Silly poll on English language

[gnasher]

The Brits are split between "drink driving" and "drunken driving", but "drinking & driving" is also acceptable.

...

It seems pretty clear that the majority view is that, whatever phrase should be used, hyphens do not belong in there.

In case you're actually going to use this information, I should point out that this result is misleading as to the terminology used by the world at large. By asking only bridge players you skewed your sample in favour of people who think grammar is important.

 

In the UK, "drink-driving" and "drink-drive", with or without hyphens, are widely used in official guidance and legislation, by advisory organisations, and in the media. For example, here:

https://www.gov.uk/d...iving-penalties

 

"Drinking and driving" is also commonly used, I think because of an advertising campaign whose key phrase was "Don't drink and drive".

 

"Drunken driving" is, as Vampyr points out, the narrower category of driving whilst actually drunk.

[Zelandakh]

The phrase that my son was taught was "drink-driving", which leads me to the conclusion that mr1303 was the author of this English method. Now I understand why he fled to Mongolia. ;)

As I wrote above, this hyphenated form is used within the Act on the matter, so certainly not wrong.

 

My apologies to Vampyr for the slip - (un)*fortunately I do not speak American. I only added it because I was not sure if the Americans here would know what a headmaster is.

 

*: delete as appropriate

[kenberg]

What's the problem, it's just y=75-5x

 

My guess is that tis is not the "right" answer where "right" means "receives full credit. I am soory to sound cynical, but my expectation is that "describe the pattern" is a technical phrase. I asked the Thomas, the grandkid in question, to let me know what was wanted but that was a while ago and I don't think I am going to find out. But my guess is the teacher would mark it arong and explain that she asked for the pattern, nit the equation. Patterns are a big thing in education these days.

 

This comes back to the OP. I had never heard of "drink driving" before this thread. If, for some reason, it is thought important that a child in an English as a Second Language class learn that the phrase is the preferred one (preferred by whom we might ask) then I guess the kid has to learn it. But is that really the goal? Or should it be? Is it not at least somewhat relevant that someone who has lived in this country for 76 years has never before heard the phrase?

 

 

Back to math again. Math frightens many people and they find it confusing. It would be good if a kid learns that math is useful and makes sense. As it happens, we have lent some money (considerably more than $75) to one of our kids. It was for a good reason and it is being paid back at better than the agreed upon rate. Not once, in family discussions of this, has the issue of an independent variable x and a dependent variable y come up. Why are we determined to have children learn that mathematicians can find very complex ways of saying something very simple? Neither mathematicians nor normal people talk this way about payments on a loan.

I would be happy enough if Thomas were asked to write an equation expressing the remaining debt y in terms of the number x of payments that have been made.

[helene_t]

The votes here suggest that "drunk" dominates in USA while "drink" dominates in the UK. Google confirms this. On ".uk" sites, "drink" is about four times more prevalent as "drunk", while "drunk" is more than twice as prevalent as "drink" on ".com" sites.

[kenberg]

OK. maybe I understand or partially relent or maybe I am just exhausted.

 

perhaps the following are all true?

 

a. Rik and family currently reside in the Netherlands.

b. His son's teacher is a Brit teaching English as a second language.

c. "Drink driving" is in common usage in the UK.

d. The school tests are unforgiving of deviations. There is a right answer and other answers are wrong.

 

It a. b. and c. are true then I should probably butt out. Suasages are bangers, hoods are bonnets, drunk driving is drink driving. And there is something about wank, but that's another thread.

 

As to d. there can be room for substantial disagreement. St. Paul is the capital city of Minnesota, Minneapolis isn't. Other things are less precise. What do you do with a drunken sailor? Probably the same thing that you do with a drunk sailor. With a drink sailor? That's tougher.

[gwnn]

The pattern is "y depends on x as given by the function y(x)=75-5x." This reminds me of the recent chess book Move first, think later, with the funny conversation (a teacher is trying to have a student find the best move while exploring the various aspects of the position):

T: "What can you see in the position? What are some of black's weaknesses?"

S: "I would probably play Rd6, it looks strong, no?"

T: "OK but what plan would you like to follow?"

S: "Rd6 Qb8 I have Ne4, winning, right?"

T: "Yes but what about the general principles and the positional weaknesses in the black camp?"

S: "After Ne4 there is even mate in 3, nice!"

 

The point being that chess players naturally think in terms of moves while mathematicians think in terms of equations/functions. To demand otherwise is not only expecting the impossible, it also leads to a wasting everyone's time and probably pissing off everyone involved.

[Trinidad]

OK. maybe I understand or partially relent or maybe I am just exhausted.

 

perhaps the following are all true?

 

a. Rik and family currently reside in the Netherlands.

b. His son's teacher is a Brit teaching English as a second language.

c. "Drink driving" is in common usage in the UK.

d. The school tests are unforgiving of deviations. There is a right answer and other answers are wrong.

 

It a. b. and c. are true then I should probably butt out. Suasages are bangers, hoods are bonnets, drunk driving is drink driving. And there is something about wank, but that's another thread.

 

As to d. there can be room for substantial disagreement. St. Paul is the capital city of Minnesota, Minneapolis isn't. Other things are less precise. What do you do with a drunken sailor? Probably the same thing that you do with a drunk sailor. With a drink sailor? That's tougher.

Actually, I think b is false. It is a lady from Bulgaria who supposedly has English as her first language. Last year, he had a nice teacher from New Zealand.

 

And I agree with you an d, but if the teacher doesn't know Dutch, it is impossible for her to judge whether the answer was:

• the correct answer to an alternative meaning
  
• an answer that was in the right ball park
  
• or simply wrong.
  

 

Now, my kids are at a bilingual school. This means that they have regular English and "English-plus", which is more conversational English. On top of that, their classes in most subjects (Math, Science, History, Biology, Geography, Economy, Phys. Ed., Art , etc.) are in English. Only the languages (French, German, Dutch), religion and social classes from their home room teacher are in Dutch (since kids need to be able to express any social-emotional problems without language barriers).

In my opinion, they should get their regular English lessons from Dutch teachers. They will be able to provide the bridge between Dutch and English. Perhaps they will not pronounce the 'th' perfectly and they might say that "Tchicago is a city on Lake Mitchigan, that got its name from the Tchippewa native Americans", I don't care. Their native English speaking teacher for "English-plus" should be able to correct that.

 

Rik

[Trinidad]

In case you're actually going to use this information, I should point out that this result is misleading as to the terminology used by the world at large. By asking only bridge players you skewed your sample in favour of people who think grammar is important.

Do not worry. I only did this little survey to satisfy my own curiosity. I intend no harm. And I don't own a shotgun. :)

 

On the other hand, I think that the population of English teachers should be more skewed in favor of correct English grammar than the population of bridge players.

 

Rik

[Vampyr]

What do you do with a drunken sailor? Probably the same thing that you do with a drunk sailor.

 

Make him search for the missing syllable

Make him search for the missing syllable

Make him search for the missing syllable

Earli in the morning.

[blackshoe]

The point being that chess players naturally think in terms of moves…

I wouldn't be surprised to find that really good chess players think in terms of patterns of moves, rather than individual moves.

[helene_t]

More google results: India, South Africa and Canada use the US form almost universaly, while Ireland, NZ and OZ use the British form more consistently than the UK does. Singapore is 50/50. Malta has a slight preference for the British form.

[WellSpyder]

not that it is a generational thing since you are the same age as I and Robin not a whole lot older!

Perhaps we should have another poll to determine how many native English speakers would say "the same age as I" (ie implicitly "the same age as I am") and how many would say "the same age as me"......

[Zelandakh]

I wouldn't be surprised to find that really good chess players think in terms of patterns of moves, rather than individual moves.

It depends to some extent on how sharp the position is. Most of the time, while being aware of thematic plans for a given position, it is not enough to think of "patterns", you have to come down to concrete variations.

[Bbradley62]

Perhaps we should have another poll to determine how many native English speakers would say "the same age as I" (ie implicitly "the same age as I am") and how many would say "the same age as me"......

As a native New Yorker, I always say "the same age as I am", because "the same age as I" is grammatically correct but sounds dorkish. For the same reason, I never use the word "data" with a verb that is specifically plural: "the data will show" or "based on the data", never "the data show".

[Vampyr]

As a native New Yorker, I always say "the same age as I am"

As another native New Yorker, I wonder if I do the same; I will try to notice next time.

 

What seems natural when writing can sound, as you say "dorkish" when speaking.

[PassedOut]

From the American Register: Scientists discover Universe isn’t growing as fast as they previously thought

 

These findings are sure to protein shake upward cosmologists’ contemplating and could push those to revise downwards the two fee your world is actually widening in addition to the amount of dark vitality specific to your world.

Should not submit any more articles until sober...

[barmar]

That article seems to have been written by Google Translate. E.g. "work day in the direction of your red" is presumably a translation of "red shift".

[y66]

From your list, I picked "drunk driving". If it had included "driving under the influence", "driving under the influence of alcohol" or DUI I would have picked that instead.