Reversing

[keithhus]

Am getting myself a little confused and would appreciate advice.

Is reversing just re-bidding a higher suit at the 2 level to show 16 points or is it re-bidding a higher suit at the 2 level when one could have bid at the 1 level - I.e. Jumping.

I have been opening the bidding by bidding up the line but if reversing is the former, I assume I have to bid the higher suit first with less than 16 pts. e.g. 12-15 pts, Clubs 5, Spades 4.

Or am I totally mis understanding something? Thank you

[1eyedjack]

Have you read this thread?

 

 

EDIT

 

 

It has done that to me before. This should now work

 

http://www.bridgebas...post__p__178835

[fromageGB]

Link above not working, so in a nutshell a reverse is not a jump, but a bid of a new suit such that for partner to put you back into your first suit, the bidding needs to go to a higher level. For example, 1♥ 2♣ (opponents silent) .. then 2♦ is not a reverse, but 2♠ is.

 

However, this does not apply to a 1-level bid. 1♣ 1♥ 1♠ is not called a reverse.

[helene_t]

A reverse is a non-jump which bypasses the 2-level of your first bid suit.

 

A jump shift by opener is also strong but it is not called a reverse. It also works differently because a jump shift by opener is game forcing while a reverse by opener can be a tad weaker, say 17 or sometimes 16 points.

 

So with five clubs and four spades you cannot reverse unless partner responds 1nt. You open 1♣ regardless of strength and rebid 1♠ with 11-17(18) and 2♠ with (18)19+.

 

If partner responds 1nt you either pass or rebid 2♣ with 11-15(16) points. Playing weak nt, the 1nt response probably shows 6-9 so you can pass with a modest 16 count.

 

A "high reverse", i.e. a non-jump rebid at the 3-level such as

1♠-2♥

3♣

is game forcing so how many points it shows depends on the minimum strength of the 2♥ bid. In Acol, this 3♣ bid shows a minimum of 15 points, assuming that 2♥ shows at least a decent 9.

[mycroft]

The reason that reverses should show extras is simply what fromageGB said: "if responder wants to put you back in your [longer] first suit, the bidding needs to get to [the 3] level." Given that responder can have a bad 6, or an ace and out, means that if you bid this way with a minimum opener, you're almost certainly going down.

 

Now, once you realize that it's not reasonable to reverse with a minimum, you can take advantage of that when it does happen, knowing opener has extras.

 

One other warning: it is not a good idea to "fake a reverse":

• your first suit must be longer than your second - don't plan to bid 1♣-1♥; 2♦ with 3=2=4=4 "because I have 18" (and definitely don't do it with 3=1=5=4). Partner *will* take preference back to clubs with 3=3, possibly even 2=2 in the minors. It doesn't matter how many times you bid diamonds after opening 1♣, partner will not (and should not) take you for longer diamonds.
  
• don't reverse into a short (<4 card) suit "to show values". Again, you may never be able to convince partner that you don't actually have a fit there.
  Experts will do this, *if* they're sure they can control the auction later - but when it turns out they can't, it's still their fault. Novices and beginners are - less likely - to know that they can control the auction later; so don't do it.
   
  

 

Another note: as said above, 1x-1y; 1♠ isn't a reverse (responder can take the preference at the 2 level, not 3); and it depends on the system you're playing how forcing it is (in North American styles, it's "Not forcing, but almost never passed" - to about 19 or so).

[keithhus]

The reason that reverses should show extras is simply what fromageGB said: "if responder wants to put you back in your [longer] first suit, the bidding needs to get to [the 3] level." Given that responder can have a bad 6, or an ace and out, means that if you bid this way with a minimum opener, you're almost certainly going down.

 

Now, once you realize that it's not reasonable to reverse with a minimum, you can take advantage of that when it does happen, knowing opener has extras.

 

One other warning: it is not a good idea to "fake a reverse":

• your first suit must be longer than your second - don't plan to bid 1♣-1♥; 2♦ with 3=2=4=4 "because I have 18" (and definitely don't do it with 3=1=5=4). Partner *will* take preference back to clubs with 3=3, possibly even 2=2 in the minors. It doesn't matter how many times you bid diamonds after opening 1♣, partner will not (and should not) take you for longer diamonds.
  
• don't reverse into a short (<4 card) suit "to show values". Again, you may never be able to convince partner that you don't actually have a fit there.
  Experts will do this, *if* they're sure they can control the auction later - but when it turns out they can't, it's still their fault. Novices and beginners are - less likely - to know that they can control the auction later; so don't do it.
   
  

 

Another note: as said above, 1x-1y; 1♠ isn't a reverse (responder can take the preference at the 2 level, not 3); and it depends on the system you're playing how forcing it is (in North American styles, it's "Not forcing, but almost never passed" - to about 19 or so).

 

Thank you. Just to clarify and using your example, with 3=2=4=4 and 16+/LESS than 16pts, would I open the higher suit?

[1eyedjack]

Thank you. Just to clarify and using your example, with 3=2=4=4 and 16+/LESS than 16pts, would I open the higher suit?

Reverses are used to show 2-suited hands (with extras). 3=2=4=4 is balanced, and you should aim to show a balanced hand either by opening NT or rebidding NT, the precise sequence/order depending on your systemic ranges for NT opening bids (most significantly the 1NT opener). Assuming that you are not in range for systemic 1N opener you would open a 4 card suit and rebid NT at the appropriate level according to strength. In this case it probably does not matter a huge amount which of two 4 card minor suits you open, although it would be helpful in a regular partnership to be consistent and to agree on it. There are technical arguments in favour of either, but it is not a big issue.