Has U.S. Democracy Been Trumped?

[jjbrr]

Can you enumerate the promises that Trump has not kept that he has the power and authority to do so?

If it weren't for those obstructionist republicans, maybe something could get done.

[WellSpyder]

Can you enumerate the promises that Trump has not kept that he has the power and authority to do so?

Why did he promise to do things that he wouldn't have power or authority to do?

[ldrews]

Why did he promise to do things that he wouldn't have power or authority to do?

 

Probably because he mistakenly thought he would have the support of the Republican Congress in implementing his agenda.

[ldrews]

If it weren't for those obstructionist republicans, maybe something could get done.

 

Holy Cow! Once again a post with no recognizable substance. What promises has Trump not kept or attempted to keep? Quit evading.

[ldrews]

It is not uncommon for people like you to fight for the exact thing that hurts you the most. I was curious if the ownership group of your ISP would censor the material you want to read or promote it.

 

In my experience it people who share your mindset that think about censoring people you disagree with.

[jjbrr]

Holy Cow! Once again a post with no recognizable substance. What promises has Trump not kept or attempted to keep? Quit evading.

 

The Promise: "President Obama wants to change the name of Mt. McKinley to Denali after more than 100 years. Great insult to Ohio. I will change back!"

Update October 30th, 2017: Trump backed off promise to change Denali’s name, says Alaska senator

 

The Promise: "It can be done. ... It will take place and it will go relatively quickly. ... If you have the right people, like, in the agencies and the various people that do the balancing ... you can cut the numbers by two pennies and three pennies and balance a budget quickly and have a stronger and better country."

Update October 20th, 2017: Trump cheers budget plan that wouldn't balance budget

 

The Promise: "We’ve got to get rid of the $19 trillion in debt. ... Well, I would say over a period of eight years. And I’ll tell you why.”

Update October 20th, 2017: Trump celebrates Senate budget bill, but it busts his promise to eliminate federal debt

 

The Promise: “And if people don't like it, we've got to have a country folks. Got to have a country. Countries in which immigration will be suspended would include places like Syria and Libya. And we are going to stop the tens of thousands of people coming in from Syria.”

Update October 17th, 2017: Federal judge blocks Donald Trump’s third travel ban

 

The Promise: "As president, I will call for an international conference focused on this goal. We will work side-by-side with our friends in the Middle East, including our greatest ally, Israel."

Update October 13th, 2017: No international conference on ISIS in sight

 

The Promise: "Increase fees on all border crossing cards – of which we issue about 1 million to Mexican nationals each year (a major source of visa overstays)."

Update October 11th, 2017: President Donald Trump stalls on visa fee increases for Mexican nationals

 

The Promise: "We will move the American embassy to the eternal capital of the Jewish people, Jerusalem."

Update October 9th, 2017: Trump signals step back from Israeli embassy plan

 

The Promise: "The J-1 visa jobs program for foreign youth will be terminated and replaced with a resume bank for inner city youth provided to all corporate subscribers to the J-1 visa program."

Update October 9th, 2017: President Donald Trump stalls on promise to eliminate J-1 visa program

 

The Promise: "Everybody is getting a tax cut, especially the middle class."

Update October 5th, 2017: Tax plan appears to favor wealthiest, no guarantee of cuts for all

 

Should I keep going? That's only page 1.

[jjbrr]

In my experience it people who share your mindset that think about censoring people you disagree with.

 

OK? lol?

[RedSpawn]

I guess 66 million voters are stupid, poor, and weak. But the economy has improved, businesses are moving back to the US, stock market at record highs, unemployment at 17 year lows, consumer confidence at multi-year highs, illegal border crossings down by 40+%, regulations are being reduced, NATO has been motivated to step up their contributions, and the problem of North Korea is being addressed. Unfortunately the Senate cannot get its act together to pass needed legislation or confirm needed appointments, but that is beyond Trump's, and God's, ability to control.

 

I think I will vote for Trump again. I haven't gotten tired of winning.

As I was hoping you'd eventually try to discover for yourself before you dug your head in the sand, Trump gets credit for making lots of promises. Tax cut for the wealthiest 1% and corporations, that indicates increased earnings. Infrastructure? More earnings. Wall? More earnings.

 

The problems will arise when you catch up with the rest of us and realize that these promises are all a big joke.

 

 

 

Could you answer the ISP question now? Does net neutrality mean anything to you?

So, if you Think Trump's Presidency has contributed to the DJIA from 19,700+ to 23,000 on his own leadership.. .then let's apply this logic to Past Presidents.

 

When Bush was inaugurated into office in January 2001 -- The Dow Jones was 10,500+. When he finished his 1st term in January 2005. The Down Jones was 10,580+. That's a huge difference. Sarcasm included.

 

When George Bush left the office in 2008, he handed Obama a stinking pile of $hit, courtesy of the housing bubble crash, with a DJIA at 8281+. That's a sizeable drop from 10,580 in January 2005. OUR CAPITAL MARKETS WERE IN DISREPAIR IN 2008.

 

At then end of Obama's 1st term, the DJIA went up from 8281+ in 2008 to 13700+ in January 2013. When Obama left and before Trump stepped into office the DJIA went to 19700+.

 

So which is it? Is Trump a business genius because the DJIA went from 19700+ (in January 2017) to 23000+ (now)? Is Obama an oaf because he received an 8,281 DJIA from Bush in 2008 and muscled it up to 19,700 before Trump arrived in 2017?

 

If we apply the same logic, what should we say how President George W. Bush handled the economy solely based on the the DJIA as a barometer of economic health and vitality?

 

If we are going to use talking points to measure leadership, make sure we are using the same rulers when we measure each President. Obama seems like a savvy businessman or turnaround specialist given his starting point and ending point DJIA as well.

 

Obviously, Obama's Presidency couldn't have destroyed corporate earnings quality if DJIA can go from 8,800+ in 2008 to 13,700+ in 2013 to 19,700 in 2017.

 

Now, I am aware how Federal Reserve Bank monetary policy has impacted these numbers, but still DJIA IS DJIA IS DJIA.

 

When over $3 trillion dollar of loans (assets) are added to the Federal Reserve Balance Sheet that loaned money has to go somewhere. And guess what, those loans get laundered through the international capital markets and come back to our illustrious Wall Street capital markets.

 

I probably could adjust these numbers for inflation as well but I will let others do that if they think it will radically change the argument.

[jjbrr]

and ldrews, since you're a special snowflake and this will get you riled up

 

“I’m under a routine audit and it'll be released, and as soon as the audit is finished it will be released."

 

Monday, January 16th, 2017 at 11:17 a.m.

[jjbrr]

So, if you Think Trump's Presidency has contributed to the DJIA from 19700+ to 23000 on his own leadership.. .then let's apply this logic to Past Presidents.

It would be stupid to think that.

[Al_U_Card]

So, if you Think Trump's Presidency has contributed to the DJIA from 19,700+ to 23,000 on his own leadership.. .then let's apply this logic to Past Presidents.

 

When Bush was inaugurated into office in January 2001 -- The Dow Jones was 10,500+. When he finished his 1st term in January 2005. The Down Jones was 10,580+. That's a huge difference. Sarcasm included.

 

When George Bush left the office in 2008, he handed Obama a stinking pile of $hit, courtesy of the housing bubble crash, with a DJIA at 8281+. That's a sizeable drop from 10,580 in January 2005. OUR CAPITAL MARKETS WERE IN DISREPAIR!

 

At then end of Obama's 1st term, the DJIA went up from 8281+ in 2008 to 13700+ in January 2013. When O'bama left and before Trump stepped into office the DJIA went to 19700+.

 

So which is it? Is Trump a business genius because the DJIA went from 19700+ (in January 2017) to 23000+ (now)? Is Obama an oaf because he received an 8,281 DJIA from Bush in 2008 and muscled it up to 19,700 before Trump arrived in 2017?

 

If we apply the same logic, what should we say how President George W. Bush handled the economy solely based on the the DJIA as a barometer of economic health and vitality?

 

If we are going to use talking points to measure leadership, make sure we are using the same rulers when we measure each President. Obama seems like a savvy businessman or turnaround specialist given his starting point and ending point DJIA as well.

 

Obviously, Obama's Presidency couldn't have destroyed corporate earnings quality if DJIA can go from 8,800+ in 2008 to 13,700+ in 2013 to 19,700 in 2017.

 

Now, I am aware how Federal Reserve Bank monetary policy has impacted these numbers, but still DJIA IS DJIA IS DJIA.

 

When over $3 trillion dollar of loans (assets) are added to the Federal Reserve Balance Sheet that loaned money has to go somewhere. And guess what, those loans get laundered through the international capital markets and come back to our illustrious Wall Street capital markets.

 

I probably could adjust these numbers for inflation as well but I will let others do that if they think it will radically change the argument.

Doesn't it have a lot to do with QE 1,2 and 3? Banks with +ve balance sheets and low, low interest rates get investors into the market. Latest asset bubble, no?

[RedSpawn]

Doesn't it have a lot to do with QE 1,2 and 3? Banks with +ve balance sheets and low, low interest rates get investors into the market. Latest asset bubble, no?

Yes, it does. That's why it's misguided to use "record stock highs" as a measure of "winning" or "leadership" by President Bush, Obama, or Trump.

 

Currently, we have a casino/strip club risk-taking mentality in our capital markets. Federal Reserve Bank Chairman and Chairwoman Bernanke and Yellen have "made it rain" $$$ in our capital markets by injecting insane amounts of dollar bills (liquidity) in our capital markets to stave off the calamitous financial consequences of exotic risk taking and poor corporate governance by several investment houses, retail banks, insurance companies, and other corporations around 2008.

 

This has created a huge asset bubble in our capital markets and some of us are attributing the appreciation of capital stock prices to Presidential leadership, higher productivity, better corporate earnings quality, and stronger business investment in the broader economy. However, this appreciation is a false economy built on significant corporate stock buyback programs, automation and offshoring of jobs to cheaper labor markets, and continued lemon socialism by our federal government and central bankers.

 

Our federal government has engaged in "lemon socialism" to the benefit of Wall Street and Corporate America but has yet to send that public messaging to the masses who are trying to function and subsist on Main Street.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemon_socialism

[ldrews]

The Promise: "President Obama wants to change the name of Mt. McKinley to Denali after more than 100 years. Great insult to Ohio. I will change back!"

Update October 30th, 2017: Trump backed off promise to change Denali’s name, says Alaska senator

 

The Promise: "It can be done. ... It will take place and it will go relatively quickly. ... If you have the right people, like, in the agencies and the various people that do the balancing ... you can cut the numbers by two pennies and three pennies and balance a budget quickly and have a stronger and better country."

Update October 20th, 2017: Trump cheers budget plan that wouldn't balance budget

 

The Promise: "We’ve got to get rid of the $19 trillion in debt. ... Well, I would say over a period of eight years. And I’ll tell you why.”

Update October 20th, 2017: Trump celebrates Senate budget bill, but it busts his promise to eliminate federal debt

 

The Promise: “And if people don't like it, we've got to have a country folks. Got to have a country. Countries in which immigration will be suspended would include places like Syria and Libya. And we are going to stop the tens of thousands of people coming in from Syria.”

Update October 17th, 2017: Federal judge blocks Donald Trump’s third travel ban

 

The Promise: "As president, I will call for an international conference focused on this goal. We will work side-by-side with our friends in the Middle East, including our greatest ally, Israel."

Update October 13th, 2017: No international conference on ISIS in sight

 

The Promise: "Increase fees on all border crossing cards – of which we issue about 1 million to Mexican nationals each year (a major source of visa overstays)."

Update October 11th, 2017: President Donald Trump stalls on visa fee increases for Mexican nationals

 

The Promise: "We will move the American embassy to the eternal capital of the Jewish people, Jerusalem."

Update October 9th, 2017: Trump signals step back from Israeli embassy plan

 

The Promise: "The J-1 visa jobs program for foreign youth will be terminated and replaced with a resume bank for inner city youth provided to all corporate subscribers to the J-1 visa program."

Update October 9th, 2017: President Donald Trump stalls on promise to eliminate J-1 visa program

 

The Promise: "Everybody is getting a tax cut, especially the middle class."

Update October 5th, 2017: Tax plan appears to favor wealthiest, no guarantee of cuts for all

 

Should I keep going? That's only page 1.

 

Well thank you. Finally something to work with and talk about.

 

The Promise: "President Obama wants to change the name of Mt. McKinley to Denali after more than 100 years. Great insult to Ohio. I will change back!"

Update October 30th, 2017: Trump backed off promise to change Denali’s name, says Alaska senator

 

OK, this is one that I had never heard of. But be serious! With significant problems with the economy, ISIS, North Korea, trade agreements, immigration problems, you focus on this?

 

The Promise: "It can be done. ... It will take place and it will go relatively quickly. ... If you have the right people, like, in the agencies and the various people that do the balancing ... you can cut the numbers by two pennies and three pennies and balance a budget quickly and have a stronger and better country."

Update October 20th, 2017: Trump cheers budget plan that wouldn't balance budget

 

The Promise: "We’ve got to get rid of the $19 trillion in debt. ... Well, I would say over a period of eight years. And I’ll tell you why.”

Update October 20th, 2017: Trump celebrates Senate budget bill, but it busts his promise to eliminate federal debt

 

So you think the federal debt is more important that the operating budget? Unless Trump focussed on the debt, they you would think the operating budget is more important. You remind me of the mother who gave her son two shirts for his birthday, a red one and a blue one. He tried on the red shirt, and his mother immediately asked: "Don't you like the blue shirt?" Let's wait and see at the end of his term whether he has make attempts to reduce the federal debt. Or must he do so today?

 

The Promise: “And if people don't like it, we've got to have a country folks. Got to have a country. Countries in which immigration will be suspended would include places like Syria and Libya. And we are going to stop the tens of thousands of people coming in from Syria.”

Update October 17th, 2017: Federal judge blocks Donald Trump’s third travel ban

 

Well, Trump has made several attempts to do so. People who disagree with him keep finding judges who suspend his executive orders on constitutional grounds. Eventually this will be sorted out by the Supreme Court. But you can't deny he has tried to keep this promise.

 

The Promise: "As president, I will call for an international conference focused on this goal. We will work side-by-side with our friends in the Middle East, including our greatest ally, Israel."

Update October 13th, 2017: No international conference on ISIS in sight

 

You are right on this one, Trump has not called for an international conference. Instead ISIS has been decimated, their territorial claims pretty much extinguished. This has become a moot point.

 

The Promise: "Increase fees on all border crossing cards – of which we issue about 1 million to Mexican nationals each year (a major source of visa overstays)."

Update October 11th, 2017: President Donald Trump stalls on visa fee increases for Mexican nationals

 

"stalls". Sounds like it might yet happen. In any case illegal border crossings have been substantially reduced. The border wall project is in prototype stage with proposed solutions available for viewing.

 

The Promise: "We will move the American embassy to the eternal capital of the Jewish people, Jerusalem."

Update October 9th, 2017: Trump signals step back from Israeli embassy plan

 

 

As you point out this has not yet been completed. A "step back" is not a cancellation. And political realities may indicate that this was not a good promise to make.

 

The Promise: "The J-1 visa jobs program for foreign youth will be terminated and replaced with a resume bank for inner city youth provided to all corporate subscribers to the J-1 visa program."

Update October 9th, 2017: President Donald Trump stalls on promise to eliminate J-1 visa program

 

[

 

Again "stalls", not cancellation. The inner cities are one of our major society problems. I am not familiar with the J-1 visa program, could you explain it to me?

 

The Promise: "Everybody is getting a tax cut, especially the middle class."

Update October 5th, 2017: Tax plan appears to favor wealthiest, no guarantee of cuts for all

 

"Everybody" cannot get a tax cut. 50% of the "taxpayers" do not pay income tax, so they cannot possible get a "tax cut". And the latest version of the plan that I have heard about keeps the top bracket the same. Trump has said that he personally will have to pay more taxes. Apparently the working/middle class do get a significant tax reduction. Could you explain to me how the latest proposed plan benefits the wealthy?

[ldrews]

and ldrews, since you're a special snowflake and this will get you riled up

 

“I’m under a routine audit and it'll be released, and as soon as the audit is finished it will be released."

 

Monday, January 16th, 2017 at 11:17 a.m.

 

Doesn't get me riled up at all. Is the audit finished? If so, he has not kept this promise.

 

Now I ask, what does Trump's tax returns have to do with the well-being of this country? Does the release of his tax returns help solve any social problems, any economic problems, any international conflict problems?

[RedSpawn]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/dow-drops-on-report-that-senate-gop-will-delay-corporate-tax-cut/ar-BBEMbt7

 

So Wall Street is whining if it doesn't get it precious Trump-approved "corporate tax cut" in 2018 (to the tune of $1.5 trillion dollars over the next 10 years). Why am I not surprised?

 

I am not exactly sure why we believe the business community is going to reinvest this tax cut by hiring more people on Main Street when we know this tax cut will stay in house to boost the corporations' bottom lines or be shared almost exclusively with shareholders to increase the value of their stock through stock buyback programs.

 

Our highway, bridges, and airports are crumbling but we are beholden to the special interests of Corporate America. Corporate tax cuts take priority over long overdue and needed infrastructure investment and rehabilitation. Go figure!

[ldrews]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/dow-drops-on-report-that-senate-gop-will-delay-corporate-tax-cut/ar-BBEMbt7

 

So Wall Street is whining if it doesn't get it precious Trump-approved "corporate tax cut" in 2018 (to the tune of $1.5 trillion dollars over the next 10 years). Why am I not surprised?

 

I am not exactly sure why we believe the business community is going to reinvest this tax cut by hiring more people on Main Street when we know this tax cut will stay in house to boost the corporations' bottom lines or be shared almost exclusively with shareholders to increase the value of their stock through stock buyback programs.

 

Our highway, bridges, and airports are crumbling but we are beholden to the special interests of Corporate America. Corporate tax cuts take priority over long overdue and needed infrastructure investment and rehabilitation. Go figure!

 

Highways, bridges, and airports do not contribute to political campaigns!

[jjbrr]

Judge Moore is a pedophile who beats his wife, so take his word for what it's worth. I don't know if that's true. I was informed it's factual.

 

obviously

[hrothgar]

and the problem of North Korea is being addressed.

 

Let's start with this one: How is the the problem of North Korea being "addressed"

 

1. What constitutes an acceptable solution to the problem of North Korea?

 

2. Rex Tillerson has stated that the United States will start negotiations with North Korea if North Korea stops missile tests and stops nuclear tests.

The United States has also ruled out regime change if the North Koreans come to the table

 

Does this address the solution? If so, how is it any different than the situation before Trump took office?

 

3. Alternatively, do you believe that a military conflict will be necessary?

 

If so, what would constitute a successful outcome?

How many South Koreans would need to die before you judge that your successful outcome had turned into a mistake?

[ldrews]

Let's start with this one: How is the the problem of North Korea being "addressed"

 

1. What constitutes an acceptable solution to the problem of North Korea?

 

2. Rex Tillerson has stated that the United States will start negotiations with North Korea if North Korea stops missile tests and stops nuclear tests.

The United States has also ruled out regime change if the North Koreans come to the table

 

Does this address the solution? If so, how is it any different than the situation before Trump took office?

 

3. Alternatively, do you believe that a military conflict will be necessary?

 

If so, what would constitute a successful outcome?

How many South Koreans would need to die before you judge that your successful outcome had turned into a mistake?

 

I honestly have no idea of how to resolve the problem of North Korea without a lot of people dying. Do you have a solution?

[hrothgar]

I honestly have no idea of how to resolve the problem of North Korea without a lot of people dying. Do you have a solution?

 

Sounds like you are advocating that the US should attacks even if it means a decent chance of losing Seoul....

 

If not, please clarify what it means to "address" North Korea

[kenberg]

Maybe I will climb into this. N Korea is one of the many problems that I have no good ideas about. Maybe the Great War could have been prevented by wise diplomacy. Maybe the Second World War could have been prevented. Neither of them were prevented. I assume that just about everyone is in favor of preventing nuclear war in Korea or anywhere. I think it is far from clear that we can.

 

Negotiations? Sure. Let's do that. Negotiations work best if all parties involved have at least some common views and interests. Do we? I guess we will find out. Throughout history lots of people have killed lots of other people in war. Learn from history so we do not repeat history? A fine slogan. Also a lot easier to say than to do.

 

I saw Thornton Wilder's The Skin of our Teeth in the 1960s and it always seemed about right. But now I see a lot seems to have been cribbed cribbed from Finnegan's Wake. Maybe I should read it. At any rate, I first took an interest in what was going on beyond my neighborhood when the North Koreans crossed into South Korea on June 25, 1950. I have never much liked movie sequels. Star Wars was great. The first one, I mean.

[ldrews]

Sounds like you are advocating that the US should attacks even if it means a decent chance of losing Seoul....

 

If not, please clarify what it means to "address" North Korea

 

Please, I am not advocating anything. But North Korea is becoming a significant threat to the US and others. What do you advocate? Leave them alone to finish developing their nuclear capability, possible becoming victims of nuclear extortion in the future or worse? Preemptively attacking North Korea to destroy its nuclear capabilities at the risk of millions dying? China seems reluctant, for good reasons from their point of view, to exercise their influence/control. Exactly what do you recommend?

[jjbrr]

ldrews, hrothgar has said many times, and many of us agree, that there is no clear answer. that is why he's asking you what you mean by "addressing" NK.

[ldrews]

ldrews, hrothgar has said many times, and many of us agree, that there is no clear answer. that is why he's asking you what you mean by "addressing" NK.

 

"Addressing NK" to me means trying to find a solution. Actively trying to find a solution. Not kicking the can down the road like the previous administrations have done, letting the problem get worse.

 

Do you have an alternative?

[barmar]

I honestly have no idea of how to resolve the problem of North Korea without a lot of people dying. Do you have a solution?

Of course we don't -- it's a really hard problem, possibly insoluble.

 

But you're the one who claimed that Trump is addressing it. Unless you're talking about his hawkish rhetoric (e.g. alluding to the atom bombs we dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki during a speech in Japan), I haven't seen any indication of this.