ than ♦ when you were weak.

Hi,

 

I voted for 2NT as well.

The difference between 2NT and 3C in my regular partnership is,

that 2NT promises always atleast invitational strength.

This is necessary, because we play the michales cue with continuos

ranges.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[han]

3C is pass or correct, 2NT shows interest in game, which is what we have. Partner will bid his/her minor with a minimal hand, in which case we will pass, or bids the corresponding major with a better hand.

 

If you play good/bad Michaels than you don't need to bid 2NT.. partner will bid again with the big hands.

[Gerben42]

Agree with Hannie. I would play 3♣ as pa/co but not use it here, unless we play good/bad Michaels which I would prefer.

[helene_t]

Wow, I am the only one voting for 3♠.

Don't wory, I join you.

 

The alternative is first 2NT then 3♠ but that sounds more minor-suit oriented to me.

[Chamaco]

2NT = positive relay= I wanna know your minor p.

Pard has bid Michaels at unfavourable, he rates to have a VERY good hand.

Slam is not unlikely.

 

Bidding directly (e.g. without going via 2NT) any number of a minor suit would be pass/correct, usually with weaker hand, and pard would passout even with a god hand.

[Chamaco]

Wow, I am the only one voting for 3♠.

I know this thread is not about system, but it seems to me that the 3S cue is more useful as a forcing raise of the only known suit (hearts here), with hands interested in slam (e.g. that want to show heart suport without signing off in 4M nor risking that 3M gets passed out).

 

Minor-oriented hands can go via 2NT to clarify first which is the suit held.

[han]

Good point Mauro, but I do think that the meanings of follow-ups should be discussed here too.

[shoeless]

Little green man sat on my shoulder and whispered in my ear - 4C - intended to suggest I am prepared to play game in your minor pard cause this isnt a splinter (oops if BBO advance includes minis) and I have zippo for hearts and while I am at it I think I will tease opps a little. Was having a good seesion until this board - oh well!!!

[inquiry]

[hv=d=w&v=n&s=s6542h62daq6cat43]133|100|Scoring: IMP

BPO-001-E

West North East South

   1♠    2♠    Pass   ?

 

Of course, 2♠ is Michaels cue-bid in BBO-Advanced.

[/hv]

 

2♠ being michaels cue-bid shows the other major and a minor. The first question is should you be thinking 1) game or more, 2) invite game, or 3) get out safely in what ever your partner's minor might be. In this thread above, you find a little bit of each of these views. For the most part, the expert panel was more focused on option 1) game or more on this hand. In my opinion, this is the correct view: force to game, and invite slam is right. Your partner at unfavorable vul forced you to bid at the three level. If you have a yarborough his hand should be strong enough to give you some play for 3 of a minor with just a fit for one of his suits. You not only have a fit (and thus 9 likely tricks based upon his hand and fit), you have two aces (up to 11 tricks) and some extra values. Thus, I have to agree with the majority of panelist.

 

Let's start with Phicro's response, which was, "3♠; I want to play game (at least) in front of a vulnerable overcall, in the minor owned by partner." The cue-bid leaves no doubt that game will be reached. It will be interesting to see what our members think about 3♠, but we can rest assured it will lead to game (or more) in the minor, and that is EXACTLY what the majority of the other panelist have in mind. So 3♠ scored very well in the poll.

 

The majority vote for 2NT. The uniformity of this bid is shattered a little bit by followup auctions mentioned by these voters. Ritong and Fred, being busy kindly submitted their votes without comments. I have to apologize for throwing this at them at the last moment. We will give all the panelist plenty of time to respond in the next poll. But Beverly Kraft speaks for the major when she says "2NT: I hope this is an ask for the minor with values. I will cuebid and drive to game while looking for slam." This was echoed by jlall who voted for 2NT, explaining, "I want to find out what partners minor is. I'm always going to game (even if you play michaels as weak/strong a red/white michaels bid cannot be a yarborough) but see no disadvantage in going slow as slam is a very real possibility."

 

luis also voted for 2NT, but suggest the problem will be on the next round of the bidding: " 2NT; Is this a problem? Asking pd fpr his minor suit seems to be

automatic, I guess the problem will be more difficult in the next

round of bidding. 2NT can't be INV in NT it would be very silly after

pd shows a two suiter to "invite" in NT, if you want to play 3NT you

bid 3NT." So it is clear luis is planning to bid again, what is less clear is if he plans to force to game or only invite. Likewise, ng choose 2NT, "Asks for minor and/or strength. Promises at least 2 and a half cover cards. I vote 2NT for good hands, 3C would be Pass or correct. " So like luis, we are not sure how ng plans to follow this bidding up.

 

Although it is unclear if luis is going to force or invite game, this is not the situation with Waldkk, who said, "2NT, asking for the minor. I have a good hand opposite a vulnerable Michaels, even a very good one opposite 1-5-2-5. I will pass 3D, but make a try over 3C, most likely 3S.

 

Finally, Cascade took a different view of the hand, choosing to sign off with "3♣, Pass or correct. If partner comes to life with a good Michaels then I will have an easy raise to game or even a slam try." The problem with this, is your partner will not come alive on a lot of hands that will make game, and you will languish in 3 or a minor.

 

I promoted the 3♠ vote to full 100 as it is clearly intended to drive to game, and since the majority of the 2NT voters felt that way as well.

 

The scores on this hand are…

Votes, scores, Panel, Members

2NT      100       7   

3♠    100       1   

3♣        10       1