Over jump rebid

[jallerton]

[hv=pc=n&n=saj93hj5dj87ckq65&d=s&v=e&b=3&a=1cp1sp3cp]133|200[/hv]

 

IMPs.Favourable.

[steve2005]

slam a distinct possibility

[MrAce]

[hv=pc=n&n=saj93hj5dj87ckq65&d=s&v=e&b=3&a=1cp1sp3cp]133|200[/hv]

 

IMPs.Favourable.

 

Our agreement for 5♣ is that it is picture bid and shows support + no control in unbid suits. Does not mean I do not want to play slam. 4♣ will be slamish and requesting cue. 3 red cuebids over 3♣ are for 3 NT purposes to me.

 

However this hand is weird. Seeing KQxx in my hand says pd has a lot of values on the side. I do not want to bid 5♣. He probably have 16-17 oe a bad 18 for his jump without KQ ♣, or maybe extra 7th club. 3 NT or 4 NT might be our last makeable game. It will be a lie if I tell we discussed how to stop in 4 NT if I start 4♣ or 3 red. So I am curious how others will approach.

[MrAce]

double

[the_clown]

I would try 3♦ hoping to get partner to bid 3N with a ♥ stop.

[Cyberyeti]

I would try 3♦ hoping to get partner to bid 3N with a ♥ stop.

 

Because you so want to be in 3N-1 with 6♣ solid opposite say KQ, AJx, x, AJ10xxxx

[rhm]

Our agreement for 5♣ is that it is picture bid and shows support + no control in unbid suits. Does not mean I do not want to play slam. 4♣ will be slamish and requesting cue. 3 red cuebids over 3♣ are for 3 NT purposes to me.

Picture bids are usually played in game forcing situations.

Here responder can have a wide range of strength and the 3♣ bid is not even forcing.

Of course you can agree to whatever you like, but I wonder what responder does with a distributional hand where he would like to play game in clubs, but considers slam remote.

 

Rainer Herrmann

[PhilKing]

I will try the approach of bidding my hand - 4♣ then 4♠ if partner cues 4♦ (or 4♥ if 4♦ would be RKCB).

 

Partner can continue with 4NT (DI or "rolling") to confirm a heart control but not enough values to drive slam, in which case I will sign off (though the decision is close).

[MrAce]

Picture bids are usually played in game forcing situations.

Here responder can have a wide range of strength and the 3♣ bid is not even forcing.

Of course you can agree to whatever you like, but I wonder what responder does with a distributional hand where he would like to play game in clubs, but considers slam remote.

 

Rainer Herrmann

 

- Correct, usually but not always.

 

- 4 NT (means bidding 5♣ with no slam interest) 4♦ would be RKCB.

 

 

But as I said in previous reply we just talked this auction briefly and still did not discuss continuation of it after 3 red or 4m and how to manage to stop in 4 NT etc. A good suggestion can always convince me to play something better.

[Zelandakh]

A good suggestion can always convince me to play something better.

Just off the top of my head, how about:-

3red = values or advance cue (or stop ask/advance denial cue if preferred)

3♠ = nat, FG

4♣ = conditional RKCB

... - 4♦ = bad hand for slam

... - ... - 4♥ = asking for a heart control

... - ... - 4♠ = asking for a diamond control

... - ... - 4NT/5♣ = to play

... - 4♥+ = good hand for slam + key cards

4♦ = RKCB

4♥ = ♣ with ♥ void

4♠ = equivalent of your 5♣ picture bid

4NT = clubs with ♦ void

5♣ = to play

 

I am sure something better is possible though.

[Jinksy]

5♣ for me. I assume P is short in one of the red suits, but there's nothing to stop them having three cashing tricks, so I don't want to tell them which one. If P can't raise my spades, I'm not too excited about slam - it's obviously a possibility, but it feels more likely to me that we'll tip them off to the killer lead against 5♣ than that we'll be able to find one.

 

If I played something like PhilKing describes, 4♣ would be more tempting, but with most partners, if it continued 4♣ 4♦ / 4♠ we'd be stuck with 4N as RKCB. Since I can't bid it sensibly and it's nowhere near strong enough to punt, I'll settle for the most likely game.

[gszes]

I'm pretty sure no one else wants to do this but I strongly favor

 

3s

 

This bid is forcing but does not promise much power and it also shows a suit with insufficient quality to bid 4s (if weakish).

P cannot suddenly go from non forcing to slam control(especially missing the club KQ). They might try and cue bid and we can then bid 5c. The 3s bid leaves many contracts and levels and p thinking we have 5 spades is not enough to get them to overrule any club contract we bid.

 

There is a reason p opted for 3c rather than 2n or a reverse and we need to find out what that reason is. It may well be p is short in spades and could not get in a 2n rebid for fear we would repeat spades. In any meaningful sequence our conversion to clubs will let p know about our spade ace and slam interest.