Fluffy Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 [hv=pc=n&w=sat742h62da73caq4&e=sk863htdk962ck962&d=n&v=e&b=9&a=pp4hppp]266|200[/hv] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ggwhiz Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 I have a lot of sympathy. Bidding could go for a number and even a small one would be a likely loss from Wests point of view. They are very unlikely to make this and he is facing a passed hand partner. 4♠ does not appeal and double rates to get 5 of a minor although my partner will pass unless they have a live expectation of going plus on offence. East can reopen with a double and hope it doesn't get rewound but it's out there. I blame east for not having 2 more hearts and 2 fewer spades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 I have sympathy with both. I have sympathy for East complaining that his partner didn't make a takeout double with three aces and playability in every suit. I also have sympathy for West complaining that his partner didn't make a passed hand takeout double with the perfect shape to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted December 19, 2015 Report Share Posted December 19, 2015 West passing is completely insane to me. I don't know about the passed hand takeout X but I know I should do them more often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manudude03 Posted December 19, 2015 Report Share Posted December 19, 2015 West has an easy double for me. East shouldn't be bidding 5m without some expectation of making it- especially at this vulnerability, so it is fairly safe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gszes Posted December 19, 2015 Report Share Posted December 19, 2015 east 100% the logic is somewhat circular but undeniable.N and E are both passed hands so their "average" amount of hcp is generally around 6. S has bid 4h so their hcp power is generally around 8 but opposite a passed hand the range is much wider but still wont often be more than 10. So W 14 + S "10" = 24 leaving around 8 each for N and E. A lot depends on E heart holding for game to have a serious shot and even betterE (in po seat) will be able to do a similar calculation and realize we actually rate to be very close to 14 as a minimum and w/o too much in hearts given the 4h bid. I would x 4h as E in the po seat and be completely unsurprised when 4s makes easily. The doubleton heart just makes a x by W over 4h too risky especially opposite a passed hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilKing Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 Just because East is a passed hand does not change the fact that reopening with a double is totally insane at these colours. The 4♥ opening could be very heavy and we have no defensive tricks if partner does not feel like going for 1100. West should double - cooperative for me, but guaranteeing a suitable dummy should partner want to bid 4♠. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhantomSac Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 Just because East is a passed hand does not change the fact that reopening with a double is totally insane at these colours. The 4♥ opening could be very heavy and we have no defensive tricks if partner does not feel like going for 1100. Absolutely this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all loomis Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 [hv=pc=n&w=sat742h62da73caq4&e=sk863htdk962ck962&d=n&v=e&b=9&a=pp4hppp]266|200[/hv]easy re-opening x. at pairs. young people should re open at any score, it toughens the moral fibre. not bidding with the w hand, beyond a slow pass- i'm already toughened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfi Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 Speaking as someone who likes opening 4H in 3rd seat, please double in pass-out seat with the East hand. As Phil said, West has a risky but reasonable double. East has no excuse for one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted December 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 I guess it was just bad luck as most people seem to think double is normal.[hv=pc=n&s=skt3hakqt932d5ckt&w=sa8762h64da62caq3&n=sqj954hjdkq73c642&e=sh875djt984cj9875&d=n&v=e&b=9&a=pp4hdp4np5cdppp]399|300[/hv] I bid 4NT and partner said he was going ot lead ♠A and expected me to pass with this. I said that if I would pass hishand without a seocnd thought and if I had a hand were 4♠ had good play I would probably reopen 4♥ with a double. I had to eat my own words because on the next day I had to face same bidding twice and I passed both with AK9x xx Qx 10xxxx and some 3244 10 count Regarding my decission I run a poll on BW: http://bridgewinners...27-3/?cj=291440 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilKing Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 I guess it was just bad luck as most people seem to think double is normal.[hv=pc=n&s=skt3hakqt932d5ckt&w=sa8762h64da62caq3&n=sqj954hjdkq73c642&e=sh875djt984cj9875&d=n&v=e&b=9&a=pp4hdp4np5cdppp]399|300[/hv] I bid 4NT and partner said he was going ot lead ♠A and expected me to pass with this. I said that if I would pass hishand without a seocnd thought and if I had a hand were 4♠ had good play I would probably reopen 4♥ with a double. I had to eat my own words because on the next day I had to face same bidding twice and I passed both with AK9x xx Qx 10xxxx and some 3244 10 count Regarding my decission I run a poll on BW: http://bridgewinners...27-3/?cj=291440 I don't understand the poll - you don't say how you play a double of 4♥. A lot of very top pairs do not play it as pure take out, (particularly in Europe). But even if it's pure take-out I would probably still pass it with two jacks and potentially good defence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manudude03 Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 As I said above, East shouldn't be bidding 5m (which 4NT effectively is) without some expectation of making it. So I'd be passing with the actual East hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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