manudude03 Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 Part one is herePart two is here Robot tourney, IMPs scoring. I decided to go low with 3NT. Now partner pulls to 4S, what now? You can assume that 4S over 2C would have been natural, and therefore bidding this way shows a hand too good to bid 4S. What now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrAce Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 Robot tourney, IMPs scoring. I decided to go low with 3NT. Now partner pulls to 4S, what now? You can assume that 4S over 2C would have been natural, and therefore bidding this way shows a hand too good to bid 4S. What now? The assumption you make does not work well with GIB.(regarding the jump to 4♠ vs this one). I can imagine GIB bidding like this with something like KQJxxxxx Void xx Kxx. I would pass unless in need of swing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve2005 Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 If there was a club fit hopefully Gib would have cue bid 2D or pulled 3N to clubs.any slam is hopeless unless spades are solid.4N natural? even is probably not enough entries to take much tricks in spadesthink you have no choice but to trust Gib and pass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 pass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nige1 Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 Part one is herePart two is hereRobot tourney, IMPs scoring. I decided to go low with 3NT. Now partner pulls to 4S, what now? You can assume that 4S over 2C would have been natural, and therefore bidding this way shows a hand too good to bid 4S. What now?I rank5♠ = NAT. IMO this asks about trump solidity.4N = RKC? But I suppose it could be NAT.Pass = NAT. Take the money.6♠ = NAT. You have a bit to spare for your previous bidding and you never promised support.6N = NAT. Might avoid a ♦ ruff; but If partner just has solid ♠s, then you might not relish the post-mortem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartruck Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 I bid unusual 2NT first bid so our bidding would have probably gone differently. If I bid as you did, I would probably just pass 4♠. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gszes Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 The bidding has taken up all the bidding space and so we are left to ponder what p might have. That spade void still leaves me too much concern to consider slam. pass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmnka447 Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Pass. When there's just no way to know if partner's got the proper tickets for slam, there's no reason to move forward Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manudude03 Posted June 20, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 At the risk of prematurely ending the debate, particularly on part 1: [hv=http://www.bridgebase.com/tools/handviewer.html?bbo=y&lin=pn|manudude03,~~M3486,~~M3484,~~M3485|st%7C%7Cmd%7C4SH3JKAD67JKC568QA%2CSTH2469TD238TC279%2CS345789JQKAH58QDC%2C%7Crh%7C%7Cah%7CBoard%202%7Csv%7Cn%7Cmb%7C1D%7Can%7CMinor%20suit%20opening%20--%203%2B%20%21D%3B%2011-21%20HCP%3B%2012-22%20total%20points%20%7Cmb%7C2C%7Can%7CTwo-level%20overcall%20--%205%2B%20%21C%3B%2010%2B%20HCP%3B%2011%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7C3S%7Can%7C4%2B%20%21S%3B%2013%2B%20HCP%3B%2014%2B%20total%20points%3B%20forcing%20%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7C3N%7Can%7C5%2B%20%21C%3B%204-%20%21H%3B%204-%20%21S%3B%2012%2B%20HCP%3B%2018-%20total%20%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7C4S%7Can%7C13%2B%20HCP%3B%20twice%20rebiddable%20%21S%3B%2014%2B%20total%20points%20%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cpc%7CH7%7Cpc%7CH3%7Cpc%7CHT%7Cpc%7CHQ%7Cmc%7C13%7C]399|300[/hv] No-one even managed to get to 6, yet this had 15 top tricks. 4S+3 actually gained 1.44 imps when someone passed and then left in partner's reopening double, only to find 1D can't be touched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartruck Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 At the risk of prematurely ending the debate, particularly on part 1: [hv=http://www.bridgebase.com/tools/handviewer.html?bbo=y&lin=pn|manudude03,~~M3486,~~M3484,~~M3485|st%7C%7Cmd%7C4SH3JKAD67JKC568QA%2CSTH2469TD238TC279%2CS345789JQKAH58QDC%2C%7Crh%7C%7Cah%7CBoard%202%7Csv%7Cn%7Cmb%7C1D%7Can%7CMinor%20suit%20opening%20--%203%2B%20%21D%3B%2011-21%20HCP%3B%2012-22%20total%20points%20%7Cmb%7C2C%7Can%7CTwo-level%20overcall%20--%205%2B%20%21C%3B%2010%2B%20HCP%3B%2011%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7C3S%7Can%7C4%2B%20%21S%3B%2013%2B%20HCP%3B%2014%2B%20total%20points%3B%20forcing%20%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7C3N%7Can%7C5%2B%20%21C%3B%204-%20%21H%3B%204-%20%21S%3B%2012%2B%20HCP%3B%2018-%20total%20%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7C4S%7Can%7C13%2B%20HCP%3B%20twice%20rebiddable%20%21S%3B%2014%2B%20total%20points%20%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cpc%7CH7%7Cpc%7CH3%7Cpc%7CHT%7Cpc%7CHQ%7Cmc%7C13%7C]399|300[/hv] No-one even managed to get to 6, yet this had 15 top tricks. 4S+3 actually gained 1.44 imps when someone passed and then left in partner's reopening double, only to find 1D can't be touched. With my strong 2NT bid showing ♥ and ♣ at that vulnerability, my partner would have taken us to 6♠ with complete control of that suit like that. EDIT: What did I win? :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vampyr Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 Seeing the full hand it is obvious In retrospect that 1♥ would have worked best. This evening I overcalled on a similar chunky heart suit, with diamonds very much like the clubs on this hand. I voted in the original poll to make a 2-level overcall on the poorish 5-card suit, but... is partner going to advance with a 4-card heart suit? Of course anything I say about warming to the 1♥ overcall cannot be trusted since I have seen the whole hand, especially because Cthonic will give partner ♣Jxx. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 Seeing the full hand it is obvious In retrospect that 1♥ would have worked best. This evening I overcalled on a similar chunky heart suit, with diamonds very much like the clubs on this hand. I voted in the original poll to make a 2-level overcall on the poorish 5-card suit, but... is partner going to advance with a 4-card heart suit? Of course anything I say about warming to the 1♥ overcall cannot be trusted since I have seen the whole hand, especially because Cthonic will give partner ♣Jxx. With a self sufficient suit that can never be adequately conveyed to partner, why the mudane 3S, 4S? I would have splintered, and then bid spades, spades, and more spades until partner was convinced of my disregard for clubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartruck Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 Seeing the full hand it is obvious In retrospect that 1♥ would have worked best. This evening I overcalled on a similar chunky heart suit, with diamonds very much like the clubs on this hand. I voted in the original poll to make a 2-level overcall on the poorish 5-card suit, but... is partner going to advance with a 4-card heart suit? Of course anything I say about warming to the 1♥ overcall cannot be trusted since I have seen the whole hand, especially because Cthonic will give partner ♣Jxx. Even in retrospect, my Unusual 2NT bid works if instead of Qxx in ♥, partner had Jxx♣, or Kxx♣, or Kx in ♣, or Jx in ♣, or a host of other possibilities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vampyr Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 Even in retrospect, my Unusual 2NT bid works if instead of Qxx in ♥, partner had Jxx♣, or Kxx♣, or Kx in ♣, or Jx in ♣, or a host of other possibilities. The fact that you bid it with a 4-card suit (the major, no less) is going to lose a lot more in partnership trust than you gain on this hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartruck Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 The fact that you bid it with a 4-card suit (the major, no less) is going to lose a lot more in partnership trust than you gain on this hand. My father and I play Unusual 2NT, Michael's, etc. knowing that we could be as little as 4-4. It works well for us in key situations. We don't do it all the time, but we do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamJson Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 Looks like my initial choice of 1H wins all the coconuts. The auction continues 5NT - 7H - 7S, exactly as I thought it might. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnu Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 At the risk of prematurely ending the debate, particularly on part 1: [hv=http://www.bridgebase.com/tools/handviewer.html?bbo=y&lin=pn|manudude03,~~M3486,~~M3484,~~M3485|st%7C%7Cmd%7C4SH3JKAD67JKC568QA%2CSTH2469TD238TC279%2CS345789JQKAH58QDC%2C%7Crh%7C%7Cah%7CBoard%202%7Csv%7Cn%7Cmb%7C1D%7Can%7CMinor%20suit%20opening%20--%203%2B%20%21D%3B%2011-21%20HCP%3B%2012-22%20total%20points%20%7Cmb%7C2C%7Can%7CTwo-level%20overcall%20--%205%2B%20%21C%3B%2010%2B%20HCP%3B%2011%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7C3S%7Can%7C4%2B%20%21S%3B%2013%2B%20HCP%3B%2014%2B%20total%20points%3B%20forcing%20%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7C3N%7Can%7C5%2B%20%21C%3B%204-%20%21H%3B%204-%20%21S%3B%2012%2B%20HCP%3B%2018-%20total%20%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7C4S%7Can%7C13%2B%20HCP%3B%20twice%20rebiddable%20%21S%3B%2014%2B%20total%20points%20%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cmb%7Cp%7Cpc%7CH7%7Cpc%7CH3%7Cpc%7CHT%7Cpc%7CHQ%7Cmc%7C13%7C]399|300[/hv] No-one even managed to get to 6, yet this had 15 top tricks. 4S+3 actually gained 1.44 imps when someone passed and then left in partner's reopening double, only to find 1D can't be touched. North had exactly the hand I pictured based on the bidding :rolleyes: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vampyr Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 My father and I play Unusual 2NT, Michael's, etc. knowing that we could be as little as 4-4. It works well for us in key situations. We don't do it all the time, but we do. Does it work because you don't disclose it adequately? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartruck Posted June 22, 2017 Report Share Posted June 22, 2017 Does it work because you don't disclose it adequately? C'mon. Don't hate it 'cause you ain't it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrAce Posted June 22, 2017 Report Share Posted June 22, 2017 deleted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartruck Posted June 22, 2017 Report Share Posted June 22, 2017 deleted Forum Bully here. LMFAO Too easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrAce Posted June 23, 2017 Report Share Posted June 23, 2017 Forum Bully here. LMFAO Too easy. You really thought that was deleted by a moderator, didn't you? I deleted it myself and all it said was "Nobody is hating you or your 8 card 2 NT suggestions" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vampyr Posted June 23, 2017 Report Share Posted June 23, 2017 You really thought that was deleted by a moderator, didn't you? I deleted it myself and all it said was "Nobody is hating you or your 8 card 2 NT suggestions" Hate the bid, love the bidder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartruck Posted June 23, 2017 Report Share Posted June 23, 2017 Hate the bid, love the bidder. Yes please. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartruck Posted June 23, 2017 Report Share Posted June 23, 2017 You really thought that was deleted by a moderator, didn't you? I deleted it myself and all it said was "Nobody is hating you or your 8 card 2 NT suggestions" You're amlost to the point where you're uncoachable. We never want to be that. I learn something new every day. We NEVER know it all. We have to accept those boundaries, or we are nothing more than animals. I believe we are MUCH smarter, and never came from apes, and we certainly have a "Higher Purpose", to which I have yet to fully determine. If you want to rationally talk numbers, Let's Go. If you want to belittle me for every complex assumption I post on a low traffic message board? You are talking Chinese and we will never see eye to eye. I'm gonna need that because I know I am destined for greatness at this Game. Just be respectful SLIGHTLY, so we can have an open and honest disagreement is all I ask. When I am here, I am absorbing all information given to me through everyone's posts, studying, weeding out theories I believe are flat out wrong with no subject for debate, moving on to some of yours and other knowledgeable posters' posts, and better myself every time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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