Players without conventions on profile

[DrDirt]

When I am playing with a partner in a pickup game, frequently one of the Oppos has neither a CC nor any info on his profile. Then what happens is that many players sit at the other seat, note that the other player has no profile and immediately leave. This can go on for a while. BBO leaves me only two recourses: eject the player with no profile if one of us is host(rude with no explanation)or, as we usually do, my partner and I leave the table.

I suggest that there should be a option box on table setup than precludes players with no profile or CC.

[wank]

When I am playing with a partner in a pickup game, frequently one of the Oppos has neither a CC nor any info on his profile. Then what happens is that many players sit at the other seat, note that the other player has no profile and immediately leave. This can go on for a while. BBO leaves me only two recourses: eject the player with no profile if one of us is host(rude with no explanation)or, as we usually do, my partner and I leave the table.

I suggest that there should be a option box on table setup than precludes players with no profile or CC.

 

you're projecting. there are plenty of reasons for leaving the table. that you care what's in someone's profile doesn't mean others do.

[pescetom]

you're projecting. there are plenty of reasons for leaving the table. that you care what's in someone's profile doesn't mean others do.

 

You are eluding real problems.

One is that BBO does not require people to explicit what conventions they can play, nor does it offer mechanisms to negotiate which they will actually play with current partner.

Another is that the management of pickup games is delegated to capricious humans rather than adequate software.

[smerriman]

Simple solution - just host a table yourself, but require permission to join. You can then see the profile of anyone who requests to join and accept/decline them as you like.

[pescetom]

Simple solution - just host a table yourself, but require permission to join. You can then see the profile of anyone who requests to join and accept/decline them as you like.

 

That's a valid solution for a reasonable person who has some time to spare and is lucky enough to find a string of other reasonable people willing to join.

Unfortunately not everyone on BBO is a reasonable person or has time to spare.

The software could easily manage pickup games without human hosts and handle tasks such as matching profiles and monitoring behaviour.

[TylerE]

You are eluding real problems.

One is that BBO does not require people to explicit what conventions they can play

 

If I was going to do that, I'd need about 10x the space allowed in the box. It's pointless.

[pescetom]

If I was going to do that, I'd need about 10x the space allowed in the box. It's pointless.

 

I agree that a free text space is not a good way of explaining the conventions one can play, let alone a valid way of deciding which conventions one will play.

We need a better mechanism offered by BBO.

 

To put the problem in perspective, I have a chart I use with casual partners to agree the conventions we will play in a (real world) tournament. There are two pages of questions with tickbox answers, it takes about 2-5 minutes to compile together. With predefined answers a software could match such charts in a second, allowing us to accept, decline or refine the proposed match (similar to accepting a claim).

[Vampyr]

OKBridge managed this problem really well. The had convention cards that you could edit and then post to,the table. Also they had premade ones. So you could say, “let’s play OKB 2/1GF exactly as written. The systems provided were not perfect but at least they could be agreed with no more problems.

 

Also, is it not possible that people who don’t make lists in their BBO profile are flexible and will play whatever their partner wishes?

[steve2005]

When I am playing with a partner in a pickup game, frequently one of the Oppos has neither a CC nor any info on his profile.

I suggest that there should be a option box on table setup than precludes players with no profile or CC.

[/quot

I don't have anything on my profile. The profile is just a guide to what you can play not what your play at the moment. Your convention card is.

If your playing with a pick-up partner and your not playing SAYC, Gib 2/1 or one of the other pre-set convention cards I believe you are wasting your time.

 

There is a feature on the profile which almost nobody uses the favourite convention card. You can go wild and fill out all the gadgets you want. This is the way it really should be done if you want to have a long discussion about what to play.

 

My profile says i can play almost anything. So, your suggestion would preclude me. This would be ridiculous, as I would ask you wanted to play and then play it!

 

 

[steve2005]

OKBridge managed this problem really well. The had convention cards that you could edit and then post to,the table. Also they had premade ones. So you could say, "let's play OKB 2/1GF exactly as written. The systems provided were not perfect but at least they could be agreed with no more problems.

 

Also, is it not possible that people who don't make lists in their BBO profile are flexible and will play whatever their partner wishes?

I just posted something on this.

BBO already has this feature but hardly anyone uses it and many long time users apparently <sarcasm> don't even know how.

[Lovera]

When I am playing with a partner in a pickup game, frequently one of the Oppos has neither a CC nor any info on his profile.

I suggest that there should be a option box on table setup than precludes players with no profile or CC.

[/quot

I don't have anything on my profile. The profile is just a guide to what you can play not what your play at the moment. Your convention card is.

If your playing with a pick-up partner and your not playing SAYC, Gib 2/1 or one of the other pre-set convention cards I believe you are wasting your time.

 

There is a feature on the profile which almost nobody uses the favourite convention card. You can go wild and fill out all the gadgets you want. This is the way it really should be done if you want to have a long discussion about what to play.

 

My profile says i can play almost anything. So, your suggestion would preclude me. This would be ridiculous, as I would ask you wanted to play and then play it!

Hi steve2005. The problem can be not that an opp has not CC but that partner instead has it not and in this case at table people view anything. Whilest GCC is easyier to make if is possible to watch almost GCC by one player alone but i think that commercial problems/vendor/old support are obsative. Anyhow when i played sitting at table the first thing was:"Please see my profile" before playing and there was need it being i don't play 2NT Jacoby but strong raise and also it was necessary about use of RKB 1430 but club suit (in that case 0314). If you watch my profile can see also other indications usefull to help partner to bid avoid mistakes in bidding that, if you retain, can follow when making your profile.

[steve2005]

Hi steve2005. The problem can be not that an opp has not CC but that partner instead has it not and in this case at table people view anything. Whilest GCC is easyier to make if is possible to watch almost GCC by one player alone but i think that commercial problems/vendor/old support are obsative. Anyhow when i played sitting at table the first thing was:"Please see my profile" before playing and there was need it being i don't play 2NT Jacoby but strong raise and also it was necessary about use of RKB 1430 but club suit (in that case 0314). If you watch my profile can see also other indications usefull to help partner to bid avoid mistakes in bidding that, if you retain, can follow when making your profile.

Yes, will i think EVERYONE is wrong to say see my profile. They should also be saying see my favourite convention card.

I don't know how using your profile as a convention chart started but i don't get why using your favourite isn't being used. Using "favourite" would solve a lot of bidding convention problems.

 

Did you know that you can ask your partner during play about conventions and change your CC during play?

 

Lovera what is "GCC"?

[Lovera]

Yes, will i think EVERYONE is wrong to say see my profile. They should also be saying see my favourite convention card.

I don't know how using your profile as a convention chart started but i don't get why using your favourite isn't being used. Using "favourite" would solve a lot of bidding convention problems.

 

Did you know that you can ask your partner during play about conventions and change your CC during play?

 

Lovera what is "GCC"?

Hi, GCC is the Generic Convention Card that i don't have and about indications (avoiding chat) in my profile for random partner allow us to quickly have indications also for opps before starting to play.

[hrothgar]

Hi DrDirt

 

I considered reading your post, but you haven't bothered to fill in a BBO Forums profile...

 

If / when you decide to do so, I'll take a look at what you had to say

[barmar]

Hi, GCC is the Generic Convention Card that i don't have and about indications (avoiding chat) in my profile for random partner allow us to quickly have indications also for opps before starting to play.

That's not what GCC is.

 

GCC is General Convention Chart, it's the regulation that lists what conventions you're allowed to play in ACBL tournaments. It's not a specific set of agreements, you still have to work those out with a new partner.

 

It's being replaced later this year, see https://docs.google.com/document/d/1sOIU9fNAVlFftvRGuj7I5apPZsibzCL0Dsd6KVg7sjk/edit#heading=h.yxnvppfo0dpb

[helene_t]

The profile can contain all kind of things, from jokes to political statements. I don't see much point in discriminating on the basis of whether the profile is filled in.

[steve2005]

Hi DrDirt

 

I considered reading your post, but you haven't bothered to fill in a BBO Forums profile...

 

If / when you decide to do so, I'll take a look at what you had to say

Lol

[steve2005]

Hi, GCC is the Generic Convention Card that i don't have and about indications (avoiding chat) in my profile for random partner allow us to quickly have indications also for opps before starting to play.

I assume you meant the Generic Blank convention card. The ACBL blank card is a lot easier to fill out starting from scratch and more informative.

If someone hasn't filled out a card ask them if they play SAYC. Playing anything else with a stranger will just be frustrating unless one of you has a convention card filled out.

Then one of you can "use" the convention card with partner.

Filling out a profile with conventions for me is a waste of time and i would go over BBO page limit.

[Lovera]

That's not what GCC is.

 

GCC is General Convention Chart, it's the regulation that lists what conventions you're allowed to play in ACBL tournaments. It's not a specific set of agreements, you still have to work those out with a new partner.

 

It's being replaced later this year, see https://docs.google.com/document/d/1sOIU9fNAVlFftvRGuj7I5apPZsibzCL0Dsd6KVg7sjk/edit#heading=h.yxnvppfo0dpb

Now i remember that in web client was possible to make a chart and almost compilate for 70% i choised a General card similar that of Gib with the same conventions and i had indication at the bottom in profile as CC preferred to click on to watch (but i don't go theare because "the chessboard is too narrow") whilest in B♠B app it is not that indication (and it was possible instead...) and i have put in my profile those informations adding about raises and RKB to use in club games.

[barmar]

The web client allows you to fill in an ACBL CC or a Generic CC. The latter is a BBO-specific format that's just a bunch of text fields. It has nothing to do with the ACBL GCC.

 

I understand there's a language barrier, but convention cards are different from convention charts. Convention cards are lists of the conventions you play with your partner, convention charts are regulations saying which conventions are allowed in a particular jurisdiction.

[pescetom]

That's not what GCC is.

 

GCC is General Convention Chart, it's the regulation that lists what conventions you're allowed to play in ACBL tournaments. It's not a specific set of agreements, you still have to work those out with a new partner.

 

 

BBO allows users to define a new Generic Convention Card or a new ACBL Convention Card, I assume that is what was being referred to. Both are fairly clear, but the ACBL card has an ACBL focus and the GCC is free-text, unsuitable for computer analysis.

 

There is also a third format of convention card which allows a tree structured "Details" definition of the actual bidding sequences (see stock cards Precision, SAYC, WJ2005 etc) and is presumably used to explain actual bidding on BBO. This seems more promising, but I can only see how to make a copy of a stock card in My Convention Cards, not how to create one from scratch or (more important) modify a copy. The EDIT button is there but nothing much happens.

[barmar]

There is also a third format of convention card which allows a tree structured "Details" definition of the actual bidding sequences (see stock cards Precision, SAYC, WJ2005 etc) and is presumably interpreted during actual bidding on BBO. This seems more promising, but I can only see how to make a copy in My Convention Cards, not how to create one from scratch or (more important) modify a copy of a stock card. The EDIT button is there but nothing much happens.

That's called "Full Disclosure" convention cards. It's only possible to create these using a Windows application, and only the Windows version of BBO can upload them. I don't think we have any plans to create a web version of this tool, so they're effectively obsolete. The best we might someday do is provide a way to upload these CCs using a web tool, so that users who have the windows application can create and update them. But FDCC is basically an experiment that we gave up on, so we're not going to expend much effort on them.

[pescetom]

That's called "Full Disclosure" convention cards. It's only possible to create these using a Windows application, and only the Windows version of BBO can upload them. I don't think we have any plans to create a web version of this tool, so they're effectively obsolete. The best we might someday do is provide a way to upload these CCs using a web tool, so that users who have the windows application can create and update them. But FDCC is basically an experiment that we gave up on, so we're not going to expend much effort on them.

 

Can I ask why you gave up on FDCC? It looks like a great idea to me. I tried using the BBOITA's stock CC because that is a system I know and enjoy, but there were some errors in the CC and I wasn't able to modify it or get it modified so I gave up.

[TylerE]

BBO allows users to define a new Generic Convention Card or a new ACBL Convention Card, I assume that is what was being referred to. Both are fairly clear, but the ACBL card has an ACBL focus and the GCC is free-text, unsuitable for computer analysis.

 

That's a very dangerous overloading of terms. You wouldn't refer to a Advanced Telephony Module as an ATM.

[Lovera]

Can I ask why you gave up on FDCC? It looks like a great idea to me. I tried using the BBOITA's stock CC because that is a system I know and enjoy, but there were some errors in the CC and I wasn't able to modify it or get it modified so I gave up.

You are on my feet: look here from my topic "Alert" http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/topic/73212-alert/page__view__findpost__p__873259