How close is it to overcall?

[phoenix214]

[hv=pc=n&w=sk9532h87d3cajt65&d=s&v=0&b=11&a=2h]133|200[/hv]

 

Title - How close of on an overcall this is? IMP scoring.

[billw55]

I pass. If my partner made a call over 2♥, I would expect more than this, and particularly a more solid suit.

 

That said, I have seen worse.

[Hyperon]

I would feel more comfortable when I had an opening...

...so for me at least ♠J is missing.

[eagles123]

I'd bid, passing could easily lead to a double game swing imo

[gwnn]

2S. Is this really a worse hand than a minimum 5332?

[Hyperon]

2S. Is this really a worse hand than a minimum 5332?

 

The given hand on its own is not better or worse by definition. It would be worse than a 5332 opposite a partner that has all points in the red suits for example.

 

Knowing there are approximately 24 HCP that have yet to bid, you expect more bidding coming and it could get embarrasing. You need to draw a line somewhere.

[eagles123]

The given hand on its own is not better or worse by definition. It would be worse than a 5332 opposite a partner that has all points in the red suits for example.

 

Knowing there are approximately 24 HCP that have yet to bid, you expect more bidding coming and it could get embarrasing. You need to draw a line somewhere.

 

edited

[Phil]

I'd probably pass with a dub heart.

[Hyperon]

yes it could be embarrasing when it goes p 4h all pass and pard has some boring hand where 4s is cold. honestly i think passing is terrible.

 

I can think of many terrible auctions for us as well after 2♠. It does not prove anything.

 

My bet is that you will have on average a worse score when bidding on this compared to passing. I'd hope we can get a simulation by someone.

[mikestar13]

I pass this one, my concern is we may get too high if partner has a good hand and expects more. Switch the red suits and I bid 2♠.

[WesleyC]

With a singleton heart I think 2S would be automatic. With a doubleton I might lean towards pass but it's certainly close.

[SteveMoe]

I put about 25 HCP between LHO and partner. Pass. Bidding is far from over.

[nekthen]

This hand is why Leaping Michaels was invented. Get the hand off your chest with 4♣, then pass for the rest of the auction with a clear conscience. If you are not playing this, I think you have to pass.

[eagles123]

This hand is why Leaping Michaels was invented. Get the hand off your chest with 4♣, then pass for the rest of the auction with a clear conscience. If you are not playing this, I think you have to pass.

 

the hand is nowhere near strong enough for leaping mike, it's either 2s or pass. 4c would be an insane overbid.

[notproven]

Bidding in direct seat is insane (pass out seat is another matter entirely) if you are playing any standard American system. A bid in direct seat promises (as Eddie Kantar writes) "a solid opening hand, in blood." Bidding 2♠ because you would open such a hand 1♠ is contrary to standard bidding principles, because you would only open such a hand as a kind of pre-empt (to use up the one level). To overcall 2 ♠ would therefore be "pre-empting over a pre-empt;" not standard practice.

 

I won't criticize players who do bid 2♠, if they have special agreements with partner and appropriately alert them. It can work well, but only if the partnership has ways to get out at a low level if fourth seat has a moderate hand. If you spring a 2♠ bid, or any bid, with this hand on a partner who isn't expecting it, you'll probably be looking for a new partner.

 

In the pass out seat, I'd overcall this hand without hesitation.

[johnu]

This hand is why Leaping Michaels was invented. Get the hand off your chest with 4♣, then pass for the rest of the auction with a clear conscience. If you are not playing this, I think you have to pass.

 

I don't think so. You are forcing your side to the 4 level with a hand that a large percentage of players don't think is worth a 2♠ overcall. Common expert practice is that leaping Michaels shows a strong playing hand. If you were playing Leaping Michaels and made one on this hand, it's highly unlikely you would end up in a makeable game because partner would put you in a slam on most hands when they have enough to make game.

[nekthen]

I guess I stand corrected. imho if you are going to wait for a hand that strong you will wait forever. As previously pointed out, the next bid you hear will be 4♥, which will be passed out, probably for an average score. I think that if partner knows what to expect (mine does) (not at red), he is in a much better position to judge what to do with 4♥, and we have put more pressure on North who has no chance to be scientific.

[forgo]

pass. there is going to be more bidding on this hand... to bid now would be to mislead p

[ggwhiz]

How close? NOT

 

When partner bids game on a great hand and you go for a number they tend to not be happy.

[Caitlynne]

If you have a two suited overcall gadget that shows the black suits, I would use it here. Marshall Miles advised in one of his books - and I confess I agree with him - that when the opponents make a weak 2 bid and you are two suited, (1) getting to the right strain is more important than getting to the right level and (2) you have a good likelihood of finding a fit. Given that, it seems best to bid.

 

If you don't have a two suited overcall gadget, I think you have to pass. Bidding only one of your suits is too risky in terms of finding a fit. What's more, partner expects sound opening honor values for an overcall of a weak 2 bid and your 8 HCP just does not come close enough to that to risk misleading partner about your values.

[iandayre]

This hand is why Leaping Michaels was invented. Get the hand off your chest with 4♣, then pass for the rest of the auction with a clear conscience. If you are not playing this, I think you have to pass.

 

Leaping Michaels shows a GOOD HAND. This isn't close to qualifying.

[MrAce]

PASS

[P_Marlowe]

Pass.

 

The main problem is the suit quality, move the Ace of club to spades,

and I am willing to start discussing 2S, I still would prefer a 6th

spade, but ok ... the hand with shortage needs to act.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[gwnn]

PASS

I don't know if we can still be friends :(

[MrAce]

I don't know if we can still be friends :(

 

Heh, this is the 4th topic I had seen in 1 month, all of which are exactly 8 hcp and bicolor hands with ♠+minor when they open weak 2♥

 

http://bridgewinners...ease-imp-pairs/ Here it is considered a bad bid by many and there he had 6 card ♠ suit headed with Ace. I had 2 more in facebook closed group. One of them ending with -1400 other one ending up playing 4♠ when his pd holds a balanced 13 hcp and 3 card support vs a 2 level overcall. They end up going down 3 for -300, undoubled, while other table writes a plus score by simply letting them play 2♥.

 

And yes! We can still be friends, despite the fact that you are weak over weak bidder!!! http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif Which is a BIG no no for me. I mean...joke aside, what is it that makes you want to bid badly weak over weak? Is it the suit quality of your spades? Is it the xx ♥? Funny as it is, you will not even know whether 3 ♣ is better place to run or not when doubled in 2♠. although playing 2♠ doubled is my last concern. It has too many other ways of going wrong, which includes mis defending by partner vs their final contract due to your overcall.