wanoff Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 5cd majors, no alerts, favourable vul, imps, your bid ? [hv=pc=n&n=sa76hkj98dkj4c765&d=e&v=e&b=6&a=1hp1np2sdp]133|200[/hv] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 What kind of hand could partner have that needs to act now and couldn't the round before?, I just don't know.Clearly partner doesn't have minors. 2♠ is forcing so it makes no sense o prebalance. Also he had 2NT available in both rounds of bidding for clear purpose. So lead directing seems the only plausible, but why is West passing? Maybe dealer is faking a spade reverse, but why didn't partner bid 1♠?, is he doubling with strong 4? Its the only thing that makes sense to me, so I am passing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 My feeling tells me pard probably has something like 3154, 3145, 4144, etc. In any case he should have some cards, so yes, pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtK78 Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 Check to see if everyone has the same color cards. This deck appears to have about 60 HCP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillPatch Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 Another plausibility is that responder has a wjs in ♠, a hopefully obsolete treatment from the original system book on Kaplan-Sheinwold, 1964. Partner could then have a TO double of ♠. KS uses strong jump shifts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 My feeling tells me pard probably has something like 3154, 3145, 4144, etc. In any case he should have some cards, so yes, pass.What would a double of 1♥ have meant in your system? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gszes Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 This appears to be a delayed minor suit tox . P was kept quiet thefirst round by poor power and poor distribution but now that the oppsare close to bidding game they want to try and show sacrifice material. IMHO p has something like xx x xxxxxx QJxx or vice versa. With bothminors evenly split they had an easy 2n. We are to merely bid 2n with nopreference (letting p choose) or choose btn the minors at the appropriate level. Given the bidding I would go for 3n (cant be natural given the bidding sofar and asks p to choose the minor) and let the opps figure out what to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 This auction is similar to 1m-p-1M-p;2M-Dbl. It shows takeout for the Major with length in the minor as well. So it seems to me like partner has both minors, is short in ♠, and as a result has some length in ♥ (no U2NT, no 2m overcall). That gives him either a 1-4-4-4 or some 1-3-5-4 with short ♠. It's quite difficult to estimate his strength: we're at favorable vulnerability, so he might be suggesting a sacrifice. So I'll bid 2NT: 2 places to play, he'll bid his longest minor and we hope we won't get butchered (because the auction suggests West has a similar hand like partner but with short ♥s). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 This auction is similar to 1m-p-1M-p;2M-Dbl. It's certainly not similar. For one thing, the opponents haven't announced a fit in our auction. For another, their combined strength is on average much higher. I think 13(54) is impossible - there is no hand that could safely double now that couldn't have overcalled 2m. 1444 or 2344 might be possible - but it it's still very very dangerous, and would need to be a hand with very good playing strength. Obviously, that seems unlikely given our own strength and the opponents' bidding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 What would a double of 1♥ have meant in your system? Same thing, but more HCP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgr Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 I expect: Me: 3=4=3=3; 12 HCPOpener: 5=6=1=1; 11 HCPPartner: 2=3=4=4; 12 HCPResponder: 3=v=5=5; 5 HCP I bid 2NT and let partner choose the minor, if I'm really confident about the above then bidding 3♣ is maybe better (gives opps less chance to double us). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 I expect: Me: 3=4=3=3; 12 HCPOpener: 5=6=1=1; 11 HCPPartner: 2=3=4=4; 12 HCPResponder: 3=v=5=5; 5 HCP I bid 2NT and let partner choose the minor, if I'm really confident about the above then bidding 3♣ is maybe better (gives opps less chance to double us).Interesting game you play in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherdano Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 I can't believe the replies in this thread. Forcing to the 3-level on a non-fit auction where one opponent has shown a reverse with a 2344 12count, or a takeout double of hearts too week to act initially is suicidal. What's the upside? You give them a free chance to double us for 5 down if all we have is a 4-3 fit, or on a 4-4 fit with bad splits. Otherwise, they will just go on to bid 3N or 4H as they were always going to do, and you have helped them in the play. Suggest a sacrifice at the 5-level? Just in case partner is the one with shape but forgot to make a WJO over 1♥? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 If your point is "this auction is impossible", well... it happened at table :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamJson Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 In theory partner should be short in spades and have length in hearts, something like 1543 distribution. Unfortunately that is not consistent with your own hand. Also with such a hand it would be better to pass and wait developments. If partner is a random BBO player whose game you don't know I reckon he will have something like KJxxx in spades and is one of those who just likes to make a noise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 It's certainly not similar. For one thing, the opponents haven't announced a fit in our auction. For another, their combined strength is on average much higher.I'd say the biggest difference lies in that opponents are in a forcing situation, so there is no point in forcing them to act since they are already on a force. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilKing Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 My guess is that at least TWO people have bid their hand incorrectly - I just can't get it to add up with just one error. :blink: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finch Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 My guess is that at least TWO people have bid their hand incorrectly - I just can't get it to add up with just one error. :blink: I can. Partner's double is penalties (why else double a forcing bid when you can't possible have a hand that wants to act now, couldn't act over 1!H, and can't bid 2NT at either turn to call)? Partner might think a spade lead is needed to beat 3NT. Partner doesn't believe in 4-card overcalls. I think responder has some poxy 1-count that responded for a laugh and passed 2Sx in the hope that it wouldn't end the auction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilKing Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 I can. Partner's double is penalties (why else double a forcing bid when you can't possible have a hand that wants to act now, couldn't act over 1!H, and can't bid 2NT at either turn to call)? Partner might think a spade lead is needed to beat 3NT. Partner doesn't believe in 4-card overcalls. I think responder has some poxy 1-count that responded for a laugh and passed 2Sx in the hope that it wouldn't end the auction. It's pretty hard to double 2♠ for penalties when you can't overcall 1♠. It might be possible if you have the hearts locked - eg AQT8x but that just doesn't stack up looking at our hand. Construction please! I can't get it to work without all 3 players bidding like maniacs. Anyway, I agree with pass. If I bid here, it's a full house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fourdad Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 Only a penalty X makes sense to me. Pass! Odds are good that at least 2 of the players here will go on my "ignore" list! :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanoff Posted January 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 If partner is a random BBO player whose game you don't know I reckon he will have something like KJxxx in spades and is one of those who just likes to make a noise. N/S are a regular partnership of county standard, E/W - a fair bit stronger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilKing Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 N/S are a regular partnership of county standard, E/W - a fair bit stronger. OK, then I guess East has come up with some sort of really weird psych to stop the spade lead against 3NT and pard has made a lead director. [hv=pc=n&s=skqt92h65d8752c43&w=sj83h74dt96ckjt98&n=sa76hkj98dkj4c765&e=s54haqt32daq3caQ2&d=e&v=e&b=6&a=1hp1np2sdp]399|300[/hv] That, or South has pulled the wrong card. Occam's Razor suggests that the simplest explantion is that pard needs new glasses. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Molyb Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 If your point is "this auction is impossible", well... it happened at table :)This auction is impossible so I pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanoff Posted January 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 OK, then I guess East has come up with some sort of really weird psych to stop the spade lead against 3NT and pard has made a lead director. Spot on and well done to all that got it.We went for -800 in 3♣ against nothing, the lead directing double not being well received by teammates. The full hand, [hv=pc=n&s=skjt95h65d86c9843&w=sq84h32dt9753cat2&n=sa76hkj98dkj4c765&e=s32haqt74daq2ckqj]399|300[/hv] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wzd3 Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 Spot on and well done to all that got it.We went for -800 in 3♣ against nothing, the lead directing double not being well received by teammates. I've been reading Mike Lawrence's book on takeout doubles, and since this seem strange to me, decided to take a look for it. He actually had a section on doubles over reverses and strong jump shifts. The summary is that it's unusual and rare, is usually a poor bid, and has to be of the lead directing/penalty variety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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