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Totally Nutty Or Not

eagles123
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m1cha

m1cha

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I opened 1N because it was the BBO weeklong thing and why not but is it actually terrible bridge?

What I like about it is that the alternatives are just as bad. If you open 1♠ and get a response of 1NT or 2♠, 3♠ would be an overbid and if you stay at 2♠ you may easily miss game. So unless partner is easily irritated, why not show your points by opening 1NT with a 6-card major as bad as that? So far my robot partners haven't yelled at me.

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Winstonm

Winstonm

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The problem with 1N to me is that the spade length is not that valuable missing so many top honor but it is worth a lot in spades even opposite xx support as it represents not only tricks but control.

 

As to looking ahead, I think it is fairly easy - rebid 2S - it isn't all that great of hand; or bid 3S if you can't stand 2S. Either way, I think emphasizing the spade suit is what needs to be done.

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rmnka447

rmnka447

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If the ♠ suit was a minor suit, 1 NT would be absolutely right. You wouldn't want to have bid 1 m then jump rebid 3 m on that suit.

 

With a premium on major suit fits, I not sure that it is right with a bad 6 card major. But then again if you use the "one card off" approach of considering what bid would be appropriate if one of the ♠ were a card in another suit. I don't think most people would have a problem opening 1 NT with J10xxx AKx KQ Kxx or similar.

 

But maybe the best thing is to also consider possible auctions after 1 NT. Stayman is easy. But how about transfers? Would partner take a 2 ♠ rebid over a 2 ♦ transfer to 2 ♥ to show ♠? How about minor suit transfers or even an invitational 2 NT/game forcing 3 NT raise? If you feel you can land on your feet after such auctions, then 1 NT seems OK. If not, 1 ♠ might be better.

 

Personally, I'd probably bid 1 ♠ and continue 2 ♠ over a Forcing NT. If partner makes any noise over 2 ♠, then I would come to life. That's following the old adage that "You can add value to a hand later in the auction, but it's near impossible to ever subtract values." This hand would be at the bottom edge of a jump rebid hand, at best. So a slight underbid probably gets you in less trouble than pushing the value of the hand.

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silvr bull

silvr bull

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rmnka447 said it perfectly. Apparently, there are few things one can do in the long BBO tournaments that are terrible bridge. I bid the South hand below to a normal 6D in a Daylong tournament. That was a good result, but the guy in 6NT scored better. His auction is shown below. Now that is terrible bridge!

 

[hv=pc=n&s=sakqt2hk8dat3c765&n=shqjt7dkqj962caj4&d=n&v=0&b=1&a=1dp6nppp]266|200[/hv]

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sfi

sfi

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Semi-serious question: Do you show your six-card major over Stayman?

 

I recently had a similar decision after opening 2NT and hearing partner bid puppet stayman. Holding a solid 6 card heart suit I thought it would be churlish to not show 5 of them. Sadly both hearts and NT both took 9 tricks. :(

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helene_t

helene_t

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I, too, would open 1NT in a daylong. GIB will often lead (or switch to) spades, and besides there is no risk of creating an implicit agreement that needs to be disclosed.

 

In a human game, I wouldn't.

 

And yes, the plan is to deny a 4-card major in response if partner bids stayman.

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neilkaz

neilkaz

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That guys is nuts. Let me tell you why.

This is an easy 1♠ followed by 2♠, which shows 13-15, we have 16 but a terrible 16.

You open 2 ♠ with 10-12 6 carder in 4th seat.

Most people miss this.

 

Yes THIS !!! Wonderful advice that I will make sure my PD's read.

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sfi

sfi

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That guys is nuts. Let me tell you why.

This is an easy 1♠ followed by 2♠, which shows 13-15, we have 16 but a terrible 16.

You open 2 ♠ with 10-12 6 carder in 4th seat.

Most people miss this.

 

On this hand you miss a perfectly good game that way, which you find by opening 1NT.

 

Calling Pete nuts just because you don't agree with him is pretty poor form. He's going to the Bermuda Bowl this year, so he must have some idea.

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Kaitlyn S

Kaitlyn S

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That guys is nuts. Let me tell you why.

This is an easy 1♠ followed by 2♠, which shows 13-15, we have 16 but a terrible 16.

You open 2 ♠ with 10-12 6 carder in 4th seat.

Most people miss this.

It's not that terrible; Kaplan-Rubens rates it at 15.40.

 

However, 1S followed by 2S is at least close to the description of this hand in any seat, which is more than can be said for any other sequence. In fourth seat it's a no-brainer; for I'm assuming your "10-12" is HCP and most evaluation systems are going to rate that hand higher (for example, KQTxxx, xx, AJx, xx is 12.40) so the actual hand is only 3 points better than a clear 4th seat 2S opener.

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MrAce

MrAce

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On this hand you miss a perfectly good game that way, which you find by opening 1NT.

 

Calling Pete nuts just because you don't agree with him is pretty poor form. He's going to the Bermuda Bowl this year, so he must have some idea.

 

"Nuts" is not something as bad as you think it is. The way it is used in USA it is more of a compliment than insult actually. I know very well that he is going to BB.

Someone has to go to BB from that zone. Don't give me lecture as if he managed to go to BB from Europe. Players from Guadalupe, Singapore, Tunisia are also going to BB. Probably going every 4 year and much more than this guy will ever go, but that does not help them improve an inch.

FYI, there are people who went to BB from much more difficult zones and here is what they think about 1 NT.

 

http://bridgewinners...m-2-jjmxdyl1z6/

 

And since when it has been your priority to find games at a MP event? Of course it works when your pd has 6 card ♥ and 8 hcp and decided to pass!!!. It does not work so well when your pd passes 1 NT with doubleton ♠ or 3 card ♠ or 4 card ♠ and they find a running suit, does it? It does not work so well when they bid and raise hearts or clubs or diamonds to the 3 level and to watch them play while you have 9 or 10 card ♠ fit, does it? It does not work so well when your pd transfers to a minor and you end up playing 6-2 minor when 8 or 9 card ♠ fit was available, does it? It does not work so well when pd bids 3 NT and you go down when 4♠ was cold, does it?

 

He's going to the Bermuda Bowl this year, so he must have some idea.

Everyone in the world, 90 % of the conventions in the world are made for finding a major fit, they have some idea too. Just because someone is gonna visit the BB and will be a contender from a zone which has no success whatsoever does not mean I will worship his ideas. Forget about opening 1 NT, his comment which says "this hand has a rebid problem" is wrong. Plain wrong due to the 4th seat 2 openings.

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eagles123

eagles123

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lol Timo maybe if you included in your poll that this was with GIB you might get a different result. Of course if you have methods to deal with his hand then 1 spade opening is completely normal and most if not all of the expert players in that poll will have methods. Also in weekly free sometimes it's a case of deviating from the norm slightly to try and get a top result.

 

I disagree that it's an easy 1s 1N 2s hand it feels like a distinct underbid to me despite the 4th seat aspect, whereas of course 1s 1N 3S is big overbid.

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MrAce

MrAce

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lol Timo maybe if you included in your poll that this was with GIB you might get a different result. Of course if you have methods to deal with his hand then 1 spade opening is completely normal and most if not all of the expert players in that poll will have methods. Also in weekly free sometimes it's a case of deviating from the norm slightly to try and get a top result.

 

I disagree that it's an easy 1s 1N 2s hand it feels like a distinct underbid to me despite the 4th seat aspect, whereas of course 1s 1N 3S is big overbid.

 

Go check what GIB opens 2♠ in 4th seat. So do not try to slip away. You could have a point if I made a note in the poll that says "your 2 spade opening is 10-12 hcp" I did not mention it in the poll to be fair. And please, again, do not tell me what I should have mentioned in the question when it was YOU who did not mention us that this was against GIB! I asked it in BW as you gave it to us here. I did not add or take anything from your original question as it was asked to us here.

It is not my pet method and you know I am one of the very few in BBF who does not try to solve the asked questions with his pet toys. http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif

Just because it did not even occur to you, does not really change the fact that it is an easy 1sp-1NT-2sp. we all agree that 3 sp is an overbid. It is overbid at least for the people around here.

 

And my "nuts" word is nothing compared to what a very good player said about those who opened 1 NT( deluded masochists) with this hand in BW. None of these comments mean that guy is a bad player. You check the forums and you may find a really good player saying something that sounds "nuts" to you. You may find this among WC players as well where one of them thinks other one is nuts on a particular auction. I still think opening 1 NT with this hand, particularly in a MP event, is weird. But do not forget what I wrote in my first reply, that I personally made worse bids or plays myself so it is not in my "terrible bridge" category. Perhaps I use that term for much worse actions.

 

http://bridgewinners...m-2-jjmxdyl1z6/

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eagles123

eagles123

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Go check what GIB opens 2♠ in 4th seat. So do not try to slip away. You could have a point if I made a note in the poll that says "your 2 spade opening is 10-12 hcp" I did not mention it in the poll to be fair. And please, again, do not tell me what I should have mentioned in the question when it was YOU who did not mention us that this was against GIB! I asked it in BW as you gave it to us here. I did not add or take anything from your original question as it was asked to us here.

It is not my pet method and you know I am one of the very few in BBF who does not try to solve the asked questions with his pet toys. http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif

Just because it did not even occur to you, does not really change the fact that it is an easy 1sp-1NT-2sp. we all agree that 3 sp is an overbid. It is overbid at least for the people around here.

 

And my "nuts" word is nothing compared to what a very good player said about those who opened 1 NT( deluded masochists) with this hand in BW. None of these comments mean that guy is a bad player. You check the forums and you may find a really good player saying something that sounds "nuts" to you. You may find this among WC players as well where one of them thinks other one is nuts on a particular auction. I still think opening 1 NT with this hand, particularly in a MP event, is weird. But do not forget what I wrote in my first reply, that I personally made worse bids or plays myself so it is not in my "terrible bridge" category. Perhaps I use that term for much worse actions.

 

http://bridgewinners...m-2-jjmxdyl1z6/

 

Lol I never said anything about your "nuts" word And I did mention indirectly it was with GIB:

 

I opened 1N because it was the BBO weeklong thing and why not but is it actually terrible bridge?

 

you telling me you don't know that is playing with GIB lol?

 

I think bidding 1s 1N 2S opposite GIB will miss a ton of games on this hand. you obviously don't thats fine. I think most experts will have some convention to handle this hand, you don't again that's fine. Sure I should check what GIB plays exactly but I usually play these tournys without taking much care and just bid on instinct.

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