Alternative to 2NT opening

[jdulmage]

My partner and I use 2♣ opening as 20+ points, and rarely feel the need to open 2NT anymore to show 20-21 points.

 

What do you all suggest we should use 2NT opening for? We were thinking 7-10 HCP, 5-5 in the minors.

 

Anyone?

 

Thanks

[mike777]

Here is one, way out of the box.

 

14-17 HCP one suited club hand, with follow up structure.

[awm]

I've played the 5-5 minors treatment a lot; it works fine, although it doesn't come up much. In the last major tournament I played, we tried the following:

 

2NT = weak 3-bid in hearts

3C/D = natural weak

3H = weak 3-bid in spades

3S = gambling 3NT

 

There are a number of advantages to this structure, primarily right-siding the gambling 3NT contracts and most major suit games after preempts. Also, it becomes possible to ask about the quality of the 2NT heart preempt (3C asking) so one can more easily bid this on a wide range of hands. The structure seemed to work pretty well.

 

-- Adam

[pclayton]

You've made a wise choice dropping the strong 2N, although I hope you aren't loading all of the big hands onto 2♣.

 

A few options that have been suggested on this forum (besides it showing the minors):

 

- Weak minor preempt; with 3♣ and 3♦ showing good suits.

- Beginning of transfer preempts; = ♣'s, 3♣ = ♦'s.

 

I wouldn't suggest to use 2N as a strong bid of any sort. Some will give you ideas about 3 bids showing all kinds of weird stuff, like it being a preempt OR a strong 2 suiter, but aside from this stuff being illegal in most parts, it can be difficult with anyone but a diehard partnership.

[jdulmage]

What's the purpose of that? The difference between say ♣AJ9xxxx (bid 2NT, transfer to 3♣) versus ♣AKQxxxx (open 3♣)???

[Chamaco]

I do not know other country's regulations for mid-low flight events.

 

But in Italy, in NON-TOPFLIGHTS, any non strong opening (where "nonstrong" is defined as <13 hcp) ranging between 2C->3S (inclusive) MUST guarantee 4 cards in a SPECIFIC suit.

 

So, some example of NOT ALLOWED treatments in non topflight events:

 

- 2NT = unspecified 3 level preempt

- 3S Gambling in an unspecified minor. You might use 3NT as Gambling if you announce a specific minor, but this seems to lose the point (and reduces by half the frequency of occurrence).

 

Note that I am not discussing the efficiency of the use of such treatments (I'd also love to use 3S Gambling), nor do I agree with such restrictions.

 

Yet, knowing the regulations in Italy, I prefer not to waste energies in selecting (good) treatments applicable in the minority of tournaments here.

 

So I suggest it would be wise to check which of these are allowed in your country, and select those which are allowed also in low-midflights.

[Free]

3♠ gambling is a brown sticker convention: it's an opening between 2♣ and 3♠ which doesn't show any suit when it's weak.

 

If you have the 2NT bid available, I'd suggest you start playing transfer preempts which include GF 55+ hands. This way, you'll have a lot easier bidding sequence with 2-suiter GF hands, and you'll be rightsiding most preempts. 1-under preempts don't give you the possibility to invite, but maybe 2-under might suit you better. The only price you have to pay in that last situation is the ♣ preempt, which is imo not a big loss anyway, but on the other hand you also get 4-level preempts for the minors.

[pclayton]

What's the purpose of that? The difference between say ♣AJ9xxxx (bid 2NT, transfer to 3♣) versus ♣AKQxxxx (open 3♣)???

Not sure which treatment you don't like here, but:

 

Transfer preempts are great. Which hand would you like on the table to defend 3♣. The hand with 7 clubs (which you know about) or the hand that you know nothing about?

 

And to show different suits, thats helpful too. If 3♣ promises 2/3 top honors (like it frequently did 30 years ago), it can lead to many good 3N contracts.

[NickToll]

Try this: 18-20 balanced! Maybe not fashionable, but...

 

The rational behind this not-that-popular choice is simple: remove those tricky hands from one-bids. You will be free to use a strong rebid in notrump in a number of ways, tipically to show strong hands difficult to describe in standard methods. An example: I like 1♠ - 1NT - 2NT showing a strong hand with six spades and three hearts, offering a choice of games when partner has responded 1NT with a 5-card heart suit. Another example: after 1♦ - (pass) - 1♠ - (2♥), you will be able to build a more efficient rebid frame if you don't have to take 18-20 balanced into account. Double? 3card support if you like it, or strong hand with no spade fit, or whatever. 2NT? Good-bad, minimum unbalanced hand (3♣ and 3♦ being natural and strong).

 

Not only good news, of course. First of all, 18-20 2NT is cumbersome. Constructive sequences are easier if you start from a one-bid and are able to show this hand with your rebid. If you accept to play 18-20 2NT, you'll have to extend your constructive sequence to the 4 level (i.e., show a short suit after responding 3♣ or 3♠) and give opener the chance to stop in 4NT. Sometimes you will be one trick high, but usually it will work reasonably well.

 

Yes, I know, 18-20 is scary! You might think that opponents will be there, ready to double you, whenever partner is broke. Reality is:

- partner will have 7 points on average;

- when partner is very weak, he might have a 5card major to play in;

- when you open 2NT, it is very, very hard for opponents to double you.

 

Think of this 2NT as a kind of preemptive bid, a "big weak notrump", and consider your results on the long run. See you after your evaluation...

[ochinko]

I've played the 5-5 minors treatment a lot; it works fine, although it doesn't come up much.

And is consistant with a 4NT opening when you're 6-6 in the minors. :) Yes, it comes only once in a leap year but who opens 4NT anyway?

 

We too have no normal use of 2NT since it's covered by our strong multi option.

[jdulmage]

lol, well, we will probably end up playing some sort of two suited opening with that.

 

I'm not playing strong 2NT at all, so it has to be one of these two suited openers instead.

 

Thanks for your help everyone.

[Guest Jlall]

Transfer preempts are great.

If the opponents never bid, transfer preempts are indeed very useful. But consider that when you preempt the likelihood is the deal belongs to your opponents since our hand is weak. We are giving them a number of advantages they would not have had before now. Consider things like this:

 

2N-weak in clubs:

 

X=strong balanced or any 18+ (with responsive/card showing X by this players partner).

3C=michaels

bid=sounder than usual becuase you can pass then balance with a more marginal hand and not have the danger of lefty having a huge hand (since he would make some sort of game try).

3N=tricks

 

pass then X=takeout

X then X=extra values, optional.

pass then bid is now possible.

 

 

etc. You give them much more room because they can safely pass, they can X then pass, X then X, or they can make a direct cuebid. This defeats the purpose of a preempt, and is what i like to call an anti-preempt.

[luis]

The idea of preempting when you have half the deck has always been quite an enigma for me :-)

Dopping the dreaded 2NT opening even if you don't use 2NT at all is a good idea. Someone suggested a 18-20 2NT opening, In my opinion that can be even worst than the traditional 2NT and I didn't think that such a thing was possible, thanks for opening my eyes I will remember it can be worst the next time a 2NT opening preempts my side from finding the best contract.

 

About 2NT I'm playing a 5-5 hand with hearts and a minor and 10-13 HCP now. Because that type of hand is hard to describe or show in most methods, specially if they have the feared spade suit. So for now I think that 2NT should show something related to hearts.

 

Luis

[the hog]

"Transfer preempts are great."

 

I think transfer pre empts are wonderful. Look at what you can do.

X to show a good hand with the suit bid but not a t/o X oriented hand, bid the shown suit for t/o, pass and then double for penalties.

 

Please play them, especially against me.

[flytoox]

Havent thought about it much, but how about 2N=either weak minor two suiters or strong major two suiters?

 

comments are welcome.