ATB

[Cyberyeti]

[hv=pc=n&s=shat752dkj63ct532&n=sakj6h6daq8cakq74&d=n&v=0&b=1&a=2c(GF%20except%202N%20rebid)2s3hp3n(Nat%20F4N)p4dp4nppp]266|200[/hv]

 

Methods are that over the interference, X is double neg, P is single neg, bids positive.

 

They led a spade into the AKJ so 13 easy tricks, 7♣ is cold

 

ATB, N, S, methods ?

[MrAce]

Pass=single negative is one of the worst ideas ever.

Otherwise I would blame 100% South of course when he had an easy pass over 2♠ instead of jamming up their own forcing auction by starting 3♥ with ATxxx suit.

[Cyberyeti]

Pass=single negative is one of the worst ideas ever.

Otherwise I would blame 100% South of course when he had an easy pass over 2♠ instead of jamming up their own forcing auction by starting 3♥ with ATxxx suit.

 

By the methods being played, pass denies a 5 card suit to an honour an ace and a king, he is very unlikely to be able to persuade partner he has all those things later.

[mcphee]

100% responder should bid 3H, and although 3D is an option so was 3C which allows partner to show D should they hold them. Just because the D suit holds values is not a reason to pass up showing C.

[The_Badger]

I believe this is one of the most undeveloped areas of bidding when opponents interfere over a 2♣ opener. Even though you might potentially wrongside a contract occasionally, you probably need a 2NT bid by responder to be some sort of positive relay as opposed to what (?) just 8-10 points with a balanced hand?

 

I have seen this happen more often recently, opponents overcalling at the 2 level very lightly over a 2♣ opener in the hope of throwing a spanner in the works.

 

Long gone are the days when big hands were respected, and you didn't hear a peep from the opps.

[broze]

Really hate the methods but constrained by those I blame South. He bid his three-suiter as a two-suiter and the partnership missed their fit. Go figure.

[gszes]

4d seems wrong 4c makes much more sense since if opener has diamonds they can bid them over 4c but maybe not vice versa. 5c by opener (over 4d) seems right also since responder has ventured beyond 3n there has to be at least some slam interest. 5c would seem to be an excellent bid at that point with extras (forcing). I would slightly favor blaming the 4d bid over the non 5c bid (over 4d) so 55 responder 45 opener.

[Cyberyeti]

4d seems wrong 4c makes much more sense since if opener has diamonds they can bid them over 4c but maybe not vice versa. 5c by opener (over 4d) seems right also since responder has ventured beyond 3n there has to be at least some slam interest. 5c would seem to be an excellent bid at that point with extras (forcing). I would slightly favor blaming the 4d bid over the non 5c bid (over 4d) so 55 responder 45 opener.

 

4♦ for us would not be natural over 4♣, basically S knows he can introduce one minor and bury the other, so introduced the better one.

[wank]

what's 3s over 2s? this hand i expect.

 

anyway, if i had got myself into a pickle with my previous bidding i'd just jump to 6c over 4nt (obviously to play). i'll consider myself a trifle unlucky if partner turns out to be 5233 or worse.

[ggwhiz]

The methods suck.

 

The opponents steal a full round of bidding with 2♠ and (barring a heart fit) south throws away another one? North is completely endplayed in the bidding and south did nothing but follow what's on the card. Did I mention that the methods suck?

[Cyberyeti]

what's 3s over 2s? this hand i expect.

 

anyway, if i had got myself into a pickle with my previous bidding i'd just jump to 6c over 4nt (obviously to play). i'll consider myself a trifle unlucky if partner turns out to be 5233 or worse.

 

3♠ is the 1444 version of this hand, it doesn't have 5♥, it was an option

[steve2005]

4d seems wrong 4c makes much more sense since if opener has diamonds they can bid them over 4c but maybe not vice versa.

and when you find yourself in 7♣ on a 4-3 fit what then?

[shyams]

IF

3♠ is the 1444 version of this hand, it doesn't have 5♥, it was an option

AND

4♦ for us would not be natural over 4♣, basically S knows he can introduce one minor and bury the other, so introduced the better one.

THEN

I think the right thing for South to do is to fake a 1444 hand with a 3♠ bid.

[nekthen]

Double is double negative? Change the methods.

I think North is being very timid bidding 4N. We are told 3♥ is positive with an Ace and a King, if 4N is not forcing then bid 6N, presumably either the A or AK is in heart suit. As 3♥ is positive, then 3N seems a bit negative maybe 4♣ makes things easier.

Part of the problem is that 2♣ openers has been downgraded in recent years and 4N looks like a warning that there is no source of extra tricks

 

In short, 1) blame the methods, I would like to use double for a 3 suited positive. Partner can then go slamming or take the money

2) Blame North for bidding NT in preference to mentioning clubs

[Fluffy]

South could guess to show 3 suiter, but I think the only one that made an unreasonable bid was North, bidding 4NT when he could be cold for 7♦ opposite ♥A+♦K. 4♠ looks better, although perhaps excesively commiting.

[Cyberyeti]

 

I think North is being very timid bidding 4N. We are told 3♥ is positive with an Ace and a King, if 4N is not forcing then bid 6N, presumably either the A or AK is in heart suit. As 3♥ is positive, then 3N seems a bit negative maybe 4♣ makes things easier.

Part of the problem is that 2♣ openers has been downgraded in recent years and 4N looks like a warning that there is no source of extra tricks

 

Do you really fancy a slam opposite xx, AKxxx, xxxxx, x ? Our 2♣ openers are very much NOT downgraded.

[gszes]

and when you find yourself in 7♣ on a 4-3 fit what then?

odd that you did not also ask "and when you find yourself in 7♦ on a 4-3 fit what then?"

[wank]

3♠ is the 1444 version of this hand, it doesn't have 5♥, it was an option

 

that would be a rather silly level of inflexibility. if over 3s partner supports any suit, you're happy and can lose the long heart. if partner bids 3NT, you bid 4H - that's obviously not 1444.

[nekthen]

Do you really fancy a slam opposite xx, AKxxx, xxxxx, x ? Our 2♣ openers are very much NOT downgraded.

 

No. I would prefer to bid [hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=2c2sdp3cp4cp4np5dp5n6d7cppp]133|100[/hv]

 

If p does have xx, AKxxx, xxxxx, x

Then[hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=2c2s3hp3np4dp4nppp]133|100[/hv]

 

3N is now OK because partner can bid a second suit if he has one, but he cannot have 3 suits

 

Of course p may have xx Axxxx Kxxxx x in which case I hope he bids 5♦ over 4N and I can bid 6

[RD350LC]

[hv=pc=n&s=shat752dkj63ct532&n=sakj6h6daq8cakq74&d=n&v=0&b=1&a=2c(GF%20except%202N%20rebid)2s3hp3n(Nat%20F4N)p4dp4nppp]266|200[/hv]

 

Methods are that over the interference, X is double neg, P is single neg, bids positive.

 

They led a spade into the AKJ so 13 easy tricks, 7♣ is cold

 

ATB, N, S, methods ?

I have read "Modern Bridge Conventions", and in there it states that when there is competition over a 2♣ opener, a bid shows 5+ hcp. Given that, I tend to agree with south's bid of 3♥. I also agree with 4♦. However, I would bid 5♣ over 4NT. Remember, p opened 2♣, and you have 8 hcp, so slam is a virtual certainty. After bidding 5♣, p could easily raise, and it may be possible to reach 7♣.

[GrahamJson]

The modern approach is to be more flexible with regard to responses to 2C. So, for example, the south hand is a clear positive of 2H in response to 2C but, swap the red suits around, and 2D is preferred to 3D, which takes up too much bidding space. Hence, whatever the agreement, it is better to pass over 2S as south, bidding hearts on the next round. This approach should easily result on n a club slam being bid, although whether you get to the grand depends on methods and judgment.

 

On a related matter, I dislike the current trend (more on BBO than in expert circles - although it is close) for virtually all doubles to be negative. My view is that after a 2C opening all doubles are penalty. In addition, a bid in a doubled suit is natural. This makes is more difficult for oppo to come in with random bids with the sole purpose of disrupting your bidding. Other doubles that should also be penalties include after a takeout or negative double. E.g (1D)-DBL-(1S)-DBl showing, say, KQxx xxx Ax xxxx.

[RD350LC]

The modern approach is to be more flexible with regard to responses to 2C. So, for example, the south hand is a clear positive of 2H in response to 2C but, swap the red suits around, and 2D is preferred to 3D, which takes up too much bidding space. Hence, whatever the agreement, it is better to pass over 2S as south, bidding hearts on the next round. This approach should easily result on n a club slam being bid, although whether you get to the grand depends on methods and judgment.

 

On a related matter, I dislike the current trend (more on BBO than in expert circles - although it is close) for virtually all doubles to be negative. My view is that after a 2C opening all doubles are penalty. In addition, a bid in a doubled suit is natural. This makes is more difficult for oppo to come in with random bids with the sole purpose of disrupting your bidding. Other doubles that should also be penalties include after a takeout or negative double. E.g (1D)-DBL-(1S)-DBl showing, say, KQxx xxx Ax xxxx.

My view of a 2♣ opener is not necessarily 22+ hcp, but a 4 loser (or less) hand. As such, with 8 hcp, I would make some sort of bid-not 2♦ should there not be any interference.

I prefer to use doubles as penalty oriented.

[MrAce]

By the methods being played, pass denies a 5 card suit to an honour an ace and a king, he is very unlikely to be able to persuade partner he has all those things later.

 

So help me to understand'

 

DBL =2nd neg

Pass=Denies a 5 card suit to an A or K.

 

So was south supposed to bid 3♥ with something like xx Kxxxx xxx xxx ?

[Cyberyeti]

So help me to understand'

 

DBL =2nd neg

Pass=Denies a 5 card suit to an A or K.

 

So was south supposed to bid 3♥ with something like xx Kxxxx xxx xxx ?

 

No pass denies a hand containing an ace, a king and a 5 card suit to an honour, ie it denies the case where ALL those things are true, not any one of them. So it won't contain AKxxx, Axxxx and a K or Kxxxx and an A or Qxxxx an A and a K.

[MrAce]

No pass denies a hand containing an ace, a king and a 5 card suit to an honour, ie it denies the case where ALL those things are true, not any one of them. So it won't contain AKxxx, Axxxx and a K or Kxxxx and an A or Qxxxx an A and a K.

 

Ok thanks.