Jacoby 2 NT? or What?

[cribfreak]

Holding

S – KJ86

H – KQT9654

D – T

C – 6

After partner opens 1 S, what is the best response and where do you go from there? If Jacoby 2NT, then what happens when partner bids his singleton heart?

[kenrexford]

4H, natural.

[mr1303]

If partner has a stiff heart, I need him to have 3 key cards to make slam. I will try 3S after 3H and thereafter make no further moves. If partner has the 3 aces outside of hearts and the queen of spade (or length) then he will take control.

[mikeh]

I don't think that a hand with no aces and wild shape should think that the best way to bid this is to take control. While it is possible to turn a J2N sequence into a co-operative one, it starts high and with opener having a false image if responder's hand, thus often depriving partner of the ability to make effective decisions.

 

It will be no surprise to anyone familiar with my thinking on these hand types to learn that my choice, playing 2/1 gf is 2H. I know that a lot of posters think, for reasons that have never seemed well articulated to me, that one denies 4 spades by bidding 2/1. If you think that, then I guess you may as well take control with 2N.

 

If I did bid 2N then I have to bid 3S over 3H, if that was our method (many pairs play more complex Jacoby methods but on this hand I think the simple one is at least as effective as any other). We have far too good a hand to sign off. Axxxxx x Axx Axx is an almost cold slam and he shouldn't bid over 4S.

 

Opposite that hand, btw, if we responded 2H, we'd splinter in clubs next, bid 4H over 4D and partner would drive to slam.

[rmnka447]

I'm bidding a GFing 2 ♥.

 

It may be unlikely, but partner is still allowed to have a ♥ fit occasionally. Even if not, you've still started to describe your hand. It also gives partner a chance to say something about his/her hand.

[gszes]

While we will most likely end up in 4s there is little/no reason why we cannot emphasize our really long heart suit on the way to showing spade support. Splinter sequences work best when there is no secondary long suit present and here we have a REALLY long secondary suit.

 

2h

 

Follow up with 3h (hopefully) and then convert to 4s (whatever p does next). This will give opener a pretty darn accurate idea of your hand type and they will hopefully drive to slam with aces and quietly pass with lesser honors. If your system will not allow a "natural" 4s bid over 4h by opener you may have to use J2n and settle for 4s. It is too scary to contemplate a direct 4h natural to play when we have a known 9+ card spade fit vs a known 7+ card heart fit.

[ggwhiz]

I don't think that a hand with no aces and wild shape should think that the best way to bid this is to take control. While it is possible to turn a J2N sequence into a co-operative one,

 

I strongly disagree that bidding jacoby 2nt is taking control of the auction. Yes you can but bidding 4♠ next or 3♠ followed by 4 as you choose (as per mr1303) puts the opener right back in the drivers seat so you haven't yet.

 

I don't mind 2♥ too much but it hardly describes (or will end up describing) a light shapely aceless freak anymore than 2nt does and at least partner knows what trump is on the get go. After 2♥ - p - 3m (by them or pard) you show this hand by bidding???? You are usually end played into showing what may well be interpreted as a weak notrump with spade support.

[kenrexford]

2NT is insane. 2H is sane. 4H is funny.

[neilkaz]

I wish that I was playing Baby Blackwood here or Baby RKC so a direct 3NT call asks for key cards. Many pairs don't have a good use for a 3NT call directly in response to 1M opening anyhow. Now I can safely get out at 4♠

if PD has just one ace.

 

Of course, almost any other use of 3NT may be a better use. But here all I really want to know is aces and the Queen.

[johnu]

I know that a lot of posters think, for reasons that have never seemed well articulated to me, that one denies 4 spades by bidding 2/1.

 

Basic Internet 101 and I quote "I heard a guy say ..... "

[bigbenvic]

Isn't Jacoby 2nt meant for hands without a singleton? or is that an archaic way to play it?

[mikeh]

Basic Internet 101 and I quote "I heard a guy say ..... "

I'm too lazy to find the thread on this topic, but I think it was earlier this year. It is a recurring theme, usually with 4 card support and a decent 5 card side suit, 5431 or 5422, opening values. There were a number of posters who argued that opener would never play responder for 4 card support if responder made a 2/1 gf response. I assumed, perhaps wrongly, that most readers would have seen and would recall that thread.

[aguahombre]

I'm too lazy to find the thread on this topic, but I think it was earlier this year. It is a recurring theme, usually with 4 card support and a decent 5 card side suit, 5431 or 5422, opening values. There were a number of posters who argued that opener would never play responder for 4 card support if responder made a 2/1 gf response. I assumed, perhaps wrongly, that most readers would have seen and would recall that thread.

Yeh, there are players who believe that 4th card in the opener's suit should take preference over showing a side trick source; I don't remember the specific threads either because it wasn't something we want to switch to.

[johnu]

I'm too lazy to find the thread on this topic, but I think it was earlier this year. It is a recurring theme, usually with 4 card support and a decent 5 card side suit, 5431 or 5422, opening values. There were a number of posters who argued that opener would never play responder for 4 card support if responder made a 2/1 gf response. I assumed, perhaps wrongly, that most readers would have seen and would recall that thread.

 

I forgot a :) on my post, but people pick up or make up ideas about bidding all the time and changing them is like making a swing change in golf. Assuming you even want to make a change, usually very difficult and under pressure you may revert to your old methods until they become 2nd nature.

[lycier]

For me,I plan to bid 2♥ first ,then 4♠ to show my hand with delay major raise .

[kenrexford]

2H then 4S is usually a picture bid. While this resembles a picture bid, it's not quite right. The likely next call from partner will be a 3 min call, which forces 3S as the likely next call. If partner then bids 3NT, a 4 bid in the minor partner did not bid works ok.

 

But, you can never describe this hand. The quest should not be for the call that most resembles what you have but rather what set of calls will trigger action from partner that will most likely succeed opposite this actual hand, because, again, you will not ever come close to description.

[Zelandakh]

2H then 4S is usually a picture bid.

Are you assuming 2/1? This was not mentioned in the OP so I think we should tend to think some form of SA is being played.

[kenrexford]

Are you assuming 2/1? This was not mentioned in the OP so I think we should tend to think some form of SA is being played.

Yes. I guess I thought 2/1 was now the default assumption, especially if Jacoby 2NT is used.