what to bid

[nullve]

Or use Kokish for 20-21 or 22 with escapes to 2M or 3m.

Or a variation of this, such as

 

2♣ = 20-21 bal. or GF

...2♦+: either transfers a la Welland-Auken or simply

...2♦ = waiting

......2♥ = Kokish: 5+ H or 25+ bal.

......2N = 20-21 bal.

......other = standard

...2M/3m = to play opposite 20-21 bal.

2N = 22-24 bal.

Edited April 21, 2016 by nullve

[Tramticket]

This is a very valid argument. Of course you cannot prevent partner placing a yarborough on the table, but you can make it more bearable by not having silly opening bids. Not so long back, many people round here were opening 2NT on 19/20.

 

How about opening 2NT (Actually a Benji 2C-2d-2NT sequence) on 18-19?! http://www.mrbridge.co.uk/forum/index.php?p=/discussion/340/benji-2-club-opening#latest

[PhilG007]

I reckon you give him too much credit. I am inclined to the view that he sincerely believes his own advice.

Damn right I do...and I suspect you do as well (!) How often do you

talk to the Man in the Mirror(?) :P :P

[rmnka447]

Make the cheapest forcing bid if no firm agreement exists about NMF. Playing NMF, make the strongest NMF bid possible. So, if you play 2-way NMF make the GF bid.

 

The hard part may be to decide how to proceed over partner's next rebid.

[PhilG007]

I'm pretty sure it's possible. The incompetent are often simply unable to realize the depths of their own incompetence. See Dunning-Kruger effect. To me it's perfectly possible that Phil has been trapped playing in a solely rubber bridge playing circle for past 40 years or whatever with people playing antiquated methods, not exposed to an environment where michaels cue bids or negative doubles are routine, not playing duplicate, then somehow managed to discover BBO and the forums a couple years ago. And has a completely warped view of what constitutes good bridge, and of his own skill level.

 

If it is all an elaborate prank, then it's a pretty long time to be running a prank.

I've earned red masterpoints. Last time I noticed these are only awarded if you do well in big real time tournaments.

I've had to give up real time tournament bridge because earning a living had to take precedence.

As for the "antiquated" charge. Yes,it's true I am of the so-called "Old Guard". So what? The youngsters could

learn a thing or from us 'veterans' I don't play 'Micheals' or 'Negative doubles' because they don't fit in with my style.

To each their own,says I. I have 30 years playing experience...sometimes harsh experience. The bridge club in my city is

a private one and very strict and selective on who gets entrance. You had to prove your ability as a 'probationer'

for a certain time before being elevated to the 'Big Club'

If anyone doubts me as a player,then take me on head to head in a challenge match. THEN we'll see who's the master and who's the duffer :)

[Jinksy]

I've earned red masterpoints. Last time I noticed these are only awarded if you do well in big real time tournaments.

I've had to give up real time tournament bridge because earning a living had to take precedence.

As for the "antiquated" charge. Yes,it's true I am of the so-called "Old Guard". So what? The youngsters could

learn a thing or from us 'veterans' I don't play 'Micheals' or 'Negative doubles' because they don't fit in with my style.

To each their own,says I. I have 30 years playing experience...sometimes harsh experience. The bridge club in my city is

a private one and very strict and selective on who gets entrance. You had to prove your ability as a 'probationer'

for a certain time before being elevated to the 'Big Club'

If anyone doubts me as a player,then take me on head to head in a challenge match. THEN we'll see who's the master and who's the duffer :)

 

I believe Timo already offered you the same challenge, and after a lot of bluster you failed to pick up the gauntlet. I'm sure he'd still be willing to make the offer if you've changed your mind, though.

[Phil]

I've earned red masterpoints. Last time I noticed these are only awarded if you do well in big real time tournaments.

 

This actually fits with what you are saying, sort of. Red points were prized....up until 1975 or so, when gold points were implemented. Now, red points are the "consolation prize" that you get in single session side games, section placings, match awards, but not overalls.

 

There's one other place you can get reds, and that's international tourneys where you represent the US, but I'll go out on a limb and say this isn't the source of yours.

 

I've had to give up real time tournament bridge because earning a living had to take precedence.

 

 

Most of us have full time jobs here. I work for the largest auto company in the world. I choose to use my leisure time and $ going to tournaments because I like to play bridge instead of just talking about it.

 

As for the "antiquated" charge. Yes,it's true I am of the so-called "Old Guard". So what? The youngsters could

learn a thing or from us 'veterans'

 

What in the world could a veteran like you teach an up and coming player unless you consider trolling a valuable trait?

 

I don't play 'Micheals' or 'Negative doubles' because they don't fit in with my style.

 

Then you will get absolutely crushed if you cannot compete effectively at any form of scoring, including rubber. But if your 'style' includes a nuanced bidding style where your tone can parse a penalty double from a cooperative one from takeout, you really don't need to learn anything new.

 

To each their own,says I. I have 30 years playing experience...sometimes harsh experience. The bridge club in my city is

a private one and very strict and selective on who gets entrance. You had to prove your ability as a 'probationer' for a certain time before being elevated to the 'Big Club'

 

Can I show them my red point total to play in the big game?

 

If anyone doubts me as a player,then take me on head to head in a challenge match. THEN we'll see who's the master and who's the duffer :)

 

Anytime. Any place. For any stakes sir.

[PhilG007]

I believe Timo already offered you the same challenge, and after a lot of bluster you failed to pick up the gauntlet. I'm sure he'd still be willing to make the offer if you've changed your mind, though.

He knows where to find me if he's serious. Whatever else I may be,I'm no coward.I'll actually relish the

chance of taking someone who,I suspect is just another of these so-called pseudo 'experts' that seem to

dog BBO down a peg or two. Bring it on I'm waiting ! :)

[Phil]

He knows where to find me if he's serious. Whatever else I may be,I'm no coward.I'll actually relish the

chance of taking someone who,I suspect is just another of these so-called pseudo 'experts' that seem to

dog BBO down a peg or two. Bring it on I'm waiting ! :)

 

I am on most weekday evenings but I have commitments Monday and Tuesday.

 

You issued the challenge. I accept it. I expect you to reach out to me.

 

Edit: I'll send an email to Timo.

[billw55]

I've earned red masterpoints. Last time I noticed these are only awarded if you do well in big real time tournaments.

Red points are awarded ... for all events at a regional tournament when the masterpoints are not gold

[Jinksy]

He knows where to find me if he's serious.

 

Well actually he doesn't. IIRC he messaged you, requesting a time for the game and you never responded. Unless you expect him to show up at your house with two robot companions, I'd say the onus is on you.

 

Whatever else I may be,I'm no coward.

 

No, of course not.

 

[rmnka447]

There may be some miscommunication going on in this brouhaha.

 

I note PhilG007 is listed as being in the UK. So when PhilG007 refers to red points, it's unclear if the reference is to points earned in the UK on a different footing, or, possibly referring to points actually won in the US a very long time ago.

 

Some replies seem geared toward "pigmented" points as awarded here in the US.

 

In the US, way back -- red points were awarded only at regional/national tournaments and all other points (club games, sectionals) were just black points.

 

Then the ACBL decided to add gold points to distinguish high place finishes at regionals/nationals. They also added silver points for points earned at sectional tournaments to encourage attendance there. Gold and silver point requirements were rolled into the requirements for achieving various master rank categories.

 

I can recall finishing a regional Swiss with 6 1/4 wins (predating Victory points) and winning something like 8 or 9 red points. So, at one time, earning red points were a measure of some prowess. Alas, but no more.

[Vampyr]

There may be some miscommunication going on in this brouhaha.

 

I note PhilG007 is listed as being in the UK. So when PhilG007 refers to red points, it's unclear if the reference is to points earned in the UK on a different footing, or, possibly referring to points actually won in the US a very long time ago.

 

The points were not earned in the UK unless PhilG007 had red/green colourblindness.

 

Some replies seem geared toward "pigmented" points as awarded here in the US.

 

In the US, way back -- red points were awarded only at regional/national tournaments and all other points (club games, sectionals) were just black points.

 

Then the ACBL decided to add gold points to distinguish high place finishes at regionals/nationals. They also added silver points for points earned at sectional tournaments to encourage attendance there. Gold and silver point requirements were rolled into the requirements for achieving various master rank categories.

 

I can recall finishing a regional Swiss with 6 1/4 wins (predating Victory points) and winning something like 8 or 9 red points. So, at one time, earning red points were a measure of some prowess. Alas, but no more.

 

That must have been a very long time ago, because my first ACBL event was a regional Swiss teams and we got gold points for that. That was almost 30 years ago.

 

We got 5 or 6 for finishing equal 5th-8th (also w/l of course) so it seems like they made an even exchange.

 

So first red, then gold (which you can now win in pretty low-limit events)... what points are the ACBL going to introduce once they devalue platinum points?

[Stephen Tu]

The points were not earned in the UK unless PhilG007 had red/green colourblindness.

 

He claims to be Scottish ... the SBU web site still seems to refer to red / national points so perhaps he is claiming some of these. How many of these is supposed to be impressive probably greatly depends on when they were earned?

[gwnn]

http://bestpickr.com/wp-content/uploads/Black-Cat-Attacks-Dog.gif

[rmnka447]

 

That must have been a very long time ago, because my first ACBL event was a regional Swiss teams and we got gold points for that. That was almost 30 years ago.

 

So first red, then gold (which you can now win in pretty low-limit events)... what points are the ACBL going to introduce once they devalue platinum points?

The Swiss I referred to was in the mid-late '70s as I recall. So, yes, it was way back there.

[Zelandakh]

He claims to be Scottish ... the SBU web site still seems to refer to red / national points so perhaps he is claiming some of these. How many of these is supposed to be impressive probably greatly depends on when they were earned?

From the SBU Master Points Handbook.

National points or Red points are awarded in National events. In addition each District is allowed to run one Congress per annum and award National Points for the Finals of the Pairs and/or Teams Event or to the top quarter of the field if the event is Swiss Pairs or Teams. If Swiss events are played only the bonus points are National Points, awards for matches won are Local points. 100 National Points are equal to one National Master Point. For reference purposes all awards are quoted as gross figures in this handbook and will be divided by 100 on entry to the player’s Master Point record.

[Vampyr]

Oh dear, I had for some reason thought that the SBU had a similar system to the EBU, since they used to both be "British".

[PhilG007]

This actually fits with what you are saying, sort of. Red points were prized....up until 1975 or so, when gold points were implemented. Now, red points are the "consolation prize" that you get in single session side games, section placings, match awards, but not overalls.

 

There's one other place you can get reds, and that's international tourneys where you represent the US, but I'll go out on a limb and say this isn't the source of yours.

 

 

 

Most of us have full time jobs here. I work for the largest auto company in the world. I choose to use my leisure time and $ going to tournaments because I like to play bridge instead of just talking about it.

 

 

 

What in the world could a veteran like you teach an up and coming player unless you consider trolling a valuable trait?

 

 

 

Then you will get absolutely crushed if you cannot compete effectively at any form of scoring, including rubber. But if your 'style' includes a nuanced bidding style where your tone can parse a penalty double from a cooperative one from takeout, you really don't need to learn anything new.

 

 

 

Can I show them my red point total to play in the big game?

 

 

 

Anytime. Any place. For any stakes sir.

This guy reminds me of "Mr Smug" One of legendary bridge player and author S.J. Simon's "Infamous Bridge Foursome". The other three members were

"Mrs Guggenhiem" "Futile Willie" and "The Unlucky Expert" :)

[Zelandakh]

This guy reminds me of "Mr Smug" One of legendary bridge player and author S.J. Simon's "Infamous Bridge Foursome". The other three members were

"Mrs Guggenhiem" "Futile Willie" and "The Unlucky Expert" :)

By all means disagree with what someone is saying but attacking in this way is just bad form. I believe all of the forum regulars that post in this form have received official warnings at various times so I would ask you to try and stick with bridge commentary. The rest of the community can then disagree with you without necessarily throwing similar insults back in return. (one can hope!)

[Jinksy]

Especially bad form to call someone smug just a couple of posts after boasting of your Master Point total.

 

I assume you've contacted Phil per his request, to name a convenient time to take all his money?

[PhilG007]

Well actually he doesn't. IIRC he messaged you, requesting a time for the game and you never responded. Unless you expect him to show up at your house with two robot companions, I'd say the onus is on you.

 

 

 

No, of course not.

 

Crude...but not unexpected :(

[PhilG007]

By all means disagree with what someone is saying but attacking in this way is just bad form. I believe all of the forum regulars that post in this form have received official warnings at various times so I would ask you to try and stick with bridge commentary. The rest of the community can then disagree with you without necessarily throwing similar insults back in return. (one can hope!)

Well Phil's comments about me were hardly complimentary either. If you come at me with your fists doubled,

I think I can promise you that mine will double just as quick. If you don't want to be shocked then

don't tread on 'live' wires(!) :)

[PhilG007]

Especially bad form to call someone smug just a couple of posts after boasting of your Master Point total.

 

I assume you've contacted Phil per his request, to name a convenient time to take all his money?

I will face him but time zone differences are going to be a problem.

[mycroft]

To the OP:[hv=pc=n&s=sak963h82dk6cakj7&d=n&v=0&b=1&a=1cp1sp1np]133|200|Spots approximate[/hv]

 

You start with 2♦ - and hope that partner isn't so old-fashioned that he passes.

 

You don't have diamonds - in fact you have clubs? Yes, but there's no forcing club bid available, and a "new suit by responder" is 100% forcing. In fact, so many people made this bid with this hand (back in 1950 or so) that everybody started expecting it to be "forcing, should have diamonds, but I wouldn't count on it"; and then they just decided "why not just play this as "forcing, says nothing about diamonds; I'll have time to confirm diamonds later". Voila, New Minor (after 1minor-1Major-1NT) Forcing, or NMF. A Convention Is Born.

 

Most people will understand this; almost everybody will bid whether or not they understand; many will (and all should) bid 2♠ with 3 spades (which is exactly what you want to hear). If not, you can bid 3♣ on your next turn. This one's a little more dangerous (opposite a new bridge player you don't know), but the reasoning is as follows:

• If I just had clubs and a bad hand, I could have bid 2♣ over 1NT, "to play";
  
• If I just had clubs and an invite, I could have bid 3♣ over 1NT, passable;
  
• If I had 5 spades and a bad hand, I would have given up on the clubs and bid 2♠ over 1NT, to play;
  
• If I had 5 spades and and invite, I'd give up on the clubs, and make my 2NT/3NT/pass call now.
  

So, 2♦, then 3♣ shows the "too strong to worry about you passing" raise. Because of the weird way the scoring works, this implies slam interest (especially if partner responded 2NT to 2♦, implying a diamond card). You're in control, hopefully, no matter what happens.

 

What if partner does something that doesn't let you bid 3♣ (bid it himself, say, or 3NT?) Well, aren't you happy now? Partner's got extra clubs or a full maximum for 1NT; we can afford to go past 3NT looking for slam (we hope).