Opening bid

[shyams]

MPs - Red vs White - You as dealer hold:

[hv=pc=n&s=shqj6532dq3ckq943]133|100[/hv]

 

What is your call?

[MrAce]

One may open this 1♥ or may choose to pass. This is a matter of style.

 

Opening this hand weak 2♥ is a bridge crime, not a style.

[kenberg]

As of this moment, I am the only vote for pass. I pass, but I don't feel strongly about it, I can imagine 1H. I agree completely that 2H is not on my list.

[The_Badger]

hi shyams,

 

Rule of 20 - this is 21 - says open this hand 1♥, the sixth ♥ making it a definite one level opening even at red, I feel.

 

Not keen on ♦Qx outside the main suits, but the 6-5-2-0 (or 6-5-1-1) shape has great playing strength except if you have a massive misfit.

 

I agree with MrAce and kenberg that a 2♥ opening doesn't even enter the equation as you could miss game as partner doesn't need much to help you make one.

 

As for pass and competing later, well the opponents could be 4♠ before you can bid again, so pass is not on my radar either.

[Zelandakh]

Opening this hand weak 2♥ is a bridge crime, not a style.

At these colours perhaps but not/vulnerable, opening 2♥ planning to rebid 4♣ does not seem so unreasonable assuming it is not too good. On the other hand, coming from a UK (light opening) style makes this hand a wtp 1♥ opening.

[MrAce]

At these colours perhaps but not/vulnerable, opening 2♥ planning to rebid 4♣ does not seem so unreasonable assuming it is not too good. On the other hand, coming from a UK (light opening) style makes this hand a wtp 1♥ opening.

 

As I said, to me it is a crime. I should have mentioned that it is a crime for me in any vulnerability.

[ggwhiz]

1♥ as especially on these colours it is often now or never.

 

I stretch the shapely hands with short spades when spade bids by them can get annoying if you don't. Wrong texture/shape/potential/direction and a few other things for a weak two.

[Cyberyeti]

1♥ no second choice at these colours/position, 2♥ would only enter my head in 4th.

 

If I had better intermediate hearts, 4♥ would enter my head in 3rd NV.

[Phil]

My style is 1H, but w/r I'd open it 4.

[Kaitlyn S]

I'm the 20th vote and the first vote for 'other'. One might think i'my trying to out-Ken Ken, but it's not so.

 

First, to the 1H bidders. After 1H 1S 1NT 4S, are you bidding 5C now, or siting for the inevitable doubke? For a pass and pull shows a much betrer hand. Partner might be a bit surprised when they make an overtrick.

 

Nor do I like 4H which is pretty easy to punish at these colors. 4H shows about 8 tricks, and while I have a 5 loser hand, my suits are too moth-eaten to have much hope of taking 8 tricks without a fit.

 

And yet the 2H bidders promise too little offense. Partner would never expect game opposite a good fit and 2 cover cards.

 

Well, if 2H promises too little offense and 4H shows too much for this vulnerability, what about 3H?

 

About 6-7 tricks with hearts trump, sounds about right. Not much defense, sounds about right. Partner will raise with a good hand and moderate fit, or a couple of aces and a good fit with ruffing values - sounds good. Just preemptive enough that the opponents might find their 7 card spade fit with a 6-0 break instead of an ice cold 3NT. Oncertainly in a blue moon you will go down a lot but when is the last time your opponents cauggt you in 3H? That's my bid.

[P_Marlowe]

Pass.

 

It is close, 1H is ok as well.

If I choose to preempt, than 3H or 4H, but somehow

I prefer to have a better suit.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[The_Badger]

[Deleted - duplicated]

[The_Badger]

 

Well, if 2H promises too little offense and 4H shows too much for this vulnerability, what about 3H?

 

 

hi Kaitlyn S,

 

I like innovation, but "moth-eaten" (your words) 6 card suits pre-empts are not advisable red/white in 1st. Forget about what else you have in your hand, because pre-empts should promise virtually nothing outside, I feel.

 

I'll deal with the 1♥ - 1♠ - 1NT - 4♠ auction if it arises, in the meantime I will find the best opening bid with a hand that is easy to rebid if the opponents don't interfere. That is a gauge of an opening bid with a light(ish) hand: have you got a suitable rebid?

 

3♥s is miles worse (in my opinion) than 2♥, and 2♥ is pretty bad.

 

Nothing personal as everyone's entitled to their view. But many big hitters have also endorsed 1♥. I am merely a small time card shark in comparison :)

[Cyberyeti]

I'm the 20th vote and the first vote for 'other'. One might think i'my trying to out-Ken Ken, but it's not so.

 

First, to the 1H bidders. After 1H 1S 1NT 4S, are you bidding 5C now, or siting for the inevitable doubke? For a pass and pull shows a much betrer hand. Partner might be a bit surprised when they make an overtrick.

 

Nor do I like 4H which is pretty easy to punish at these colors. 4H shows about 8 tricks, and while I have a 5 loser hand, my suits are too moth-eaten to have much hope of taking 8 tricks without a fit.

 

And yet the 2H bidders promise too little offense. Partner would never expect game opposite a good fit and 2 cover cards.

 

Well, if 2H promises too little offense and 4H shows too much for this vulnerability, what about 3H?

 

About 6-7 tricks with hearts trump, sounds about right. Not much defense, sounds about right. Partner will raise with a good hand and moderate fit, or a couple of aces and a good fit with ruffing values - sounds good. Just preemptive enough that the opponents might find their 7 card spade fit with a 6-0 break instead of an ice cold 3NT. Oncertainly in a blue moon you will go down a lot but when is the last time your opponents cauggt you in 3H? That's my bid.

 

Depends what you open as a matter of course at the 1 level. If your openers are generally sound, it's more of a problem, but since we'd open say x, QJ109x, Qx, KQxxx, partner will not double if it's making an overtrick.

 

I don't think 4♥ was a serious suggestion at these colours.

 

The problem with 3♥ is what does partner do with say xxx, void, AKJxxx, Axxx ? you proceed to go off in 3♥ instead of making 7♣.

[mycroft]

If we find a fit, this will be golden, unless the opponents find their spades. Opponents tend to find their spades. I'm not 100% sure what 1♥ will gain me, especially because I have one, possibly no, trick on defence. I expect my last decision will be whether to convert -590 into something with double zeros.

 

If we don't find a fit, it's because partner has spades, and my hand is no help. It's double zero time again.

 

I can see opening this. I'd do it if my hearts were spades. But this looks like a trap for partner. I'm passing. Unlike MrAce, I can see a 2♥ call, because at least partner will know that they're not sacrificing against us. Of course he won't know that Kx Ax in the round suits will take 10 tricks (and be zero defence), so it's not like he'll have a good idea whether to sacrifice against *them*.

 

If I'm playing EHAA, of course, it's an auto-2♥, probably with a club bid next time around. But partner's going to expect what I have. That's also why EHAA isn't all that popular.

[jogs]

Opening this hand weak 2♥ is a bridge crime, not a style.

2♥. I commit the crime. Am will to compete with 3♣ if giving the chance.

6-5 come alive.

[Phil]

If I opened 2H I better be willing to bid at the 4 level. At these colors I'm not willing to do that.

 

There's a poker comparison - I'm 30 blinds deep, so I'm not willing to barrel on the turn with this, so it's fold or shove.

[jogs]

If I opened 2H I better be willing to bid at the 4 level. At these colors I'm not willing to do that.

 

There's a poker comparison - I'm 30 blinds deep, so I'm not willing to barrel on the turn with this, so it's fold or shove.

Why? Unlike poker you do have a partner. Show the 6-5 and let partner decide whether you should go pass the 3 level.

[Kaitlyn S]

Why? Unlike poker you do have a partner. Show the 6-5 and let partner decide whether you should go pass the 3 level.

Very interesting discussion in light of what just happened.

 

I opened up a 4-table team game. My partner was a 2/1 "expert" and yes, I ignored my own advice and played with an unknown partner. First hand, I had --, AQ10xxx, xx, K10xxx which I think is a lot closer to a 1-bid then the actual example in this thread since I might have 1.5 tricks on defense. (I have 2QT.) I opened 1H. Partner held a 24-count with heart support and after a couple rounds of bidding, bid 7H which got doubled. Turns out I was off a trump trick as well as the ace so 6H doesn't make either. As soon as he saw my hand, I had to find a substitute for the rest of the match.

 

Funny how a lesser player can't bid a slam without Blackwood and yet that seems to be missing from the arsenal of some experts; the other boards were pretty non-descript so I would have won the match with a novice who knew Blackwood. But you 1H openers on this hand, be prepared to play in a team game and have your partner leave in a huff 30 seconds into the match.

[mike777]

easy weak 2h opener, again partner and the opp need to know we might have this hand type.

 

 

Partnership agreements are important, I expect many on the forums to have an agreement to open this 1h which is fine if that is our system. Opening this 2h at this vul is very playable with agreements.

[Kaitlyn S]

easy weak 2h opener, again partner and the opp need to know we might have this hand type.

If partner passes and you're cold for five, it doesn't matter that partner knows you could hold this hand type because he's going to play you for the hand type you are much more likely to hold.

 

This is similar to the situation where someone plays all their two bids (including 2C) weak. "Partner knows I might have 28 points when I open 1S" but he's still going to play the odds and pass with a random 2-count; if he doesn't then you're going to be in a lot of hopeless games when you have the more typical 20 and play him for the more typical 6-point minimum.

[mike777]

If partner passes and you're cold for five, it doesn't matter that partner knows you could hold this hand type because he's going to play you for the hand type you are much more likely to hold.

 

This is similar to the situation where someone plays all their two bids (including 2C) weak. "Partner knows I might have 28 points when I open 1S" but he's still going to play the odds and pass with a random 2-count; if he doesn't then you're going to be in a lot of hopeless games when you have the more typical 20 and play him for the more typical 6-point minimum.

 

For starters it may help if you quote me in full if you disagree rather than edit my comments.

 

I agree with your main point that holding 6-5 is rare for a weak 2h opener. I am much less worried about missing 5 which is your second point.

 

 

You dont say this but posters fail to make the case that opening 1h makes it significantly more likely to get to a making 5.