Responses after t/o double having both majors

[scarletv]

This time I will present different bidding sequences and want to know what they should show. Actually we had a hand where we discussed later without result.

 

North passing

[hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1ddp1s2dpp2hp]133|100[/hv][hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1ddp1h2dpp2s]133|100[/hv][hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1ddp2d]133|100[/hv]

 

North raising

[hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1dd2d2s3dpp3h4d]133|100[/hv][hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1dd2d3dp]133|100[/hv][hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1dd2d2h3dpp3s]133|100[/hv][hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1dd2dd]133|100[/hv]

 

 

Please correct me when I am wrong. Especially I want to know if any of these bidding sequences is promising 5/4 in majors.

 

 

 

 

 

NP1 0-7 HCP 4+ ♠ 4+♥ nonforcing (spades might be longer)

NP2 0-7 not sure if that makes any sense nonforcing

 

NP3

8-10 with majors 4/4 forcing

7-10 majors 5/5 forcing

or 11-12 any forcing

 

NR1 weak with 4+ ♠ 4♥ nonforcing (spades might be longer)

NR2 not sure if that makes any sense nonforcing

NR3 a bit stronger as NP3

NR4 responsive double - weak with both majors

 

 

 

 

EDIT: Now added all that I wanted to post originally.

[mgoetze]

[hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1ddp1s2dpp2hp]133|100[/hv]

4-4 majors, nonforcing.

 

[hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1ddp1h2dpp2s]133|100[/hv]

I'm not sure this hand should even exist. Standard response with 4-4 majors weak is 1♠. So this should show 5 hearts. But then why not reopen with a double? I guess it means "4-5 majors and by the way I overlooked an ace on the last round of bidding".

 

[hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1ddp2d]133|100[/hv]

Various forcing hands, generally asking for the better major.

 

[hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1dd2d2s3dpp3h4d]133|100[/hv]

Again this shows equal length in the majors without significant extras.

 

[hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1dd2d3dp]133|100[/hv]

Still asking for better major.

 

[hv=d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1dd2d2h3dpp3s]133|100[/hv]

Asking bid. Asks whether you would like to look for a new partner.

[scarletv]

You were too fast for me :D

The post went live before completed.

[ArtK78]

The hands where responder bid spades and later bid hearts could be equal length in the majors, or responder could be 5-4 in spades and hearts.

[mikeh]

I don't enjoy a lot of different topics, so tend not to answer. That's just me and if this format works for the OP and others, I'm ok with that and am not being critical, just explaining why I don't often answer and why, when I do, I may not answer all the subtopics.

 

Here, I just wanted to comment on the auction in which advancer bid 1♥, opener rebid 2♦ and advancer reopened with 2♠.

 

This sequence doesn't exist absent a mistake on the part of advancer.

 

Advancer would always bid 1♠ with equal length, so presumably advancer is feeling 'stuck' with a 4=5 hand and lacking the values to respond 2♥ (about 8-10 hcp) or 2♦ (about good 10+, unlimited upwards).

 

So he bids 1♥ and infers that partner doesn't have 4 hearts.

 

Now, it used to be that doubler needed some extras to bid 2♥ over the 2♦, but I think the current popular style is that doubler should bid 2♥ in competition with any 4 card holding. Thus advancer can infer that partner lacks 4 hearts, and so may infer that partner 'must' have 4 spades.

 

However, that isn't necessarily so. AQx KJx xx Kxxxx is a double of 1♦, not a 2♣ overcall.

 

That means that bidding 2♠ risks forcing partner to the 3-level to correct to hearts, which makes no sense when advancer is weak.

 

The answer lies in realizing that on these types of hands, the almost sure 5-3 heart fit will play well enough to be the contract, rather than trying to hit the probable 4-4 spade fit. 4-4 fits often generate a trick more than a 5-3, but this isn't as true for low-level contracts with modest values as it is for hands where the declaring side has most of the strength. In addition, the ability to stay at the 2-level makes up for any other issue.

[Fluffy]

A cuebid at the 2 level is any GF hand, ot exceptionally an invitational with specifically both majors (will raise whatever partner bids to the 3 level).

 

A cuebid at the 3 level is Game Frcing however, since with 4-4 majors you would make a responsive double.

 

1♦-X-2♦-2♠.... 3♥ should not be a normal 4-4 since that hand uses responsive double. So it is a 5♠-4♥ hand, or perhaps a 4-4 with very huge quality difference for spades. over hearts.