lackeman Posted March 13, 2015 Report Share Posted March 13, 2015 Hi!Played this hand IMP yesterday.(both red)I have in 4th seat xxx Jxxxxx - QJ9xThe bidding is p-1s-p....How do u think here? My "expert pd" says u have 4p so pass... But that can a monkey also understand...And we have all been monkeys at the beginning!... Playing SAYC (ie 2cl is strong)..3s is limit..Thx in advance! (relax and enjoy) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dicklont Posted March 13, 2015 Report Share Posted March 13, 2015 When you play forcing 1NT you can bid that and 2♠ in the next round, unless of course p shows hearts as a second suit.This makes is a little harder for the opponents to find their fit. Without the forcing NT I see no alternative to pass. You would not mind to play 1♠ if they let you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted March 13, 2015 Report Share Posted March 13, 2015 1NT is not forcing in SAYC but this hand is good enough for 2♠. By the way, monkeys can't count high card points but maybe your expert p was a walrus :) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinidad Posted March 13, 2015 Report Share Posted March 13, 2015 This is a normal raise to 2♠. Yes, you have only 4 HCP, but you also have a void. If you play a forcing 1NT response, you could bid that (who knows? partner might rebid 2♥ :) ). But if my partner would raise to 2♠ (with a forcing 1NT available) I wouldn't complain. If he would pass, I would call a doctor. Rik 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lackeman Posted March 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2015 When you play forcing 1NT you can bid that and 2♠ in the next round, unless of course p shows hearts as a second suit.This makes is a little harder for the opponents to find their fit. Without the forcing NT I see no alternative to pass. You would not mind to play 1♠ if they let you.No most often not only when i take 10 tricks or more :) Any way thx for the respons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMoe Posted March 14, 2015 Report Share Posted March 14, 2015 2♠Will accept partner's help suit try in ♣ or ♦, and raise partner's try in ♥ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascade Posted March 14, 2015 Report Share Posted March 14, 2015 2♠ I don't see a second choice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted March 14, 2015 Report Share Posted March 14, 2015 2♠, you have 4HCP and 3 distributional points (when you have a fit you count your voids), that makes it perfect for the 6-9 range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trump Echo Posted March 14, 2015 Report Share Posted March 14, 2015 If the "expert" wants to complain, he needs to put up a better argument. There is nothing wrong with responding with "4 points" provided you have distribution values. Pass - some systems expect to see 109x minimum with a direct raise and you have no alternative. You will support on the next round if you get the chance. Raise - you have plenty of strength for a direct raise thanks to distribution. 1 NT - you play forcing NT and plan to support Spades next. Arguments can be made for/against all these calls. The correct call depends on your system and your style. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fourdad Posted March 14, 2015 Report Share Posted March 14, 2015 2♠ I don't see a second choice BINGO!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
case_no_6 Posted March 14, 2015 Report Share Posted March 14, 2015 I really don't think the person you were partner is much of an expert. 3 card support and a void with a side QJ combination in a four card suit is worth a raise to 2S. And there really is nothing else that even remotely makes sense. You have enough for one peep in this auction and the absolute top priority is to show your support for partner's long major immediately while limiting your hand. A raise to 2S empowers partner to recognize the value of his or her hand; failure to bid makes partner guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilG007 Posted March 14, 2015 Report Share Posted March 14, 2015 Anyone who bids on this collection of junk should be referred to a good psychiatrist. There is an old adage... "If you invite trouble it usually accepts".The wise player wou;d pass without any hesitation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masse24 Posted March 14, 2015 Report Share Posted March 14, 2015 The unwise player would pass without any hesitation. FYP 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gszes Posted March 14, 2015 Report Share Posted March 14, 2015 Don't be too harsh on your "expert" partner. They probably made a reasonable 4s bid that went down due to an unfortunate duplication of values in diamonds. They were in ill humor probably for some other reason(s) and failed to appreciate that in bridge both good and bad things happen quite frequently. 2s Clear cut not so much because your hand is worth so much but because it is worth so little defensively while still retaining a good deal of potential. That 2s bid makes it much tougher for the opps to locate a (probable) dia fit. Light opening bidders should especially appreciate the preemptive value of 2s. If p were to bid 3h HSGT over 2s would anyone hesitate to bid 4h? That being the case a 2s bid seems prudent not just from a preemptive stand point but for retaining the ability to bid game under certain conditions that's pretty good for a mere simple raise--lots of potential reward for not much risk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lackeman Posted March 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2015 Don't be too harsh on your "expert" partner. They probably made a reasonable 4s bid that went down due to an unfortunate duplication of values in diamonds. They were in ill humor probably for some other reason(s) and failed to appreciate that in bridge both good and bad things happen quite frequently. 2s Clear cut not so much because your hand is worth so much but because it is worth so little defensively while still retaining a good deal of potential. That 2s bid makes it much tougher for the opps to locate a (probable) dia fit. Light opening bidders should especially appreciate the preemptive value of 2s. If p were to bid 3h HSGT over 2s would anyone hesitate to bid 4h? That being the case a 2s bid seems prudent not just from a preemptive stand point but for retaining the ability to bid game under certain conditions that's pretty good for a mere simple raise--lots of potential reward for not much risk.Y I feel now that 2s must be the correct bid, not sure.In the end we playedTo play 2 s Is no problem but the problem rises when partner have a hand that he will continue w invite or bidding game. a hand like AKxxxx-xxxx-Axx is a good 4 s contract hand (if not trumf lead but anyway a 50%+ to make).. But when partner have for ex a bad spade tex Kxxxx then he can have many points for ex Kxxxxx-KQ-Kx-KQJ (17 points but a bad game)..By the way partner had AKQJx-xx-Kxxx-KT..He bid 4s.. Mabye 3d had been better but not obvious that it is better than 4s...By the way I think that when trumf i setted it isnt so much of a danger if som points are missing/extras.. Often the 6 trumf for ex are matters more..It is i think NT hands or when no trumf are setted, then it can bee problem if not follow highpoints to some extennd value the hand.I can mean allso that if we dont get the contract for ex if LHO is declear it can be a bad lead as te result of the 2 s supporting bid. I often think of not support in many cases when partner is leading from his A/K/Q/KJ/KQ etc it often costs a trick.Anotherthing is that (in my experience)when bidding is like this and especially when we have suited hands/renons etc... They didnt bid so often they have less than 11 points if not they passes with trumf.. Then Pd will probably have 15/16+ points and often continue bidding... This talks for pass..I play often bergen raises and (strong club) then 2S often is wery weak.So in my summary It is some that talks for a pass.. And if they balance then we can bid 2 s or hearts, partner then have more correct picture of our hand, and can make better bids in the case the bidding continue..WhAT DO U SAY? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zillahandp Posted March 15, 2015 Report Share Posted March 15, 2015 Only one possible bid, 2s , whether or not playing weak nt , or strong nt with 5card majors or weak with five card majors Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masonbarge Posted March 15, 2015 Report Share Posted March 15, 2015 One more vote for 2♠ as clearcut, by-the-book bid. Yes it is a bare minimum but so what? That void with 3 trumps is worth something. 2/1 bidders will bid 1NT then 2S to show 3-card support, i.e. it is weaker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmnka447 Posted March 15, 2015 Report Share Posted March 15, 2015 2 ♠ if you're playing SAYC. Playing 2/1, I'd agree with a forcing NT followed by 2 ♠. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillPatch Posted March 15, 2015 Report Share Posted March 15, 2015 If opener rebids 2♥ over a forcing NT, a raise to 3 is very good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jodepp Posted March 15, 2015 Report Share Posted March 15, 2015 How could any red-blooded bridge player not bid 2♠ :) If playing a forcing notrump I might try that, settling in 2♠ if partner bid my void. Otherwise, I think it's masterminding to Pass. Seriously, this hand lacks nothing for a raise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgalt Posted March 15, 2015 Report Share Posted March 15, 2015 2S -- and that's the last thing I'm going to bid. If partner can't get to game by himself from that point, then we shouldn't be in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelandakh Posted March 16, 2015 Report Share Posted March 16, 2015 2S -- and that's the last thing I'm going to bid. If partner can't get to game by himself from that point, then we shouldn't be in it.Partner might not see the funny side of this approach after their 3♦ trial bid. ;) :ph34r: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMoe Posted March 16, 2015 Report Share Posted March 16, 2015 Treat the double as cooperative penalty (DSIP if you prefer). Partner has invitational plus values and not 6 ♠ cards. Doubled promises 2♥ cards (maybe 3). Opener has the option to bid 3NT with a stop, or pass for penalties. Pass and rake in the points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhaskell Posted March 19, 2015 Report Share Posted March 19, 2015 Hi!Played this hand IMP yesterday.(both red)I have in 4th seat xxx Jxxxxx - QJ9xThe bidding is p-1s-p....How do u think here? My "expert pd" says u have 4p so pass... But that can a monkey also understand...And we have all been monkeys at the beginning!... Playing SAYC (ie 2cl is strong)..3s is limit..Thx in advance! (relax and enjoy)pass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaky44 Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 By the way partner had AKQJx-xx-Kxxx-KT..He bid 4s.. Mabye 3d had been better but not obvious that it is better than 4s...It isn't obvious that 3d is a better bid than 4s? Really? What's the case for 4s? I don't even think 4s is the second best bid. For me, it's 3d or pass. Bidding 4s isn't even an option. Unless your 2s response promised an ace, bidding 4s is just hoping for the best in a situation where there are good options. How many ace-less hands can you have where that contract makes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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