Cue bids and Multi 2D

[pstansbu]

This one didn't end well (Matchpointed duplicate pairs):

[hv=pc=n&s=skthtdt865ckt8762&w=s62hq975da742caj4&n=saqj853h32dj3cq93&e=s974hakj864dkq9c5&d=n&v=0&b=1&a=2d2hp3dppp]399|300[/hv]

The 2♦ bid contained a weak 2 in a Major and several strong options. Whilst we hadn't discussed this sequence, nor do we have a specific defence to a multi just play naturally (including an overcall in ♦). Setting aside the undiscussed sequence partner remains adamant that natural should mean natural and any ♦(or cue of any artificially bid suit) should show the suit. My preference is to use Leaping Michaels over a Multi, but not in this partnership.

 

I can't really see any good case for this being natural, and see showing a good raise as more useful and frequent, but wondered what views others held.

[Trinidad]

Defending against a Multi is difficult. That is why it was invented.

 

But I think that this is how your reasoning should go:

 

North opened a multi, showing a weak two in a major or some strong options.

• 
   
  
• He can't really have the strong options. After all, if North would have a strong option and East would be strong enough to bid 2♥, West will rarely have enough strength to bid (other than perhaps a raise of partner's suit). So, if West bids something, then North must have a weak two in a major.
  
• East has the hearts. You can be pretty sure that North will not have 6 of them. That means he must have a weak two in spades.
  

And there you have your cuebid. You can use a bid in the other major as a cue, since you are practically certain that this is North' suit.

 

If partner overcalls in a minor then this obviously doesn't work. But when partner overcalls in a major, the other major is the opponent's suit.

 

Rik

[P_Marlowe]

The alternative approach would be to go for transfer responses,

e.g. the cue would be the xfer in p suit, but there are various

schemes.

[sfi]

I typically propose 2NT as the good raise of partner's major if we don't have a cue bid available. That way we don't suffer disasters by not being able to find our spade fit on these auctions (it does happen).

[Cyberyeti]

Defending against a Multi is difficult. That is why it was invented.

 

But I think that this is how your reasoning should go:

 

North opened a multi, showing a weak two in a major or some strong options.

• 
   
  
• He can't really have the strong options. After all, if North would have a strong option and East would be strong enough to bid 2♥, West will rarely have enough strength to bid (other than perhaps a raise of partner's suit). So, if West bids something, then North must have a weak two in a major.
  
• East has the hearts. You can be pretty sure that North will not have 6 of them. That means he must have a weak two in spades.
  

And there you have your cuebid. You can use a bid in the other major as a cue, since you are practically certain that this is North' suit.

 

If partner overcalls in a minor then this obviously doesn't work. But when partner overcalls in a major, the other major is the opponent's suit.

 

Rik

 

This, but 3♦ should be interpreted as natural and forcing so it shouldn't end there.

 

You could also play something lebensohl like over 2♥ (or transfers).

[FelicityR]

Personally I find bidding 3♦ with the West cards bizarre. I realise the post is about using cue bids after a multi 2♦, but surely the sensible bid is 4♥.

 

With a balanced hand, doubleton ♠ and 4 card ♥ support there's only bid I would consider. Yes, we may miss a slam, but hoping that partner will interpret 3♦ as cue bid (without prior agreement) is asking for trouble, I feel.

[wank]

use the other major as a cuebid. 99% of the time opener's suit is the one partner didn't overcall. the 1% of the time when it's not, you probably want to be in no trumps.

[steve2005]

2♦is artificial. Taking a 3♦bid by advancer as an artificial cue-bid is not normal. Normal is natural. Sure you could with agreement use as a transfer, Lebensohl or something else as others have mentioned.

[Finch]

3♦ is just natural and forcing.

The West hand has a normal 4♥ bid, without worrying about what is a cue bid and what isn't.

 

that said, I also play bidding the other major as a cue (but a jump in the other major as natural)

[Fluffy]

I use 3 spades as the cuebid and 2 spades as natural.

[pstansbu]

Thanks all, obvious when pointed out that you can assume the other Major is their suit and cue bid that - leaving 3♦ intact as natural....

 

When using 3 ♦ as forcing is this in the context of playing all new suit advances as forcing or even mixing them up - and playing them as forcing when it seems we have the strong hands but non-forcing after a normal 1 level opening?