Lack of Methods

[eagles123]

[hv=pc=n&s=s8ht94dat765ca643&n=st5hakqjdkq43cqt5]133|200[/hv]

 

all vul at imps two passes to north who opens 1n (15-17) p 3n ap

 

obv a disaster on a spade lead

 

any methods to get us to 4h?

[rmnka447]

Maybe South should think about using Stayman rather than ramming the contract into 3 NT.

 

Any time you have a stiff, it would be prudent to explore by whatever means possible whether partner can stop the suit. Unfortunately, there are only limited options for doing so after 1 NT.

 

If partner bids 2 ♠ over 2 ♣, then NT is OK. Even if partner has ♠ xxxx, with split honors, the opponents may find it difficult to lead ♠.

 

If partner bids 2 ♦, you can bid 3 ♦ and explore for a potential minor suit game. Or, possibly, if you have the agreement, bid 3 ♣ as a minor suit Stayman continuation.

 

If partner bids 2 ♥, South can consider raising ♥ and playing in a Moysian fit. The hand looks right for it as South holds controls in the hand's long suits which should help prevent opener from being forced in them quickly.

[kenrexford]

Many play that 1NT pass 3M shows 54 either way in the minors, 3-1 in the majors. Obviously, this works wonders here.

[Cyberyeti]

What do you play over 1N ? What is 2♠ for example if you don't play 4-suit transfers ?

[hevnandhel]

Agree with Ken.

[ggwhiz]

Many play that 1NT pass 3M shows 54 either way in the minors, 3-1 in the majors. Obviously, this works wonders here.

 

We just switched back to this after playing 3♥/♠ as showing 5-5, inv/forcing and having it never come up. We've avoided a doomed 3nt with Qxx or Jxx opposite a stiff twice in the last month and decided to include 6-3 in the minors as well.

[kenrexford]

We just switched back to this after playing 3♥/♠ as showing 5-5, inv/forcing and having it never come up. We've avoided a doomed 3nt with Qxx or Jxx opposite a stiff twice in the last month and decided to include 6-3 in the minors as well.

You can still handle the 55 majors, via 3D. That way, your 3D is 55 majors, invitational or better. Opener can save space with:

 

3M = choice, minimum

3N = max. 22

4M = max, preference

4C = max, heart preference, great

4D = max, spade preference, great

[kenrexford]

A completely different option is 2S, followed by 3M, by the way. Some play that, too. MSS

[Cyberyeti]

A completely different option is 2S, followed by 3M, by the way. Some play that, too. MSS

 

2♠ wto either minor or GF both using a 3M rebid for this hand to either focus on the long minor or short major is played, we focus on the minor length. Here, it would go 1N-2♠-3♣ showing 4 diamonds for us and whether your style is to bid the fragment or singleton next, you will establish the spade issue. We'll probably bid 5♦ rather than 4♥

[mycroft]

Yes, "standard" in the US for those who care about this situation is 3M either splinter or fragment with (13)(54). Arguments abound over whether to bid the 3 card fragment (and wrongside the Moysian if that's where you're going) or the singleton (and allow a free lead-directing (or lead-inhibiting) double against the eventual "I have a stopper" 3NT) which I won't get into (because I don't tend to play this, but I don't tend to play strong NT either).

 

My argument with pickups/occasionals is "I don't care what we play at the 3 level over our 1NT, it never comes up anyway. But if we don't discuss it, it will."

[gszes]

A method that most can use with little change in overall bidding:

 

1n 2s (if you are using 2s to transfer to clubs then POC)

1N 2N if playing 4wt

 

Follow this with 3h to show hearts stopped and a problem with spades. This suggests a hand strong enough to play 3n but with a long minor. Note that either method should be happy with 3n if opener can bid it since 5m looks pretty far away. Opener with only the Spade ace can bid 4s. If opener cannot bid 3n it is best to just try 5m via:

 

1N 2S method merely bid 5D as best guess but a 4s bid would be slightly better asking p to bid a 4+ card minor or 4n with neither

1N 2N bid 5c since u have already shown dia this will allow p to choose more easily.

 

Trying stayman first is entertaining and could work but p with 4 little spades may give the false impression spades are covered and there is really nothing left to do but bid NT. Even if p bids 2h great care is needed since p may be all too willing to jump to 4s if they began with 44 in the majors. If p bids 2h a 3s (splinter) may leave your side in much better shape in 4h than in either 3n or 5m if p has only a single spade stop.

[m1cha]

In GIB, 1NT - 2♠ is Minor Stayman. If you need 2♠ as a transfer, you might consider the sequence 1NT - 2♦ - 2♥ - 2♠ as Minor Stayman.

 

My own preference is

1NT - 2♦ - 2♥ - 2♠: 5-5 in Majors, invitational

1NT - 2♠: transfer to ♣ (with option to superaccept)

1NT - 2NT: transfer to ♦ (with option to superaccept)

1NT - 2♣: both minors, pass or correct

1NT - 2♠ - 2NT/3♣ - 3♦: both minors and some singleton/void), GF

1NT - 3♦: 5-5 in Majors, GF (option to stay in 3NT with opener 2-2 in Majors)

 

In this case,

1NT - 2♠ - 2NT/3♣ - 3♦ - 3♥ (good 4-card suit)

can lead you to 4♥ in a Moysian (right-sided) or to 5♦.

[jogs]

Too many hand types. Too few bidding sequences available. Can't be bothered. 3NT down lots. Next board.

[1eyedjack]

I agree with jogs. I also, with reg partners, have ways to show 1=3=5=4 gf but I don't think that I would wheel it out here. I am a bit fed up with GIB always wheeling out MSS on borderline invitational hands.

[eagles123]

thanks all!

[marcindz]

Exactly what jack said. But: if you were to use 5431 conventions's 3!s it might be followed with 4!h.

[SteveMoe]

Any Alan Truscott fans? He advocated an approach called the "Anti-Lemming" jump to 3M after partner opens 1N. 3M promises exactly 3 pieces in OM and no M stopper (0-2 cards). Opener can rebid a chunky 4-card OM in an attempt to gain the ll important exxtra 20 points for 4M over 5m, and avoid going negative in 3N.

[Vampyr]

Any Alan Truscott fans? He advocated an approach called the "Anti-Lemming" jump to 3M after partner opens 1N. 3M promises exactly 3 pieces in OM and no M stopper (0-2 cards). Opener can rebid a chunky 4-card OM in an attempt to gain the ll important exxtra 20 points for 4M over 5m, and avoid going negative in 3N.

 

Yes, this is mentioned above.

[lycier]

Many play that 1NT pass 3M shows 54 either way in the minors, 3-1 in the majors. Obviously, this works wonders here.

 

I disagree.

 

What you said is 5431 convention,generally speaking,it ask responder should promise 10hcp in the hand.

But for this hand,why does opener make 4♥? because there is no any wasted points in ♠,very lucky probability distribution.

Only with 8hcp,obviously,this usually doesn't work wonders there.

[Charlie Yu]

1NT-3D for 55 majors just doesn't sound right, I played 1NT-3m for 6 card m invitational and it works wonders

[nullve]

I'm an advocate of the "pass or bash" philosophy of responding to 1N. This frees up a lot of 2N bids, which allows me to play:

 

1N-?::

 

2♣ = "Stayman", incl. weak hands with 6+ m

...2♦ = no major

......P = 5+ D, weak

......(...)

......2N = "lebensohl"

.........3♣ = forced

............P = 6+ C, weak

............3♦-3♠ = GF with 4M4-OM and a a singleton/void. Usually no slam interest.

............Specifically:

............3♦ = SPL M

...............3♥ = relay

..................3♠ = SPL H [hence 4S1-H]

..................3N = SPL S [hence 1-S4H]

............3♥ = SPL C [hence 4M4-OM1-C]

............3♠ = SPL D [hence 4M4-OM1-D]

...2♥ = "H"

......(...)

......2N = "lebensohl"

.........3♣ = forced

............P = 6+ C, weak

............3♦ = 6+ D, weak

............3♥-3N = GF with 4S3-H and a singleton/void. Usually no slam interest.

............Specifically:

............3♥ = SPL C [hence 4S3-H1-C]

............3♠ = SPL D [hence 4S3-H1-D]

............3N = SPL H [hence 4S1-H]

...2♠ = "S"

......(...)

......2N = "lebensohl"

.........3♣ = forced

............P = 6+ C, weak

............3♦ = 6+ D, weak

............3♥-3N = GF with 4S3-H and a singleton/void. Usually no slam interest.

............Specifically:

............3♥ = SPL C [hence 3-S4H1-C]

............3♠ = SPL D [hence 3-S4H1-D]

............3N = SPL S [hence 1-S4H]

(...)

2N = Puppet Stayman

3♣ = 5+D5+C, weak

3♦-3♠ = GF with 3-S3-H and singleton/void. Usually no slam interest.

Specifically:

3♦ = SPL M [hence 1-M3-OM]

...3♥ = relay

......3♠ = SPL H [hence 3-S1-H]

......3N = SPL S [hence 1-S3-H]

3♥ = SPL C [hence 3-S3-H6+D1-C]

3♠ = SPL D [hence 3-S3-H1-D6+C]

[ggwhiz]

One thing that is common to many methods is that you lose something specific, ie.

 

With 5-5 in the majors we can pretty much play in 2 or 4. Invites are overrated and what we choose to lose when we have to lose something.

[Zelandakh]

Playing transfer rebids after a 2♦ transfer allows you to get the effect of the mentioned 1NT - 3♦ convention while retaining the hand type within the transfer structure. So after 1NT - 2♦; 2♥:-

2♠ = clubs or balanced or a strong 1-suiter

2NT = 5♥4♠, INV

3♣ = diamonds

3♦ = 5+ spades, GF

3♥ = 6+ hearts, INV

 

The hand types that are missing are invites with 5+♠ and 4+♥. The 5♠4♥ hand can then be handled through 2♣ (or, as I do, with a 2NT response) and 1NT - 2♥; 2♠ - 3♥ is available for 5-5 hands. Of course you can also move the 5♥4♠ invitational hand into 2♣ too in which case an extra sequence opens up.

 

It is also worth noting that playing 2♣ as something other than normal Stayman opens up additional possibilities for hands of this type.

 

Finally, as the OP is in England I will mention that Marc Smith did a series of articles in the bridge magazine addressing this and other aspects of designing a 1NT structure. It is a few years ago now (probably more than 10) but if you ask around someone might keep back copies and be able to lend you the relevant issues.

[kenrexford]

I disagree.

 

What you said is 5431 convention,generally speaking,it ask responder should promise 10hcp in the hand.

But for this hand,why does opener make 4♥? because there is no any wasted points in ♠,very lucky probability distribution.

Only with 8hcp,obviously,this usually doesn't work wonders there.

The question was methods. This person bid 3NT instead.

[KurtGodel]

Only with 8hcp,obviously,this usually doesn't work wonders there.

I think it's normal to bid 3NT at teams when vulnerable.