Winstonm Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 [hv=d=s&v=n&s=sj1086hk106d8cakj106]133|100|Seems some of the most common bidding situations create the most problems. Here is another one. You open 1C and partner responds 1H. Do you raise, bid 1S, or something else? The following concepts apply but you may argue their usefulness: you bypass diamonds to bid a major with less than a game-forcing hand. Fourth suit forcing is a game force. Again, does the form of scoring alter your bid?[/hv] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimG Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 I think it is somewhat common to raise with minimums and bid out your shape with some extra values, since you're not going to pass after 1♣-1♥-1♠-1N, for instance. 5431 is almost in itself enough "extra-values", but this one might actually qualify as a minimum. Depends upon your opening bid style. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 1S Again XYZ comes into play here.Can live with 2h though. If p rebids 1nt, then easy nonforce 2h rebid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flytoox Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 Between 1S and 2H. I think I will vote for 1S. Although my hand is min, all cards are good. If pd rebids 1N, I will retreat to 2H. If we change SJ to HJ, I vote for 2H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 2H. automatic. Not good enough for 1S followed by 2H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeartA Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 1♠. 2♥ next round if available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 1♠. If I raise to 2♥ I deny 4 spades. If partner rebids 1NT, I will pull to 2♥ (denies extras from 1- to 2-level in my methods). This will promise a medium opener though:1♦ - 1♥2♣ - 2♦2♥ With the hand in Winston's example and extras (16-18). I will still rebid 1♠ and bid 2♦ over 1NT, natural or a 3-card heart raise, forcing for 1 round. Responder is supposed to bid 2♥/3♥ with 5, otherwise 2NT/3NT. Over 2♥/3♥ I follow up with 2NT/3NT if I have a 4-0-4-5 hand. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted March 16, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 Just a thought here. One of the problems with this hand is not so much what you bid but what your choice of bids does to partner. For example, if you chose to bid 1S, what does partner do now with: Kxx, AQxxx, xxx, xx? ;) WinstonM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walddk Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 Just a thought here. One of the problems with this hand is not so much what you bid but what your choice of bids does to partner. For example, if you chose to bid 1S, what does partner do now with: Kxx, AQxxx, xxx, xx? ;) WinstonM 1NT. I don't care much about a diamond stopper or not when I rebid 1NT. Raising to 2♥ with the actual hand gives responder a problem with KQxxAJxxxxxxx Then I would like to be in 4♠, but we won't get there. Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 1S and partner knows i'm unbalanced, at least 4/5 in the black suits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 Just a thought here. One of the problems with this hand is not so much what you bid but what your choice of bids does to partner. For example, if you chose to bid 1S, what does partner do now with: Kxx, AQxxx, xxx, xx? ;) WinstonM This is the hand for XYZ.Rebid 2c with invite handsRebid 2h with sign off hands. On this hand I would rebid 1NT so partner would infer balanced hand with less than 4 spades and 6 hearts. Jimmy cannot 1s be 4 clubs and 4 spades? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 Also 1S for me, bidding 1S first and then 2H does not show extras by my book. (btw, the book I'm referring to here is Mike Lawrence's 2/1 book, where he discusses this topic) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tysen2k Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 I also vote for 1♠. Raise with 3 cards only if you have no other attractive option. Here you have an easy rebid. Bid out your shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstonm Posted March 17, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 Rebid 2h with sign off hands. Mike777 I appreciate the input and have no problem with the idea of 2C being checkback, but isn't it awfully dangerous to rebid a 5-card heart suit in this auction? Couldn't partner hold KJxx, x, Axxx, KJxx or Kxxx, x, KQx, AJxxx? Then do I really want to sign off in 2H with Kxx, Kxxxx, xxxx, x? ;) WinstonM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 Rebid 2h with sign off hands. Mike777 I appreciate the input and have no problem with the idea of 2C being checkback, but isn't it awfully dangerous to rebid a 5-card heart suit in this auction? Couldn't partner hold KJxx, x, Axxx, KJxx or Kxxx, x, KQx, AJxxx? Then do I really want to sign off in 2H with Kxx, Kxxxx, xxxx, x? ;) WinstonM Agree 100% with you 1) I would rebid 1nt with first one 2)(Hand 2) Pass 1S since P could have flat 10HCP NV and flat 11HCP Vul. Perhaps 1nt here also since the opp are so silent. This bidding is making me nervous, I have 6 pts, opp are silent, P has failed to open an offshape 1nt or mexican 2d.(4225) or jump rebid. btw, no do not expect p to be 4144 (1D opening). but maybe 4135. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbleighton Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 1S, I can always bid 2H later. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 Really interested in how the 1S and later 2H bidders distinguish between: ♠J1086 ♥ K106 D 8 ♣ AKJ106 and ♠A1086 ♥ K106 D 8 ♣ AKJ106 Perhaps they might care to enlighten me as this is obviously a totally different philosophy in the Acol and Standard/2/1 schools. The first hand is an immediate raise, the second goes via 1S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jlall Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 1S then 2H, an overbid. You are right with the SJ being the SA i would bid the same way. This is about the range on the 2H bid (ok ok, maybe im a tad out of range with the first hand lol). With more than that i could jump to 3H. Nothing's perfect, and obviously 2H could work better or 1S could work better. I'm willing to risk getting too high to get spades into play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricK Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 I would bid 2♥. I appreciate that both methods have up-sides and down-sides, but I believe that this one (raising on minima and bidding out shape with extras) is the better one. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 1♠ but not really happy about it. Fortunately we play T-Walsh so this problem doesn't exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearmum Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 with a minimum opener I will bid 2♥---- let P know that I have support HE can force next roung IF he is strong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 Really interested in how the 1S and later 2H bidders distinguish between: J1086 K106 8 AKJ106 and A1086 K106 8 AKJ106 Perhaps they might care to enlighten me as this is obviously a totally different philosophy in the Acol and Standard/2/1 schools. The first hand is an immediate raise, the second goes via 1S. Hum.. funny you mention this. It is an interesting idea to distinguish two hands that indeed might differ by 3-4 points. It requires systematic major suit raises on 3 cards, though. Just one thing: are you worried of missing a 44 spade fit if pard has 44 majors and passes 2H? Or rather.. was that ever a problem in practical play? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 "Just one thing: are you worried of missing a 44 spade fit if pard has 44 majors and passes 2H? Or rather.. was that ever a problem in practical play? " Nah! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricK Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 Just one thing: are you worried of missing a 44 spade fit if pard has 44 majors and passes 2H? Or rather.. was that ever a problem in practical play? We very occasionally get to the second best part-score but make constructive bidding of games and slams much easier. Why should we worry?! Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 I see. I'll definitely give this a thought when I finally manage to indoctrinate pard into 3-card raises.. lol :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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