661_Pete Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 This is a situation I hate being put into. Game all, LHO dealer. I hold a collection of rubbish:♠Kx♥xx♦KQxx♣Q10xxx As it happens, 4♠ would have found our fit and made. I chose 5♣ and when it was passed round to RHO who doubled, I called an 'SOS' XX - something I'm very loath to do at any time. But LHO rescued the situation by bidding 5♥ which made (needless to say W had a lot of hearts!). Not the best result, but still better than leaving them in 4♥X with an overtrick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagles123 Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 may i suggest that if 4S would have found your fit, partners X was probably wrong - if partner is suggesting you should have bid 4S its pure resulting nonsense. I think 5c is reasonable, but you could consider 4N to show a 2 suited hand. I also really disagree with your assumption the XX is "SOS" - I think it's just blood :) - and even if it is SOS for your partnership I'm not entirely sure why you'd want to do it on this hand. ps your hand is far from a collection of rubbish - imagine partner has a normal double such as Axxx x AJxx AKxx then you have a good chance of slam! 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P_Marlowe Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 Hi, pass. I can live with any of your choices, except 4S, with other = 4NT searching for your best minor fit.You are (semi) balanced, you have some values out side hearts, you should have a reasonable chanceof setting it, assuming partner has a common hand. A 6th spade is not a common hand pattern for partner. With kind regardsMarlowe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
661_Pete Posted May 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 Thanks. I certainly wouldn't have called 4♠ but with hindsight, my partner should have, holding AQ10xx and a decent split. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tramticket Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 Pass looks right at these colours. 4NT second choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 In nige1 scoring, I think this is:4N = 10Pass = 95C = 85D = 54S = 2 Sorry to be a bit harsh about 5C! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmnka447 Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 A 4 ♠ bid should never be an option with your hand. I think 4 NT is right getting partner to choose between the minors. You have longer ♣ but they're not so good. So partner's input is important. At the 4 level, it more about getting to a decent contract rather than being perfect. If 4 ♠ is making, partner has to have 5+ pretty good ♠, so why isn't partner bidding 4 ♠? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve2005 Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 A 4 ♠ bid should never be an option with your hand. If someone thinks you should bid 4♠ on this hand they are resulters and don't listen to anything they say about bidding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apollo1201 Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 You don't have a collection of rubbish at all. All your goodies are outside of H and are support for partner's honors, or are sitting after responder's aces.Facing an average TOX, you have good chances of making 5m, and it scores probably more setting 4HX (opener is red so should not have a rubbish that goes -3).4NT should convey this message. 5C is okay but not as good imo. The rest about 4S and XX being sos is just a bit of a nonsense as every1 pointed out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedSpawn Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 A 4 ♠ bid should never be an option with your hand. I think 4 NT is right getting partner to choose between the minors. You have longer ♣ but they're not so good. So partner's input is important. At the 4 level, it more about getting to a decent contract rather than being perfect. If 4 ♠ is making, partner has to have 5+ pretty good ♠, so why isn't partner bidding 4 ♠? Agreed. Again, your partner pays the cost to be the boss. If your partner is saying 4♠ was the bid, then how are you going to suggest that bid with a doubleton in your hand? It is really important that you remind your partner that you are not clairvoyant. He has to take some initiative when overcalling preemptive bids. Your partner should be bidding 4♠ if his spade holding is that couture. No where in the auction did he mention that spade suit, so I would keep the post mortem focused on the bid he didn't make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMoe Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 Pass. Balanced values opposite a (strong) takeout will generally benefit from passing. Make the hand Kxx x KQxx Q10xxx and 4N is more appealing. I won't bid at the 5 level unless 1) I am sure we belong one level higher or 2) my ODR is skewed to bidding. Neither here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wank Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 it's amusing that you think a 54 10 count with no points in the opps' suit opposite a 4 level take out double is a 'collection of rubbish'. obviously if you're going to bid, which is debatable, you should bid 4nt to show 2 places to play. as for your redouble that was beginner level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahydra Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 5m rates to be a make, but that doubleton heart does look a bit scary. I think I'd bid 4NT though as the chance of us getting 800 is poor, while there is some chance of a slam our way. as for your redouble that was beginner level. Be fair - I think the original X holding what sounds like a 4S bid (or even a pass given the comment about 4HX+1?), and then trying to tell OP he should bid 4S on a doubleton opposite the X, is surely worse! :) ahydra Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wank Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 and then trying to tell OP he should bid 4S on a doubleton opposite the X, is surely worse! :) ahydra nowhere does it say that his partner said that. all it says is that 4s would have worked out better. as for partner's double, with the right shape i think 5 spades is ok. if 5h makes though it sounds like partner is a little lacking in high cards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahydra Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 Ah, sorry, I managed to misread the OP's followup - thought partner had 6 spades, and then followed a bunch of comments where people were talking (but only hypothetically) about someone said OP should respond 4S which threw me. Agree one would X rather than 4S with eg 51(43) scattered values, 5044. ahydra Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nekthen Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 I would love to see a hand where partner has a sensible double, 4S makes and 5H makes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamJson Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 My vote, which I made too quickly, went to Pass, although I now think that 4NT is probably better. It's certainly close. If i kibbed anyone on BBO bidding 4S on this hand, and making, I would suspect they were the owners of two computers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msjennifer Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 I shall bid 4NT .If 4 S and 5H are both making but 5 of a minor chosen by my partner is going down then I shall be looking for another partner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miamijd Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 As others have noted, 4NT (two-suited, NOT minors) is the best call here. I'm surprised so many are advocating (or even seriously considering) passing. The secondary values in the minors are great for offense, but not so good for defense. With the opponents likely having a 10-fit (sure, partner could have 2-3 hearts, but he rates to have a stiff), opener could easily be 1741 and responder 5314, in which case the opponents will probably make 5H. Cheers,Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nige1 Posted May 24, 2017 Report Share Posted May 24, 2017 This is a situation I hate being put into. Game all, LHO dealer. I hold a collection of rubbish: ♠ K x ♥ x x ♦ K Q x x ♣ Q 10 x x x As it happens, 4♠ would have found our fit and made. I chose 5♣ and when it was passed round to RHO who doubled, I called an 'SOS' XX - something I'm very loath to do at any time. But LHO rescued the situation by bidding 5♥ which made (needless to say W had a lot of hearts!). Not the best result, but still better than leaving them in 4♥X with an overtrick. As others have noted, 4NT (two-suited, NOT minors) is the best call here. I'm surprised so many are advocating (or even seriously considering) passing. The secondary values in the minors are great for offense, but not so good for defense. With the opponents likely having a 10-fit (sure, partner could have 2-3 hearts, but he rates to have a stiff), opener could easily be 1741 and responder 5314, in which case the opponents will probably make 5H. Please post the full deal, 661_Pete. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nekthen Posted May 24, 2017 Report Share Posted May 24, 2017 4N two suited not minors?????If we were talking about 4♠ dbl 4N then yes of course, but if you are 2 suited and partner doubles and one of your suits is spades, you bid 4♠ so 4N in this auction is the minors Context is everything Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wank Posted May 24, 2017 Report Share Posted May 24, 2017 4N two suited not minors?????If we were talking about 4♠ dbl 4N then yes of course, but if you are 2 suited and partner doubles and one of your suits is spades, you bid 4♠ so 4N in this auction is the minors Context is everything multiple punctuation marks is my pet hate. it's particularly annoying when the person using them is wrong on their main point. 4NT is 2 places to play. you can have spades in a slammy hand. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nige1 Posted May 24, 2017 Report Share Posted May 24, 2017 multiple punctuation marks is my pet hate. it's particularly annoying when the person using them is wrong on their main point. 4NT is 2 places to play. you can have spades in a slammy hand. We should be tolerant of each other's quirks e.g. Posting in lower-case :) Over-use of emoticons :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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