Has U.S. Democracy Been Trumped?

[PassedOut]

I keep seeing that I am getting old. Monday evening we went to a graduating event for 8th grade! A big auditorium and it went on forever. In 1952 they had all of us in 8th grade out in front of the building and took a group photo. I still have a copy. That was it. Much much better..I have to live in the new world, but I don't have to praise it.

Anyway, yep, I agree that is pretty much the explanation..

I'm happy to see that I'm not the only one who groans at this kind of foolishness. Last Friday I went to my granddaughter's kindergarten graduation!

 

All of the graduates marched down the aisle to the stage wearing graduation caps, and out again after the ceremony. During the ceremony, each graduate came to the mic, announced his or her name, and described the most valuable thing learned during the year. There was a video that showed, at the end, all of the graduates standing in front of the school tossing their graduation caps in the air.

 

I wonder what will happen when she finishes first grade.

:rolleyes:

[Winstonm]

Isn't this just wonderful.

 

Mari Stull, a former food lobbyist and wine blogger recently appointed as a senior adviser at the State Department, has been making a list of government officials and employees of international organizations who are loyal to President Trump, Foreign Policy's Colum Lynch and Robbie Gramer report.

[hrothgar]

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/14/nyregion/trump-foundation-lawsuit-attorney-general.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news

[Winstonm]

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/14/nyregion/trump-foundation-lawsuit-attorney-general.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news

Addendum

[Winstonm]

This may well turn out to be the initial crack in the wall the brings Humpty Dennison crashing down.

 

NYT

Conservative religious leaders who have long preached about the sanctity of the family are now issuing sharp rebukes of the Trump administration for immigration policies that tear families apart or leave them in danger.

 

This is a perilous position for a dotard whose white privilege base cares nothing about brown children, so he has to appease them, while the evangelical base is feeling the sting of conscience watching this border children travesty unfold, and now Dennison is getting shaky with that group.

 

When Dennison starts touting the Republican brothel owner candidate from Nevada, the evangelical base may need a full-fledged Elmer Gantry-type revival to wash away their sins.

[johnu]

This may well turn out to be the initial crack in the wall the brings Humpty Dennison crashing down.

 

NYT

 

 

This is a perilous position for a dotard whose white privilege base cares nothing about brown children, so he has to appease them, while the evangelical base is feeling the sting of conscience watching this border children travesty unfold, and now Dennison is getting shaky with that group.

 

Hmmm, those evangelicals speaking out against separating children from parents must be fake Christians. Comrade Dennison is on a mission from God in separately jailing children. Sarah Sanders said that "I can say that it is very biblical to enforce the law, that is actually repeated a number of times throughout the Bible". And Jeff Sessions has said ""I would cite you to the Apostle Paul and his clear and wise command in Romans 13, to obey the laws of the government because God has ordained them for the purpose of order, .. Orderly and lawful processes are good in themselves and protect the weak and lawful." How can you disagree with God and the Bible if you are a real Christian? B-)

[PassedOut]

Hmmm, those evangelicals speaking out against separating children from parents must be fake Christians. Comrade Dennison is on a mission from God in separately jailing children. Sarah Sanders said that "I can say that it is very biblical to enforce the law, that is actually repeated a number of times throughout the Bible". And Jeff Sessions has said ""I would cite you to the Apostle Paul and his clear and wise command in Romans 13, to obey the laws of the government because God has ordained them for the purpose of order, .. Orderly and lawful processes are good in themselves and protect the weak and lawful." How can you disagree with God and the Bible if you are a real Christian? B-)

Slavery, Hitler, Sessions, and Romans 13

 

Romans 13 is invoked by defenders of the South or defenders of slavery to ward off abolitionists who believed that slavery is wrong,” John Fea, a professor of American history at Messiah College in Pennsylvania, told The Post on Thursday. “I mean, this is the same argument that Southern slaveholders and the advocates of a Southern way of life made.”

 

According to Anxious Branch’s Gehrz, the passage largely disappeared from American pulpits after the Civil War. It did, however, make appearances overseas in the darkest moments of the early 20th century. Romans 13 was reportedly favored by Adolf Hitler and pushed by the Nazis to legitimize their authoritarian rule in 1930s Germany.

 

The same Bible verse was also cited by South Africa’s white Afrikaner minority as the country was locked down under a series of racist laws after World War II.

 

“Afrikaner theologians, pastors, and politicians alike all emphasized Paul’s admonition in Romans 13 that everyone must submit to the governing authorities as the central Scripture concerning Christian relations to the state,” scholars Joel A. Nichols and James W. McCarty III wrote in a 2014 article in the St. John’s Law Review. “Read through an ‘Afrikaner Calvinist’ lens that emphasized a concept known as ‘sphere sovereignty,’ theologians claimed that the apartheid state was ordained by God and must be obeyed by all living in South Africa.”

And here we are again. Sad.

:(

[RedSpawn]

The firing of Comey makes sense when his agency stonewalls the discovery of evidence regarding the clandestine meeting on the Phoenix tarmac between Clinton and Lynch AND THE VERY strange announcement by Comey that he is reopening the email investigation a week before the Presidential election.

 

The media presented Comey's firing as if it was just a disloyalty matter and that was simply misleading and irresponsible.

 

Both actions taken as a whole demonstrate Comey's inability to lead the FBI in a prudent, unbiased, and disciplined manner. Comey consistently failed to follow protocol in dealing with the email scandal and demonstrated that his judgment was compromised.

 

Trump used the wrong reasoning for Comey's firing. But know this, Comey knew he had fu#$ed up big time and started taking extra contemporaneous notes of conversations with Trump on FBI letterhead to help a wrongful termination lawsuit should he get fired because the knucklehead knew his days were numbered and rightfully so.

 

Comey is a lawyer so he was covering his behind because he unintentionally left FBI $hit stains all over the federal election. Plus Comey was going to take Trump down with him if Trump fired him. That's a game recognize game move in the D.C. swamp.

 

Comey is no saint or victim in this matter.

 

Source: https://www.nationalreview.com/2017/05/james-comey-firing-justified-trump-should-explain-timing/

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/james-comey-described-as-insubordinate-in-doj-inspector-generals-report/

James Comey described as "insubordinate" in DOJ inspector general's report

 

Agreed. The Inspector General has concluded that Comey was insubordinate as I was intimating in the above-mentioned e-mail in April 2018.

[y66]

From The Big Scary Question Hanging Over the Trump-Kim Meeting by Amanda Taub and Max Fisher at NYT:

 

There’s a big question hanging over President Trump’s summit meeting with Kim Jong-un that nobody quite knows how to ask, but that could turn out to be really important — maybe more important than the actual agreement or meeting itself.

 

What happens when Mr. Trump’s claims about the meeting collide with reality?

 

“Yeah, he’s de-nuking, I mean he’s de-nuking the whole place,” Mr. Trump said this week, referring to Mr. Kim. “I think he’s going to start now.”

 

Except that Mr. Kim is doing no such thing. Virtually every independent analyst we’ve spoken with reads Mr. Kim’s statements from the meeting as merely reaffirming long-held North Korean positions, rather than making any new promises, even in the most rhetorical or abstract sense.

 

In the days since the meeting, Mr. Trump’s sense of what happened seems to have only grown. He later declared, “There is no longer a Nuclear Threat from North Korea.”

 

Mr. Trump’s habit of making exaggerated or false claims is certainly nothing new. But his self-affirming narrative of the North Korea meeting — which he seems to earnestly believe — poses an unusually severe risk.

 

North Korea is not disarming. It has not ceased to pose a nuclear threat to the United States. And it has not abandoned the foreign policy positions that put it so at odds with the United States that they sometimes come to the brink of war.

 

At some point, that black-and-white reality will reimpose itself, contradicting Mr. Trump’s claims of a great détente and disarmament.

 

When that happens, there is a risk that Mr. Trump and his supporters — unwilling to concede that he’d overpromised based on false claims — will convince themselves that, in fact, North Korea was the dishonest party. Pyongyang, by merely continuing its long-held policies, could compel Mr. Trump to paint the North Koreans as transgressing, even if only to save face.

 

Or perhaps Mr. Trump will feel humiliated and personally betrayed by Mr. Kim, with whom he seems to feel he has forged a real personal bond. Recall that only a week earlier, at the Group of 7 meeting in Canada, Mr. Trump had significantly altered United States foreign policy — refusing to sign the official G-7 official statement — because he had taken (and possibly misunderstood) a mildly critical statement by Justin Trudeau, the Canadian prime minister, as a personal betrayal.

 

When Mr. Trump lashes out at Canada, the result is tariffs and political disputes that cost the United States trade and jobs, as well as some bonhomie with a longtime ally. But what happens if Mr. Trump lashes out at North Korea, a nuclear-armed adversary whose leaders live in existential fear of an American invasion?

 

Remember that North Korea’s nuclear strategy — with warheads pointed at major American cities — is designed explicitly to prevent or turn back the American invasion that Pyongyang officials see as a real possibility.

 

These sorts of high-stakes misunderstandings are already taking place.

 

In the days after the meeting, North Korean officials exploited the fact that Mr. Trump and Mr. Kim did not release official readouts of their conversation — a normal diplomatic practice to ensure that neither side can set the narrative or the facts to their advantage.

 

Official North Korean statements said that Mr. Trump had submitted to Mr. Kim’s “demand” to end American military exercises on the Korean Peninsula. And they said the two leaders had agreed that denuclearization would be simultaneous, implying that Mr. Trump had agreed to disarm as well.

 

Mr. Trump said that he had not bothered with official readouts of the meeting because, he told reporters, “I don't need to verify as I have one of the great memories of all time."

At some point, that black-and-white reality will reimpose itself? Reimpose reality on Trump? Biggest LOL ever.

[Winstonm]

Bill Clinton and Loretta Lynch put James Comey into an uncomfortable situation which he handled poorly. To make any type of claim, though, that his firing by the one person who benefited from his actions is somehow justifiable is ridiculous and nonsensical.

 

Clinton should not have met Lynch.

Lynch should have recused herself.

Comey should have confided in Lynch how her decision not to recuse affected him.

Comey should have notified the AG of his intentions to act.

Even if approved, the damage should have been limited by a straightforward statement of facts.

Comey, no doubt, felt pressure to "appear not to be soft" on Democrats after all the anti-Clinton rhetoric and actions from Republicans.

The second notification to Congress placed the reputation of the FBI above the need for fair and unbiased elections in the U.S.

 

I doubt anyone would defend any of these choices by the various actors.

 

None of this absolves Dennison the dotard. The dotard first praised Comey for his actions against Clinton, then once elected he asked Comey for two things: Can you see your way to letting Flynn go?, and, Will you be loyal to me?

 

When Comey answered, No, to both questions, he was ushered out the door. No amount of spin changes reality.

[RedSpawn]

Hrothgar, I have black friends that refer to other blacks as niggers. Does that make them racist?

This is a false analogy (and perhaps a bandwagon fallacy as well).

 

If very misguided African-Americans refer to themselves as an epithet because either they don't know better or are attempting to reappropriate a racial term that has been used to denigrate and devalue who they are, that's their choice.

 

However, their own misguided use of the n-word does not give either permission or creative license for other Americans to use it. The historical context of the n-word in the United States from 1776 to Present clearly shows that it was used to marginalize, ostracize, oppress and denigrate African-Americans. It was culturally acceptable to view African Americans as less than, as property (and not people), or at best as Americans worthy of 2nd class citizenship.

 

When you devalue people with epithets, you don't prove their ignorance, you reveal your own.

 

If you use the "n-word" to describe African-Americans, you are using the power of words to put this ethnic group in their "subjugated" place which by definition is racist.

[hrothgar]

This is a false analogy (and perhaps a bandwagon fallacy as well).

 

If very misguided African-Americans refer to themselves as an epithet because either they don't know better or are attempting to reappropriate a racial term that has been used to denigrate and devalue who they are, that's their choice.

 

However, their own misguided use of the n-word does not give either permission or creative license for other Americans to use it. The historical context of the n-word in the United States from 1776 to Present clearly shows that it was used to marginalize, ostracize, oppress and denigrate African-Americans. It was culturally acceptable to view African Americans as less than, as property (and not people), or at best as Americans worthy of 2nd class citizenship.

 

When you devalue people with epithets, you don't prove their ignorance, you reveal your own.

 

If you use the "n-word" to describe African-Americans, you are using the power of words to put this ethnic group in their "subjugated" place which by definition is racist.

 

[Winstonm]

From The Big Scary Question Hanging Over the Trump-Kim Meeting by Amanda Taub and Max Fisher at NYT:

 

 

At some point, that black-and-white reality will reimpose itself? Reimpose reality on Trump? Biggest LOL ever.

 

Well, Dennison could fire Kim Jung-un and then tell the Russian Ambassador that "I fired Un. He was a real nut job. It relieved a great deal of pressure on me."

[barmar]

If you use the "n-word" to describe African-Americans, you are using the power of words to put this ethnic group in their "subjugated" place which by definition is racist.

And anyone who doesn't know this these days has been living under a rock for the past 50 years. It's well known that it's OK for black people to use the N-word among themselves, but taboo for anyone else.

[kenberg]

Slavery, Hitler, Sessions, and Romans 13

 

 

And here we are again. Sad.

:(

I mentioned somewhere that I recently went to the 80th birthday party of a childhood friend but I did not include that he became a Methodist minister. I would stake my life on asserting he would be appalled at such usage of the Bible. He and I, and others, went through some thinking and re-thinking of religion during our adolescence. We came to conclusions that were in some ways different, in some ways, more essential ways, not so different. If he were to quote the Bible here he might choose:

 

Matthew 25:40-45 King James Version (KJV)

⁴⁰ And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

 

⁴¹ Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

 

⁴² For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:

 

⁴³ I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.

 

⁴⁴ Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

 

⁴⁵ Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

 

 

 

See https://www.biblegat...version=NIV;KJV

 

If Sessions wants to look to the Bible, he had better be prepared for what he will find there.

[Winstonm]

Dennison's first campaign manager is party to the criminal referral for illegal campaign contributions made by the New York AG, while another of his campaign manager's has just been sent to jail for witness tampering prior to trial, and meanwhile Dennison wants "his people" to act like North Koreans and show him more respect, which is fine as long as only "his people" do so and Americans are not expected to follow suit.

[Winstonm]

Hours after President Trump appeared to tank the emerging House immigration compromise by saying he wouldn’t sign it, the White House sought to clean up the mess, releasing a statement that the president actually did in fact support the plan. Just for good measure, they said he also supports the more conservative bill that is expected to get a vote in the House next week as well.

 

“Yes, we fully support both the Goodlatte bill and the leadership bill. The President misunderstood the question this morning on Fox News,” an anonymous White House official told the Hill. “He was commenting on the discharge petition/dreamers bill — not the new package. He would 100 percent sign either Goodlatte or the other bill.”

 

In fact, we support all bills: marry me, bill; won't you come home, Bill Bailey; Billy, don't be a hero; Ode to Billy Joe.

[Winstonm]

“While protecting our borders is important, we can and must do better as a government, and as a society, to find other ways to ensure that safety,” Cardinal Daniel Nicholas DiNardo, president of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops, said in a statement. ”Separating babies from their mothers is not the answer and is immoral.”

 

“Disgraceful,” the Rev. Franklin Graham, son of the late and influential Rev. Billy Graham and a supporter of President Donald Trump, said in a Tuesday interview. “It’s terrible to see families ripped apart, and I don’t support that one bit.”

 

Even Sessions’ own church, the United Methodist Church, is rejecting what he is doing.

 

“Tearing children away from parents who have made a dangerous journey to provide a safe and sufficient life for them is unnecessarily cruel and detrimental to the well-being of parents and children,” reads a statement signed by Bishop Kenneth Carter, president of the Council of Bishops of the United Methodist Church.

 

It will be interesting to see if Dennison has the guts to make his usual double down threats when it is not his own base who is criticizing him. My bet is he will waffle and blame the Democrats, Obama, and Hillary.

[Winstonm]

Manafort was sent to jail? What can I

[PassedOut]

It will be interesting to see if Dennison has the guts to make his usual double down threats when it is not his own base who is criticizing him. My bet is he will waffle and blame the Democrats, Obama, and Hillary.

Trump Has a Few Things He’d Like to Get Off His Chest

 

Likewise, he faulted Democrats in Congress for the federal authorities’ separating children from parents trying to cross the border from Mexico under a “zero tolerance” policy announced by Attorney General Jeff Sessions.

 

“I hate the children being taken away,” he said. “The Democrats have to change their law. That’s their law.”

 

While both houses of Congress are run by Republicans, Mr. Trump said they could not act because it would require Democratic votes in the Senate to overcome a filibuster. Democrats, however, said they would hardly filibuster legislation barring the separation of families at the border because they have already introduced such a bill with more than 30 Democratic sponsors.

[kenberg]

Manafort was sent to jail? What can I

 

It's dangerous to link to songs from my adolescence, I just can't keep myself from commenting. I went to the Wikipedia to see the entry on "Ain't That a Shame". Apparently Pat Boone made a cover version (blissfully forgotten) and wanted to change the title to "Isn't That a Shame". We were very proper back then. PBS, as part of its begathon, showed Peter, Paul and Mary singing "The First Time Ever I saw Your Face" . They changed "The first time ever I lay with you" to "The first time ever I held you near". Becky is a PP&M fan, me not so much. They came to the University of Minnesota in the early 60's, after which the Minnesota Daily had a cartoon showing two guys in suits and a woman in an elegant gown singing "When those cotton balls get rotten you can't pick very much cotton...".

 

Times change.

 

As Alexandra Petri says concerning Trump:

 

"To those who say he has lowered the level of our discourse, I say, **** off, ********. "

 

Anyway, Paul Manafort is where he belongs. Trump says he, Manafort, is being treated unfairly. Maybe the next time the National Anthem is played Trump will refuse to stand as a protest against this unfair treatment.

[barmar]

In fact, we support all bills: marry me, bill; won't you come home, Bill Bailey; Billy, don't be a hero; Ode to Billy Joe.

I'm pretty sure I know a Bill he wouldn't support. His last name begins with C.

[barmar]

If Sessions wants to look to the Bible, he had better be prepared for what he will find there.

The basic problem with quoting the Bible is that you can find something in there to support practically any position.

 

Stephen Colbert pointed out that the verse Sessions quoted is just a few lines before the more well known Golden Rule.

 

The other problem with people who claim that we should follow the Bible's pronouncements is that everyone cherry-picks. For example, some other late night host mentioned that Sessions probably doesn't obey the part of the Bible that says not to eat shellfish (or all the other clauses that are the basis of Jewish rules of Kashrut).

 

And, of course, it's possible to find contradictions in the Bible.

[Winstonm]

I'm pretty sure I know a Bill he wouldn't support. His last name begins with C.

 

Can you whistle a little of that?

[Winstonm]

The basic problem with quoting the Bible is that you can find something in there to support practically any position.

 

Stephen Colbert pointed out that the verse Sessions quoted is just a few lines before the more well known Golden Rule.

 

The other problem with people who claim that we should follow the Bible's pronouncements is that everyone cherry-picks. For example, some other late night host mentioned that Sessions probably doesn't obey the part of the Bible that says not to eat shellfish (or all the other clauses that are the basis of Jewish rules of Kashrut).

 

And, of course, it's possible to find contradictions in the Bible.

 

There are no contradictions.

 

"When I use a word it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less." - Humpty Dumpty, and every evangelical preacher who ever lived.