Game try double extended

[mgoetze]

As we all know, when the opponents leave you no other way to invite, double should serve as the invitation:

[hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=1hp2h3dd(Game try)]133|100[/hv]

 

How about here:

[hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=1dp1h2cd(Support)3cd(Game try?)]133|100[/hv]

 

We have not explicitly established a fit, yet there is no other way to invite with 5 hearts, as 3♦ would tend to deny them. So should this also be a game try double?

 

Tell me your opinion in the poll and then post some other auctions where double as game try could make sense even though it's not strictly speaking the only bid available.

[WesleyC]

I think that if you haven't unambiguously found an 8c major fit, then it is essential to use double as showing a hand with extra values, but uncertain about strain.

 

On hand 2 above, what else would you bid with invitational or better values and approximately 4432 shape. You might also double on some hands with 5H, but opener certainly shouldn't bid on that assumption.

 

If you wanted to call that a 'game try double' you could, but it's not the same as double on the first hand.

[gnasher]

When you're dealt a takeout double but don't have a takeout double available, you have an insoluble problem. When you're dealt a game-try but don't have a game-try available, your problem has an easy solution - bid game.

[nullve]

Classically, a direct bid shows a weaker hand than a takeout double followed by the same bid, so you might consider doubling 3C and rebidding 3H to show an invitational hand with 5+ H. The problem is that partner would bid 3S on a minimum hand with 4 S, and then you'd already be too high. In theory, though, I suppose you could play

 

...(3C)-X; ?:

P = LoTT decision

3D = 3H5+D, NF

3H = 5+ H, inv

3H = 4S3H, min

3S = 4S3H, extras

etc.,

 

as I can't think of any (other) natural use of the 3H bid that would make sense.

[SteveMoe]

This should show 4♥ cards, 2♣ cards and invitational values - "It's our hand partner but I don't have a good bid here." Some call this DSIP but I prefer Optional Penalty. Opener can pass to convert, remove to 3♥ to show doubt about defending or bid on toward game.

 

I would expect Responder's 3♥ here to show 5+ trump competing with values sufficient for the 3-level(CONSTR+). Responder can bid 4♥ with INV+ holdings and 5+ trump.

 

I would expect the gap bid (♦)to be a game try with 5♥ cards.

 

What you are talking about apparently inverts these two meanings. The inversion reduces the scoring value of the double as we will more often pull to game. Penalties will be more likely when we have values and only a 4-3 ♥ fit.

[mgoetze]

I would expect the gap bid (♦)to be a game try with 5♥ cards.

I take it you play 1♦ as showing only 3+ diamonds, and you never play matchpoints?