Has U.S. Democracy Been Trumped?

[ldrews]

Wow so coal companies can legally dump poison waste into waterways....and pay nothing...zero.....nice deal if true.

 

So just give individuals/companies private property rights in the waterways. They will sue the hell out of the coal companies.

 

Public waterways are just the modern version of the "commons" problem. Everybody uses/abuses them without having financial responsibility. So give someone some vested interests and they will make the efforts to maintain/improve them. Of course they charge for their use, but you don't get things for free regardless of what the politicians promise.

[mike777]

So are you saying that all of the environmental regulations have benefits that outweigh their costs to family farms, small businesses, and others.

 

I have a friend who lost the use of half of his farm he had for years because occasional light flooding of the pastures was declared "wetlands". He couldn't afford the legal costs of suing the Federal Government. So he was out of business. Do you think that is appropriate?

 

 

I don't know your case.

 

However I bought a house 17 years ago. The entrance to the subdivision is called a wetlands.. It means you cannot build anything on it...it is woods, a large area of woods.

I have to be honest....that was a plus in making the decision to buy. The entire area is heavy woods, inside a midsize city....that is a plus. take away the woods and take away me.

 

 

strange as it may sound, wetlands may make the acreage in question more rich, much more rich.....

 

 

still you make a valid point

[Vampyr]

So just give individuals/companies private property rights in the waterways. They will sue the hell out of the coal companies.

 

 

Right, and charge people for legitimate use of the water.

 

Of course they charge for their use, but you don't get things for free regardless of what the politicians promise.

 

Do you have evidence for this? In any case, even if they do pay, it would not be anywhere near the cost of cleaning the waterways, even if it could be don.

[mike777]

vamp...

 

 

calling for legitimate use of the water is going down a rat hole.

 

 

Hopefully we can all agree regarding London water... London land,,,,it belongs to the natives.. the original people of the Thames/london.....not you...not your loved ones.

 

At the very least see Rome...not you

 

 

:)

 

-----

 

 

now if you prefer a serious/balanced discussion ...fair enough.

 

 

This will shock liberal posters but even hard core republicans/conservatives are for clean water and clean air.....ask "passed out" who says he votes republican often, very often

[jogs]

Could you explain this? What does it mean to put someone into Medicaid and then bill them? Isn't that a contradiction, since Medicaid is health insurance for people who can't afford to pay for health care?

Medicaid is a network for healthcare. Currently(as I understand it) it is free for all participants. Allow the uninsured to join the network. But these members who do not qualify for free medicaid will be required to pay for services. For the vast majority of uninsured who are healthy this would be a less expensive alternative than buying health insurance.

Healthy San Francisco works in a similar manner. Each member pays according to what that member can afford.

 

This would allow the republicans time to solve the problem of how to serve the unhealthy poor. Of course I'm convinced there is no easy solution. Someone would need to volunteer to foot the bill.

[jogs]

But of course, according to ldrews, Trump cares about nothing more than the best interests of the middle class and his voters. I am sure it will magically turn out to be good for them.

 

This is like when you were small and playing chess with your father. After a few moves, your father offers to change sides. He turns the board around and plays your pieces, while he play his.

 

Today Trump's goal is his legacy. Trump hates Obama. Trump wants to be remembered in history as a better president for the American people than Obama.

[barmar]

A fudiciary is a big deal....It means you can come after me....after everything including my house.

 

Think about it barmar if you make a mistake on bbo....I get to come after all your assets including your house if you are a fiduciary.

 

At the very least if you sue me...I have to hire a lawyer...and go through the hassle....expensive. while my family worries if they go live on the street.

IANAL, but as far as I can tell, making a mistake is not generally a breach of fiduciary duty. A fiduciary has to make a good faith attempt to act for the benefit of the beneficiary as opposed to themselves.

[kenberg]

This is like when you were small and playing chess with your father. After a few moves, your father offers to change sides. He turns the board around and plays your pieces, while he play his.

 

Today Trump's goal is his legacy. Trump hates Obama. Trump wants to be remembered in history as a better president for the American people than Obama.

 

No none expects me to speak highly of Trump but even I do not claim his that tis is his goal. It is as if I said that my goal in my marriage is to have Becky think of me as better than her previous husband. I mean I hope that she does, but this is not something that I sit around planning for.

I think Trump has many flaws, many of them serious. But I still hope that he actually wants to do something worthwhile for the country.

In my version of 1984 the word "legacy" would be banned from the English language.

[jogs]

http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/09/us/book-best-seller-trnd/

 

No. 1 Amazon bestseller: 266 blank pages on why to vote Democrat

[kenberg]

http://www.cnn.com/2...st-seller-trnd/

 

No. 1 Amazon bestseller: 266 blank pages on why to vote Democrat

 

Great. A book that requires no skill to write and no intelligence to read. Just the thing for the Trump voters on your shopping list. It summarizes Trump thinking on all matters. Kellyanne recommends that you buy this book.

 

An interesting (?) legal question: There have been many books with titles such as How to .....and with all of the pages blank. So can the author of the first one of these cutsie things sue the others for plagiarism? Only the titles are different, the content, blank pages, is word for word the same from one to another.

[y66]

Fun interview here with Charlie Crist of Florida. Smart guy.

[Winstonm]

This is like when you were small and playing chess with your father. After a few moves, your father offers to change sides. He turns the board around and plays your pieces, while he play his.

 

Today Trump's goal is his legacy. Trump hates Obama. Trump wants to be remembered in history as a better president for the American people than Obama.

 

"You can't always get what you want." - Mick Jagger

[Winstonm]

At least one study points to Comey as the reason for President Trump.

[cherdano]

As many as possible, consistent with immediate public safety. I appreciate that agencies have been directed to conduct a benefit/cost analysis on existing regulations. I approve of the Executive Order requiring the removal of two regulations for each new regulation introduced.

 

You wrote "Regulations are being reduced." This suggests to me that the Trump administrations has already removed some regulations that you don't like. Which are these?

[cherdano]

What's not to like?

ldrews thinks it's a great idea to base crucial decisions in the fight against ISIS on the advice of a National Security Advisor who is around the same time getting paid 600,000 $ from the Turkish government. Make Turkish Interests Great Again!

[ldrews]

ldrews thinks it's a great idea to base crucial decisions in the fight against ISIS on the advice of a National Security Advisor who is around the same time getting paid 600,000 $ from the Turkish government. Make Turkish Interests Great Again!

 

You do like to put words in my mouth, don't you.

 

Flynn was obviously not a good choice. He was let go and replaced. Ever watch Trump's reality show, "Apprentice"? His signature statement was: "You're fired!"

 

It sounds like you lack real world experience in putting together teams.

[jogs]

Obama is the reason Trump ran for president.

 

[cherdano]

You do like to put words in my mouth, don't you.

 

Flynn was obviously not a good choice. He was let go and replaced. Ever watch Trump's reality show, "Apprentice"? His signature statement was: "You're fired!"

 

It sounds like you lack real world experience in putting together teams.

I put "What's not to like?" into your mouth??

 

Meanwhile, which regulations did the Trump administration do away with that you didn't like?

[cherdano]

Also, ldrews thinks it's a great idea to tell great things about your healthcare plans during the campaign, and after the election, and at the state of the union, then endorse a completely different plan two weeks later.

 

I guess to Trump fanboys, it's only a lie or betrayal when a non-Trump politician says or does it. Their unwavering admiration for The Leader is so cute and charming.

[rmnka447]

At least one study points to Comey as the reason for President Trump.

 

No, the real reason Donald Trump is President is a significant part of the American electorate felt ignored and screwed over by the government and its progressive policies. They simply decided that as onerous, unfit, or dangerous (according to you) that Donald Trump would be as President, that he was a better alternative than continuing in the direction the country has been taken in the last 8 years. They manifested that decision by freely voting for Trump, or, some cases by not voting for Trump or progressives.

 

Until you can come to grips with that, you're just deceiving yourselves.

 

One of the most liberal CNN analysts said it best on Election Night when he said "Democrats think a whole bunch of boutique causes add up to a majority, well they didn't."

[ldrews]

Also, ldrews thinks it's a great idea to tell great things about your healthcare plans during the campaign, and after the election, and at the state of the union, then endorse a completely different plan two weeks later.

 

I guess to Trump fanboys, it's only a lie or betrayal when a non-Trump politician says or does it. Their unwavering admiration for The Leader is so cute and charming.

 

I don't remember saying any such thing. Are you practicing to enter fiction writing as a career?

 

As I keep repeating, but some folks seem unable to hear, I watch what he does, not what he says. I do note that he seems to be attempting to keep his campaign promises. Areas that he has authority over he has issued Executive Orders to implement his campaign promises. For those items requiring congressional action/approval he has initiated actions or supported ongoing actions of congress. Of course he has no control over what congress does or does not do.

 

Of course there are some campaign promises he has not kept, most notably to put Clinton in jail. Are you complaining that he has not fulfilled that campaign promise?

[Al_U_Card]

 

Of course there are some campaign promises he has not kept, most notably to put Clinton in jail. Are you complaining that he has not fulfilled that campaign promise?

Obama was straightforward in his promises to go full "boutique" for his faithful. The video I posted on another thread shows why 97% (sorry, couldn't resist) of counties voted Trump. Restricting the EPA to real pollution control and ceasing its enforcement of congressional purview items (instead of using legislation, as slow as that may have become) is a promise worth keeping. The vitriol pouring out is a case of influence-loser's angst. I am not a fan of the corporatizing of our society, be it indirect (Dems) or direct (Reps). Trump may be even worse for this but, as you say, time will tell and keeping an eye on him is a wise course in any event.

[kenberg]

I don't remember saying any such thing. Are you practicing to enter fiction writing as a career?

 

As I keep repeating, but some folks seem unable to hear, I watch what he does, not what he says. I do note that he seems to be attempting to keep his campaign promises. Areas that he has authority over he has issued Executive Orders to implement his campaign promises. For those items requiring congressional action/approval he has initiated actions or supported ongoing actions of congress. Of course he has no control over what congress does or does not do.

 

Of course there are some campaign promises he has not kept, most notably to put Clinton in jail. Are you complaining that he has not fulfilled that campaign promise?

 

"As I keep repeating, but some folks seem unable to hear, I watch what he does, not what he says."

I have noted this. It is one place where we see things differently. I think that what a president says is very important. Or any leader. I believe it was Nixon who said "A great nation cannot bluff". I also think that routinely insulting people is a very bad approach. There was a very capable guy who was being considered for chair of our department. A good guy, a talented guy. But if he had a choice between responding "No" or "Go F yourself" he would invariably choose the latter. [OK, I am exaggerating. But not by much.] He was not chosen. Trump comes across as an impulsive irresponsible jerk. At some point he will need the country as a whole to back him in a moment of crisis. That's going to be tough. After 9-11 GWB suggested that we all go shopping. I did not care much for that, even if the intent was to keep the markets up, but that's a quibble. In general, I and the rest of the country were prepared to give him our support. Not carte blanche, but support. I would have trouble doing this with Trump/

 

Actions speak louder than words. True enough. But words are also a form of action.The Mexican president was a terrific guy, Mexico was wonderful, etc until there was a disagreement. Then he was a toad. I do not believe either that excessive public praise or excessive public contempt is the right route. Set general objectives, don't tweet, and get to work resolving differences. That's what I would like to see him do.

[y66]

Obama was straightforward in his promises to go full "boutique" for his faithful. The video I posted on another thread shows why 97% (sorry, couldn't resist) of counties voted Trump. Restricting the EPA to real pollution control and ceasing its enforcement of congressional purview items (instead of using legislation, as slow as that may have become) is a promise worth keeping. The vitriol pouring out is a case of influence-loser's angst. I am not a fan of the corporatizing of our society, be it indirect (Dems) or direct (Reps). Trump may be even worse for this but, as you say, time will tell and keeping an eye on him is a wise course in any event.

I misclicked the +1 button. What do you mean by "real pollution control"? And what do you mean by full "boutique" for the faithful? If anything, Obama was to the right of center on issues that mattered most to Dems until November 2014 when he finally woke up to the fact that this was a hopeless strategy. What you describe as vitriol pouring out looks like a lot of other people finally waking up to me.

[ldrews]

"As I keep repeating, but some folks seem unable to hear, I watch what he does, not what he says."

I have noted this. It is one place where we see things differently. I think that what a president says is very important. Or any leader. I believe it was Nixon who said "A great nation cannot bluff". I also think that routinely insulting people is a very bad approach. There was a very capable guy who was being considered for chair of our department. A good guy, a talented guy. But if he had a choice between responding "No" or "Go F yourself" he would invariably choose the latter. [OK, I am exaggerating. But not by much.] He was not chosen. Trump comes across as an impulsive irresponsible jerk. At some point he will need the country as a whole to back him in a moment of crisis. That's going to be tough. After 9-11 GWB suggested that we all go shopping. I did not care much for that, even if the intent was to keep the markets up, but that's a quibble. In general, I and the rest of the country were prepared to give him our support. Not carte blanche, but support. I would have trouble doing this with Trump/

 

Actions speak louder than words. True enough. But words are also a form of action.The Mexican president was a terrific guy, Mexico was wonderful, etc until there was a disagreement. Then he was a toad. I do not believe either that excessive public praise or excessive public contempt is the right route. Set general objectives, don't tweet, and get to work resolving differences. That's what I would like to see him do.

 

Believe me, I wish we had a better person for President, but Trump was the only one promising the changes that I think are sorely needed. Since he seems to be following through on those promises, I continue to support him while cringing all of the time.