Who should bid Spades?

[dickiegera]

[hv=pc=n&s=saj92h75dk982ct72&n=skq63hkt842dt3c53&d=n&v=0&b=1&a=ppp1d1hppdppp]266|200[/hv]

 

1 Heart doubled was down 3 , -500.

 

Hearts were 5-1, with East having 5.

 

2spades makes and East/West can only make partials in NT or clubs.

 

Who should have introduced Spade suit? How? & When?

 

Thank you

[RedSpawn]

If I were you, I would check South for a pulse, and if you don't find one, call 9-1-1. South is so asleep at the wheel. For him to ignore your 1♥ overcall is unconscionable. You need to know that he has 4 spades and at least 6 hcp. He must bid 1♠.

 

PASS doesn't quite communicate his hand's assets.

 

South is acting zombie-like.

[fromageGB]

Can't agree with Spawn here. I think the initial two passes are reasonable. Partner would probably have doubled if he was interested in spades, and 1♥ going off may not be a bad result. A bid of 1♠ could force the level too high for a bigger no-fit negative score.

 

However, it is different over the double. When it is passed round to him I think he should protect with redouble. Let North scramble spades or clubs, or an unlikely 1NT.

[Winstonm]

If the opponents can be trusted to have the penalty pass, I would suggest this:

 

p-p-p-1D

1h-p-p-x

p-p-xx-p

1S

[Tramticket]

The 1♥ overcall is pretty marginal. It isn't achieving much in the way of pre-emption and the suit quality is pretty moderate. You might not want a heart lead either. Many will overcall, but I'm not sure you should.

[Winstonm]

The 1♥ overcall is pretty marginal. It isn't achieving much in the way of pre-emption and the suit quality is pretty moderate. You might not want a heart lead either. Many will overcall, but I'm not sure you should.

 

I agree - but sometimes, if it is matchpoints, it is right to get in slightly undervalue.

[spotlight7]

Playing a 1S bid after a 1H overcall as 6+HCP and a 4 card suit is a poor bidding idea.

 

 

Is the 1H over caller really supposed to now bid 1NT with 8HCP and a 2=5=3=3 shape?

 

Would a 1N rebid by the overcaller now even promise a stopper?

 

 

 

My style is to overcall at the one level with @8-17 and

 

some very good players use @6-16ish range. Responding

 

as if over caller has an opening bid is an unsound idea

 

when the lower range is really 8HCP or even less.

 

 

If partner is a Roth Stone trained player, they overcall at the one level on 14+,

 

however, since this 1H overcall has 8HCP(8!) this rules out a super sound overcall style.

 

 

Winstonm has a playable solution to the bidding on this hand.

[dow1978]

2♠

[nekthen]

Perfect example hand for S.O.S. redouble

[silvr bull]

If the North hand had stronger Hs and weaker Ss, like KTxx KQxxx Tx XX, I too would overcall 1H. With the OP hand, however, I would double 1D to get both majors into the auction. I view the strong 4 card S suit as a more important feature than the 5th H in a hand so weak that I can barely justify any bid at all.

[nullve]

2spades makes

Really?

 

It isn't achieving much in the way of pre-emption

Not by itself, but partner will be able to raise hearts most of the time.

[GrahamJson]

Perfect example hand for S.O.S. redouble

It is? You have two trumps, an ace and a king, what more could partner expect? Change partners black suits around and do you really want to be in 2C? It seems to me to be a perfect example of a pointless (almost literally) overcall, particularly opposite someone who could not even muster a third hand opening.

[Nabooba]

1H is an obvious overcall.

[MrAce]

If I were you, I would check South for a pulse, and if you don't find one, call 9-1-1. South is so asleep at the wheel. For him to ignore your 1♥ overcall is unconscionable. You need to know that he has 4 spades and at least 6 hcp. He must bid 1♠.

 

PASS doesn't quite communicate his hand's assets.

 

South is acting zombie-like.

 

North is coming from pass. He could easily hold something like xx AKJxx xxx Jxx and would pass 1♠.

IMO pass by south was OK, he just needed to read the position and redouble after double was converted to penalty by East.

Regarding the 1♥ overcall, I think it is borderline between minimum overcall and pass.

[GrahamJson]

Hmm. I might have bid 1S immediately, but not if north routinely overcalls on hands like this. As the bidding went bidding 1S makes more sense than a redouble. Do you really want partner to take out into a minor? You will probably still end up in a seven card fit, but one level higher. And what if partner has the same hand but with one less spade and more hearts? He might take it into his head to pass the redouble rather than end up in a 3-3 fit.

 

Sorry, but it is not an overcall in my book. It looks like an example of players thinking that their hand has become stronger because they have already passed. Yes, if partner has a fit you might be able to obstruct the auction, but I think he needs to be able to rely on a few values opposite if he is to compete effectively. If you really have to bid a double makes more sense as it at least gets the spades into the action.

[shyams]

On some days, we would probably repeat the auction. On some other days, I might pass as North.

 

In MPs, I think the correct action is for South to sit it out and take the minus.

[nige1]

[hv=pc=n&s=saj92h75dk982ct72&n=skq63hkt842dt3c53&d=n&v=0&b=1&a=ppp1d1hppdppp]266|200|

1 Heart doubled was down 3 , -500.

Hearts were 5-1, with East having 5.

2spades makes and East/West can only make partials in NT or clubs.

Who should have introduced Spade suit? How? & When?[/hv]

IMO

• North's 1♥ overcall is OK.
• South should pass 1♥.
• North should pass West's re-opening double.
• At MPs, warned of the bad break, South should try an SOS redouble. 1♥X is probably a bad score, ao it's worth risking a worse score, on the off-chance of something better.
• At IMPs, South should pass 1♥X because a better 1-level bolt-hole may not be available and a 2-level rescue must play 2 tricks better, to be an improvement. e.g. North might have held ♠ x x ♥ K x x x x x ♦ Q x ♣ K Q J

[msjennifer]

I feel it easy to make or suggest bids to suit the hands after one knows the result.Give these hands in a bidding contest and see what happens

1H overcall is not that bad an overcall considering that both LHO and P have passed once so one may find suitable cards and few useful values with P.For example P may be holding LHO cards .I do not agree with the suggestion that P shd have responded 1S as his DK has very doubtful value as also the spade suit is a quite weak and only four carded. P should have passed.I also do not think that an SOS redouble is advisable with only two rags in club suit.We treat this hand as "bad luck" brought about by the violent distribution .and forget .The existing gadgets, in my personal opinion ,are not good enough .

[MrAce]

IMO

 

 

• At IMPs, South should pass 1♥X because a better 1-level bolt-hole may not be available and a 2-level rescue must play 2 tricks better, to be an improvement. e.g. North might have held ♠ x x ♥ K x x x x x ♦ Q x ♣ K Q J

 

He would have opened 1♥, he is coming from pass. If this is not a 1♥ opener for your style then he would have opened weak 2♥.

 

 

[Winstonm]

On some days, we would probably repeat the auction. On some other days, I might pass as North.

 

In MPs, I think the correct action is for South to sit it out and take the minus.

 

What about the penalty pass from East? At mps, I think it better to try to improve and escape than play in the contract the opponents prefer me to play - a zero can't get any rounder. :)

[wank]

Always believe the opps in this situation so run after the penalty pass.

 

Passing 1h is totally normal the first time.

 

For me a style where you pass the north hand is lame. Double is the only alternative in my world.

[Kaitlyn S]

What about the penalty pass from East? At mps, I think it better to try to improve and escape than play in the contract the opponents prefer me to play - a zero can't get any rounder. :)

What makes you think it's a zero? You have taken no unusual actions. Why couldn't every other action in the auction have been perfectly normal?

 

This reminds me of a hand in a decent field where I converted a double to penalty. A couple tricks into the play it appeared like the opponents were making their doubled partscore, but I thought my action was pretty normal and instead of giving up, I thought hard about the hand and found the only defense to stop the overtrick and got almost an average board as we were the only ones that held them to 670.

 

So with many partners, especially the ones who might double with North's hand, I think looking for a spade fit is optimistic. I'm pretty sure one frequent poster to these forums would double.

 

That being said, my favorite partner, upon being asked about her second choice to 1H, might say "Excuse myself and wait until 1H is a viable first and second choice" (and who might be the only one in the field who overcalls), I have to seriously think about pulling.

[mlbridge]

I would not overcall 1♥. ♥ suit too weak. If I had the KQ of ♥ instead of ♠, then maybe. I'm not even sure I want pard to lead ♥ in NT. ♠ may turn out to be a better lead.

 

Your pard should do a SOS redouble or bid 1♠. If I both 4 card ♠ and ♣, I would SOS. In this case, I would choose 1♠ or even a deceiving 1NT hoping not to be double.

[Kaitlyn S]

Your pard should do a SOS redouble or bid 1♠. If I both 4 card ♠ and ♣, I would SOS. In this case, I would choose 1♠ or even a deceiving 1NT hoping not to be double.

1NT is very easy to double.

 

A while ago, there was an "assign the blame" thread where the auction went P P P 1D 1S P 1NT X P P P. The spade overcaller had a good suit and about 9 points, the 1NT bidder had a doubleton spade and about 9 points and a diamond stopper. The contract went for 500 NV vs NV. Almost everybody said that there was no reason to bid 1NT as the overcaller was a passed hand and there was no game - just play the 5-2 fit and be happy. 1S would not have been doubled on this hand.

 

I think the people dissing the 1NT advance were correct.

 

If you bid 1NT here after 1H has been doubled for penalties, you are certainly going to be doubled. On this hand you might save 200 points but there is no doubt that you will be doubled unless the opponents are asleep (and maybe even then.) And while you might take a diamond and four spades on this hand to only go for 300, on many hands 1NTx will be worse than 1Hx since in 1Hx partner has the opportunity to endplay the long trump hand to gain extra trump tricks, a maneuver which is quite difficult in notrump.

 

EDIT: As I look at the hand, you shouldn't go down less in 1NTx. Assuming clubs are 4-4, the opponents should be able to take 4 clubs, 3 diamonds, and 2 hearts before you get the lead. If somebody has a fifth club, you're down 800.

[neilkaz]

The overcall on that junk is dubious and not everyone's style. But the blame here goes to South who must display a bit of table presence and realize that the opps want to defend 1♥X. Therefore, South must make a SOS XX or as a 2nd choice try 1♠.

 

Of course North doesn't bid 1♠ over the balancing double so it is entirely up to South to make the move to find ♠.