What does 5S mean？

[nicebbo]

[hv=pc=n&sn=TableHost&s=SJ974H97DA972C854&wn=West&w=SAK832HDKJT83CAT2&nn=North&n=SQT6HA8543D54C763&en=nicebbo&e=S5HKQJT62DQ6CKQJ9&d=w&v=b&b=36&a=1SP2HP4NP5CP5SP5NPPP&p=H4HKH7S2HQH9S3H5HJD7S8HAS6S5SJSAD3D4DQDAS4&c=11]399|300[/hv]

We were playing simple blackwood.

Edited October 4, 2015 by diana_eva
removed names

[Hanoi5]

Either your partner thought spades could be trumps or it's a relay for you to bid 5NT.

[nicebbo]

Just after I bid 5nt, my p(401221) said "part yr a BEGINNER ? not my level ? so please LEAVE THE GAME?????" "[host]? please boot him ot me???????"

And then I was removed by the host after my hand was exposed. I still don't know what happened. Did I make a stupid bid？

Edited October 4, 2015 by diana_eva
removed names

[steve2005]

The person who bids 4N Blackwood is in charge (this is called being the Captain) if they said 5♠ you should respect that and pass.

 

Now, they should have a self-sufficient long spade suit to bid 5♠, which he does not as nothing has said you have any ♠.

 

Also, is wrong for opener to jump to 4N, there is no reason they should think slam is possible they just have a normal hand except for the heart void. After you bid 2♥ his hand is actually worse and if missing an ace will not know if missing the A♥ for slam purposes, due to the ♥ void. So, bidding 4N is a very bad bid.

 

So, what should opener bid over 2♥, they should bid 3♦ to look for a fit. After you then bid 3N with ♣ well stopped, ending auction.

[1eyedjack]

I don't think that the host emerges with any credit. Booted the wrong player.

[billw55]

I don't think that the host emerges with any credit. Booted the wrong player.

Definitely agree.

 

nicebbo, don't worry about this too much. Some people on BBO are jerks. Just ignore them and play with someone else.

 

Technically, your partner's bidding does mean that he wants to play in 5♠, and so you should pass. Although, I suspect he would also criticize you for that.

 

Interestingly, 5NT is a much better contract than 5♠. I doubt your partner or the host noticed this.

[steve2005]

I once got booted for passing thruout opps bidding then sacking in 5♦ after they bid game. They didnt think I was playing nice in their sandbox lol.

[hevnandhel]

For what it's worth, nicebbo, I have observed your 'partner' making a significant number of actions that I considered to be poor (at best) in other instances, and as noted by others in this thread, their actions on this hand are not good from either a bridge or manners perspective.

[rmnka447]

Partner took control of the auction with the 4 NT bid. Presumably partner is checking on the number of As or keycards to avoid bidding slam with too few. So you should pass 5 ♠ as that's where partner has decided to play it. For all you know partner's hand might have solid long ♠ and 5 ♠ I cold.

 

Your partner misbid the hand as a jump to 4 NT is totally unwarranted. 3 NT is where you belong. 5 NT may make if the opponent's don't lead ♠. 5 ♠ is destined to go down. You'll reach 3 NT if your partner a more normal bid. I like the following auction --

 

1 ♠ - 2 ♥

2 ♠ - 3 ♣

3 NT

 

Your partner remarks were totally unwarranted. But it's not unusual for some players to think they know more than they do and make a fuss. I think you'll find that the better players will rarely make comments on their partner's bids or plays except to possibly clear up a misunderstanding.

 

Hang in there, don't let this jerk poison your view of playing here. There are many pleasant people to play with here.

 

I think you did right coming here and asking about the auction. That shows a willingness to learn, which is perhaps the most important factor in getting better. Please don't be afraid to ask about anything you don't understand. As for you not being at this player's level, you don't want to be at this player's level because it isn't good.

[neilkaz]

Put this PD on your enemy list so you avoid sitting across from him in the future. His jump to 4NT with a ♥ void(your suit) and 15 HCP is off the charts insane!

 

That combined with him not being pleasant means you should avoid him.

[case_no_6]

Technically, 5S is a sign-off. Looking at the actual holding of your partner, it is clear that both the 4NT and 5S bids were poorly conceived.

[zgrywus]

Steve2005 wrote: The person who bids 4N Blackwood is in charge (this is called being the Captain) if they said 5♠ you should respect that and pass.

 

Bilw55 wrote: Technically, your partner's bidding does mean that he wants to play in 5♠, and so you should pass.

 

 

Really? Always thought tt 4Nt agreed hearts in that sequence. If so 5 spades can not be passed.

Agreed w Bilw55: Booted the wrong player.

[HeavyDluxe]

I will only add, nicebbo, that if your profile was the same then as it is now, it might've made people a little prickly.

[1eyedjack]

Always thought tt 4Nt agreed hearts in that sequence. If so 5 spades can not be passed.

Agree with the first sentence. The second is a bit iffy. I have played in partnerships where you could blackwood in one suit and sign out in another. It has actually come up to good effect, usually where you have the trump suit completely wrapped up but blackwood gives you a convenient route to asking about K/Q in a side suit. Not saying that it is standard. And def not something I would foist on a N/B player

[zgrywus]

Agree with the first sentence. The second is a bit iffy. I have played in partnerships where you could blackwood in one suit and sign out in another. It has actually come up to good effect, usually where you have the trump suit completely wrapped up but blackwood gives you a convenient route to asking about K/Q in a side suit. Not saying that it is standard. And def not something I would foist on a N/B player

Thx for reply. That was probably before 6 aces rkcb has been invented. :)

[helene_t]

Either your partner thought spades could be trumps or it's a relay for you to bid 5NT.

I don't think so. The relay to 5nt applies when we are past the 5-level of the (minor) trump suit and need to sign off in 5nt.

 

Hearts is trump so 5♠ should be some kind of control asking bid. In reality, of course it is a blame transfer. Whatever nicebbo does, his partner will say that the bad result is somehow nicebbo's fault. W might as well have bid 7nt which would also lead to a bad result, but then it would have been more difficult to blame it on nicebbo.

[1eyedjack]

I don't think so. The relay to 5nt applies when we are past the 5-level of the (minor) trump suit and need to sign off in 5nt.

 

Hearts is trump so 5♠ should be some kind of control asking bid. In reality, of course it is a blame transfer. Whatever nicebbo does, his partner will say that the bad result is somehow nicebbo's fault. W might as well have bid 7nt which would also lead to a bad result, but then it would have been more difficult to blame it on nicebbo.

The irony is that they got a perfectly good result.

[oryctolagi]

I always thought, that if you use Blackwood before a suit has been agreed, it carries an implication that you are agreeing partner's suit, in this case Hearts.

 

With a void.... :blink:

[StevenG]

I thought they were playing simple Blackwood. There is no trump suit in simple Blackwood.

[fourdad]

Do you think that 4nt, without a self sufficient spade suit, or a known fit and with your partner showing 10 points is the best possible description of your hand?

If not what bid does?

If so, why?

[helene_t]

The irony is that they got a perfectly good result.

Oh yes, I didn't notice. To be fair, the spade lead is not easy to find.

[ayebee]

Steve2005 wrote: The person who bids 4N Blackwood is in charge (this is called being the Captain) if they said 5♠ you should respect that and pass.

 

Bilw55 wrote: Technically, your partner's bidding does mean that he wants to play in 5♠, and so you should pass.

 

 

Really? Always thought tt 4Nt agreed hearts in that sequence. If so 5 spades can not be passed.

Agreed w Bilw55: Booted the wrong player.

 

Many players (in the UK at least) play that in that sequence 4NT agrees hearts as the suit for the purposes of the RKCB enquiry only i.e the king of hearts is the 5th keycard and that a return to the Blackwood instigators original suit is to play.

 

Playing ordinary Blackwood rather than RKCB it doesn't matter what trumps is - rather than agreeing responder's suit it simply means that opener know what trumps should be.

 

 

However with a pick up partner I would prefer to find an unambiguous bid - yet another reason why the precipitous 4NT bid is ill chosen.

[phil_20686]

Oh yes, I didn't notice. To be fair, the spade lead is not easy to find.

 

A spade lead doesnt help? Win, club to K heart K gives you 2s 5h 4c for 11 tricks. Which is all you can ever make.

[rmnka447]

A spade lead doesnt help? Win, club to K heart K gives you 2s 5h 4c for 11 tricks. Which is all you can ever make.

As it turns out, North has a second ♥ stop with the ♥ 8 holding ♥ A8xxx. So only 4 ♥ tricks are available and you need a ♦ trick to make. The timing is such that a ♠ trick can be set up to cash before both ♥ A and ♦ A can be driven out.

 

Practically, 5 NT will make most of the time as divining a ♠ lead from ♠ Q106 with RHO the ♠ bidder is very difficult. I know I probably wouldn't find it on this bidding.