2 level responses to an unbalanced 1D

[Cthulhu D]

I play an unbalanced 1D opening (11-21) in the context of a 1C: Clubs or balanced, 5 card majors, 14-16 NT system. I'm thinking about my responses to 1D. We used to play SJS, but that doesn't make a great deal of sense. I've read Mgoetze's thread on the topic and I was thinking of the following structure makes much sense

 

1D - ??:

 

1H: 4+ Natural, Transfer Responses

1S: 4+ Natural, Transfer Responses

 

1NT: Hands that cannot make a sensible other response (tends to have some club length, relatively weak)

 

Then the responses I'm not sure about. I really liked Mgoetze's 2C response, but I'm not sure how to make continuations work

 

2C: Clubs GF, Bal GF or 7-10 (maybe this needs to be 7-9) diamonds.

2D: Weak with a major

2H: Reverse Flannery by Responder - is this really required with Xfer responses?

2S: Initvitational+ raise of diamonds

2NT: Balanced invite to 3NT with short diamonds and no 4 card major

3C: Invitational with 6 clubs

3D: Premeptive raise.

 

Thoughts?

[foobar]

I play an unbalanced 1D opening (11-21) in the context of a 1C: Clubs or balanced, 5 card majors, 14-16 NT system. I'm thinking about my responses to 1D. We used to play SJS, but that doesn't make a great deal of sense. I've read Mgoetze's thread on the topic and I was thinking of the following structure makes much sense

 

1D - ??:

 

1H: 4+ Natural, Transfer Responses

1S: 4+ Natural, Transfer Responses

 

How do the transfer responses work?

 

Here's what I came up with over a similar 1♦ opening (albeit weaker):

 

1M: Natural

1N: < 12; not suitable for any other bid

 

1D - 2C (12+; GF unless suit rebid):

=========================

 

2D: 5+ diamonds, single suited min or two-suited hands

2H: Three suited, short clubs, min

2S: Good raise with 4+ clubs; 2N asks for shortness

2N: GF, 6+ diamonds

3C: Min raise with 4+ clubs

3N: Three suited, short clubs, max

 

1D - 2D (12+; GF unless suit rebid):

========================

 

2H: Three suited, short diamonds, min (rarely (42)=2=5)

2S: Good raise with 4+ diamonds; 2N asks for shortness

2N: GF, 6+ clubs

3C: Min, 6+ clubs

3D: Min raise

3N: Three suited, short clubs, max

 

1D - 2H:Reverse flannery, < invite

1D - 2S:Reverse flannery, invite

1D - 2N: Invitational

[foobar]

I play an unbalanced 1D opening (11-21) in the context of a 1C: Clubs or balanced, 5 card majors, 14-16 NT system. I'm thinking about my responses to 1D. We used to play SJS, but that doesn't make a great deal of sense. I've read Mgoetze's thread on the topic and I was thinking of the following structure makes much sense

 

1D - ??:

 

1H: 4+ Natural, Transfer Responses

1S: 4+ Natural, Transfer Responses

 

How do the transfer responses work?

 

Here's what I came up with over a similar 1♦ opening (albeit weaker):

 

1M: Natural

1N: < 12; not suitable for any other bid

 

1D - 2C (12+; GF unless suit rebid):

=========================

 

2D: 5+ diamonds, single suited min or two-suited hands

2H: Three suited, short clubs, min

2S: Good raise with 4+ clubs; 2N asks for shortness

2N: GF, 6+ diamonds

3C: Min raise with 4+ clubs

3N: Three suited, short clubs, max

 

1D - 2D (12+; GF unless suit rebid):

========================

 

2H: Three suited, short diamonds, min (rarely (42)=2=5)

2S: Good raise with 4+ diamonds; 2N asks for shortness

2N: GF, 6+ clubs

3C: Min, 6+ clubs

3D: Min raise

3N: Three suited, short clubs, max

 

1D - 2H:Reverse flannery, < invite

1D - 2S:Reverse flannery, invite

1D - 2N: Invitational

[Cthulhu D]

I'm basically playing the responses from Mgoetze's prior thread (http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/topic/51003-response-structure-for-unbalanced-1%26-9830%3B-opening/), and from the previous thread about transfers after 1D-1M. I like echognome/phils 1NT Gazzili thing, but partner and I play transfers every where else so the conceptual memory load is lower so we're doing that.

 

 

 

so 1D-1H

 

1S: Nat

1NT: Clubs

2C: Diamonds

2D: 3 card Heart raise

2H: 4 card heart raise

2S: NAt Reverse

2NT: Great heart raise or 6 diamonds 3 hearts in a very strong hand (1D-1H-2C-2D-2H implies a 15-16 ish hand, whereas going via 2NT is 17+

3C: 5/5 minors

3D: ?!?!?!? No idea, because it seems like a lot of jump rebids should start with 2C. Currently it's not defined what the difference between 1D-1M-2C-2D-3D and 1D-1M-3D is. I suspect one should be 16-17 or 16-18 and the other should be a total max but whatever.

3H: Intermediate 4 card raise (Violating LOTT :siren:)

3S: Self Splinter (massive hand)

 

and 1D-1S:

 

1NT: Clubs

2C: Hearts

2D: Diamonds (thinking about swapping w/2C for memory reasons, despite being inferior)

2H: 3 card spade raise

2S: 4 card spade raise

2NT: great 4 card spade raise or 6 diamonds 3 spades in a very strong hand

3C: 5/5 minors

3D: Regular jump rebid.

3H: Self splinter

3S: Intermediate 4 card raise

 

 

 

as my 1D promises 4+ Diamonds (and 4 only if any 4441 or (13)=4=5) I don;'t really need the short diamonds rebids by opener!

 

What I'm stumped on is what to do over 1D-2C - 2D effectively becomes P/C, but I'm worried that the separation between the hands isn't large enough.

[phoenix214]

The way i play the unbalanced diamond at the moment goes as follows:

1M - Natural with 4 cards

1NT - INV+ with clubs or bal(Think 1M-2C but instead of GF, it is INV+)

2X - Natural and non-forcing

2NT - INV + with diamonds

3C - Nat, NF

3D - Weak raise

3M - splinter

[gordontd]

The way i play the unbalanced diamond at the moment goes as follows:

1M - Natural with 4 cards

1NT - INV+ with clubs or bal(Think 1M-2C but instead of GF, it is INV+)

2X - Natural and non-forcing

2NT - INV + with diamonds

3C - Nat, NF

3D - Weak raise

3M - splinter

So both 2C & 3C are nat NF? What's the difference between the two?

[Kungsgeten]

So is your 2♣ bid like a puppet to 2♦ (unless opener is strong), which responder pass when holding the raise hand?

 

We use the following:

 

1NT = Clubs, weak or GF

2♣ = Diamond raise, weak or GF (3+ if weak, 4+ if GF)

2♦ = 3+ diamond raise, INV

 

This is in combination with 1♥ being natural or a GF relay.

 

We use weak jump shifts, but you could probably find better uses for it. Perhaps:

 

2♥ = Balanced GF (if not wanting to use 1♥ as artificial)

2♠ = GF with a 5-5 pattern (not including diamonds)

 

In your original structure you could skip Reverse Flannery and play 2♥ as 4+ support and INV+, instead of 2♠, to save some bidding space.

[mgoetze]

Well, I am flattered. ;) Look forward to seeing what you come up with.

[Cthulhu D]

So is your 2♣ bid like a puppet to 2♦ (unless opener is strong), which responder pass when holding the raise hand?

 

In your original structure you could skip Reverse Flannery and play 2♥ as 4+ support and INV+, instead of 2♠, to save some bidding space.

 

Yeah, that's the plan. Sort of - A big question is how forcing is 1D-2C-2D - I think it can be one of the following 3:

 

1) Not Forcing

2) Semi Forcing (any 7-10 diamond raise that would reject an invite passes, anything else bids)

3) Forcing - absolutely forcing.

 

This effects your response structure considerably. Playing NF, my 'was bored in a meeting so sketched out response structure' was:

 

1D-2C (Big question - does this deny a 4 card major?)

 

 

2D: Waiting, 11-14ish minimum hand - a hand that is confident of not missing game opposite the 7-10 hand.

2H: 15+ Invite+ reverse. F1

2S: 15+ Invite+ Reverse. F1

2NT: ??? - I was thinking this should be the club canape hand (13)=4=5 but we don't need that so I'm foxed. significant extra values? Not sure

3C: 15+ diamonds + clubs

3D: Extra diamond length, invitational opposite the 7-10 hand

3HS: 18+ self splinters - GF opposite any hand. Trying to tell partner what stoppers are needed for 3NT? Not sure

3NT: ???

 

 

A couple of holes there obviously.That's not great, but the rebids are cramped as well, and some of them are under or overloaded. That gives a response structure of:

 

Then 1D-2C-2D:

 

 

Pass: 7-10 Diamonds. I don't like it because it's violating the law. We'd like to bid 3D. It's possible that we should bid 3D, then we can put more hand sthrough the 2D relay if the 2D relay is forcing.

2H: 4+ - I'd like this to be only an unbalanced hand (and thus imply 5 clubs), because that's analogus with what we play in an analogus auction (1M-2C (3 card limit raise, Bal GF, Club GF) 2D: Minimum relay, 2oM is then 4 major 5 clubs).

2S: 4+, same situation as 4H.

2NT: Balanced GF clearly. Can it contain a 4 card major? The problem is this is quite wide ranging - 13+

3C: Clubs, 6+ unbalanced, GF strength. I think after this 3M is showing a stopper for 3NT.

3D: Clubs with 2ndary diamond support.

3H: ?!?

3S: ??!!

3NT: To play - opener is tightly limited to responder should be able to place the contract.

 

 

I'm not sure what to do with 3H+ - I think 3M needs to be quite a specific hand, and no idea what 3NT is? DNE?

 

I thought about Semi forcing as well. This makes all the responses easier because it's GF opposite the minimum, but sometimes it's not very clear what is going on in the rebids

 

 

 

2D: Waiting, 11-16ish minimum hand - a hand that is confident of not missing game opposite the minimum hands from the 7-10 diamond raise.

2H: 16+ Traditional reverse GF

2S: 16+ Invite+ Reverse. GF

2NT: ??? - I was thinking this should be the club canape hand (13)=4=5 but we don't need that so I'm foxed. significant extra values? Not sure

3C: 16+ diamonds + clubs

3D: Extra diamond length, invitational opposite the 7-10 hand

3HS: 18+ self splinters - GF opposite any hand. Trying to tell partner what stoppers are needed for 3NT? Not sure

3NT: ???

 

[steve2005]

I play an unbalanced 1D opening (11-21) in the context of a 1C: Clubs or balanced, 5 card majors, 14-16 NT system. I'm thinking about my responses to 1D. We used to play SJS, but that doesn't make a great deal of sense. I've read Mgoetze's thread on the topic and I was thinking of the following structure makes much sense

 

1D - ??:

 

1H: 4+ Natural, Transfer Responses

1S: 4+ Natural, Transfer Responses

 

1NT: Hands that cannot make a sensible other response (tends to have some club length, relatively weak)

 

Then the responses I'm not sure about. I really liked Mgoetze's 2C response, but I'm not sure how to make continuations work

 

2C: Clubs GF, Bal GF or 7-10 (maybe this needs to be 7-9) diamonds.

 

NOT A BIG FAN OF THIS. 7-9 WITH DIAMONDS CAN BID 1N OR BIG DIST 2D. PREFER 2C INV+ CAN STOP IN 3C/D AND USE 3C PREEMPTIVE

 

 

2D: Weak with a major

 

THIS WHILE NICE PUSHES THE DIAMOND RAISE TO 2S WHICH WILL MAKE DIAMOND RAISE MORE DIFFICULT TO EXPLORE

 

 

2H: Reverse Flannery by Responder - is this really required with Xfer responses?

2S: Initvitational+ raise of diamonds

2NT: Balanced invite to 3NT with short diamonds and no 4 card major

3C: Invitational with 6 clubs

3D: Premeptive raise.

 

Thoughts?

COMMENTS IN CAP ABOVE

 

ALSO LIKE 3♥/3♠/4♣ AS GOOD GF SPLINTER RAISE

[Cthulhu D]

I am not sure you need more apace after 1D-2S. It depends if you want to play someyhing different than 1M--2NT. That structure fits, but is less useable because you are not going to be balanced or have a 5 card major.

 

1D-2S:

 

2N: Any minimum other bids imply extras. 3C asks for more info.

3C: a stiff (heavily implies you have some 5431 shape) 3D asks which

3D: 6+

3HS: 2nd suit

3NT: ??

4C: 5/5

 

 

While this is clearly sub optimal contextually, its got the advantage of being easy to remember.

 

That said I think Kungsteen is right - I should scrap reverse flannery and pull the balanced game forces out of 2C.

 

This greatly simplifies responders rebid:

 

So after the 1D opener:

 

 

1M: 4+

1NT: minimum balanced or clubs.

2C: GF clubs or diamond raise

2D: WJS in a major.

2H: GF Bal - may contain 4 spades but not 4 hearts.

2S: Inv+ diamonds

2NT: Balanced invite to 3NT.

3C: Invitation with 6Cs.

3D: Preemptive raise.

3M: Splinter

 

[Cthulhu D]

Eventually went with:

 

1D:

 

1M 4+

1N Various balanced or club hands

2C: GF with 5 clubs (may be balanced, may be 4 if and only if 3334 exactly with 16+ HCP), or a (6)7-9 ish diamond raise with 4.

2D: Weak 2 in a major

2H: Reverse Flannery

2S: Invitational+ in diamonds

2N: Balanced invite

3C: Invitational with 6 clubs

3D: Preemptive diamond raise

3M: Splinter

3N: 3334 exactly 13-15

4C: Splinter

4D: Minorwood

4M: Exclusion RKCB

 

Followups:

 

1D-2C

 

 

R	O	R	O	
2C				unbalanced diamond raise (4+) 6-9 (denies 4cM), or 5+C GF, or artificial w/ bal GF.  Can have 4cM
2D			Minimum hand (11-15(-))
	2H		4H, 5+ clubs
	2S		4S, 5+ clubs
	2N		2 diamonds, 5+ clubs
	3C		0-1D 6+ clubs
	3D		3 diamonds, 5+ clubs
		3H	Shortness
		3S	Shortness
		3N	Bad hand for slam
		4C	Control for slam
		4D	Minorwood
		4H	Slam try for clubs? 
		4S	Slam try for diamonds
	3H		Shortness with 5+ clubs and 3-4 diamonds
		3S	Shortness
		3N	Bad hand for slam
		4C	Control for slam
		4D	Minorwood
		4H	Slam try for clubs? 
		4S	Slam try for diamonds
	3S		Shortness with clubs and diamonds?
		3N	Bad hand for slam
		4C	Control for slam
		4D	Control for slam
		4H	Control - may be shortness
		4S	Control - may be shortness
2H			4+ Extras
2S			4+ Extras
2NT			Invitational plus opposite the diamond hand 16+ (or a sweet 15)
	3C		Unbalanced with clubs, denies diamond support
	3D		Minimum diamond hand
		3H	Shortness ask
	3M		Clubs+diamonds, short M, slamming
	3N		Maximum diamond hand
	4C		DNE ???
	4D		Ace asking for diamonds
	4H		Exclusion for diamonds
	4S		Exclusion for diamonds
3C			Natural clubs, 15-17
3D			6+, 15-17 HCP unbalanced
3M			Splinter - GF oppose the minimum