bid these 2

[Fluffy]

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South will raise to 3♦ and NS shut up thereafter.

 

I am interested only on people who can stand the 1♣ opening.

[kgr]

About 1♣ opening:

In my system I can open:

1) 1♣: 2+c♣; 12-19

2) 2♦ followed by 3♣: GF ♣

3) 2♦ followed by 2NT: 21-22 balanced.

I prefer: 3 > 2 > 1

 

I'm not sure how it will go if I open 1♣; maybe I'm influenced by seeing both hands:

1♣-(2♦)-Pas-(3♦)

DBL-(Pas)-4♥-(Pas)

4NT-(Pas)-5♦-(Pas)

6♥-AP

 

- 1♣: forced :)

- Pas: not enough for 2♥, very minimum for 3♣ and don't like that with 5c♥

...maybe DBL is also an option.

- DBL: obvious

- 4♥: Partner has some extras and 5c♥, ♣-support, and good hand for previous pass

- 4NT: RKC (This has to be RKC)

- 5♦: 3 or 0

- 6♥: partner needs to have something for the 4♥ bid.

[MrAce]

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[whereagles]

I'd bid 3♣ over 2♦. It should be easy then for opener to self-boost to DA SLAM.

[ggwhiz]

Playing 3+ clubs the east hand is maybe marginal but definitely worth a direct bid imo. I would choose 2♥ at the table but 3♣ would show the huge fit this time and either should lead to slam.

 

I'm a huge non-fan of 2+ club openings.

[Fluffy]

I pick 3♣ as East, but now I think double should be better, 2♥ is an overbid with just quacks. Partner then bid 3♥ over 3♦ but didn't like me raising her 3 card suit so retreated to 5♣ only.

 

This is MPs, so finding hearts would be relevant.

 

Timo I don't get why you don't bid hearts over opener's double. Also why you don't think you will lose ♦A+♠K

[Jinksy]

I think I would double then bid 4♦ as W since I'm not certain 4♣ is forcing.

 

I'd then wonder as E whether 4♠ suggests a weak hand with long spades, or a cue agreeing clubs. I think probably the latter, since if opener had a strong balanced hand he'd have doubled 3♦. Next question is am I worth one? I doubt I'd find it it tbh. I'd bid 5♣ direct and opener prob has to pass - unless E wants to punt on the 'don't play 5m at MP grounds', which doesn't feel too convincing when E has Qx in their suit

 

FWIW, I would open 2♣, and I'm about as conservative 2♣ opener as I know.

[mikeh]

I like the idea of the negative double. It is useful to remember that while the double ostensibly shows both majors, it is permissible for it to be based on a single major provided that responder can handle partner getting excited in the other major.

 

Thus here, if West were strong with 4 spades, he might well bid 4♠ to advance the negative double, especially after S bid an obstructive 3♦ bid, depriving West of that cuebid.

 

East can stand this because if West has a hand that can bid 4♠, he must have a play for 5♣.

 

It isn't clear to me exactly what happens after the negative double. Assuming, as seems pretty standard these days, that West makes a strength showing, takeout oriented double, then East has a choice. I see Timo chooses 4♣ but att I suspect that 3♥ would be a popular decision, and after that call West has choices as well. He still hasn't shown the full power of his hand, even discounting the diamond K. Yet, he can't cuebid 4♦ without, in my view, promising 4 hearts. I don't think East has shown 5 hearts by this stage. 4♣ 'should' be forcing, after the double, and in any event will fetch 5♣ from East, and the question then is whether opener has enough to raise himself to slam. I think he does, since East has to have some values for the original negative double, and most of the time that won't include a diamond card. Qxxx QJxx xx Qxx is the worst construction I could come up with, but playing for that makes for frightened bridge. Even QJxx Qxxx xx Qxx gives us some, remote, play.

 

As for Timo's auction, he also has West essentially raising to slam all by himself. In fact I can't think of any auction, starting with a negative double, in which East really gets to convey the key features: the stiff spade, the solid 5 card hearts, and (for the ultimate contract of 6N) the diamond Q.

 

An immediate club raise would get the slam bid easier, in clubs, but I just don't like the idea of suppressing the hearts when partner could, for all we know, be 4=4=2=3. AJxx AKxx Jx AJx is not a hand on which I want to play any number of clubs and while I am sure a lot of players would say they could still get into hearts, I am not one of them. If West bids 3♥ over 3♦, I don't think he is showing this hand-type in standard methods, much as we'd like it to have that meaning, given what responder holds.

[MrAce]

@ Mike: I have seen this scenario so many times that's why I bid the way I did. Imo 4-4 majors or only one major giant hands should either start with 4♦ over 3♦ or if started dbl he should bid his cheaper major or the one he holds over 4♣. I really do not like the idea of hiding club fit one more round by E hand.

 

At the time I responded I had no clue that it was MP btw. I would be more leaning towards what you said and try to find the right game first. I am still not sure if 3♥ would be my call though but at MP it makes more sense imo.

 

@ Gonzalo: I did not make W bid 3♥ because I play this as 4 hearts at least since it is a free bid and with 3-3 or 4-3 majors he has double available. I made W bid slam and I know we can lose those 2 tricks you mentioned. But for the love of God, E has an already awful hand. Yes I know there are couple of worse hands you may construct for his initial neg dbl but I will bid slam once I learnt he started dbl with a M+♣. Who can claim they can bid precisely after preempt and raise when we have already chosen to open a marginal hand. (I agree with 1♣ btw). My final 6♣ may not be everyone's choice, but upto 5♣ it is my ideal auction. I do not think you can realistically find club fit and then learn everything you need from pd, unless you play a system specifically designed for only and only this particular hand. Imo the hands pd will hold for this bidding we make slam much more often than not. I maybe wrong of course.

[Fluffy]

I meant East, over the double it looks normal that East bids his 5 card major.