Competitive Slam decision

[phil_20686]

[hv=pc=n&w=sa76h7d75cakj9754&d=n&v=e&b=9&a=2h(weak)2s4h]133|200[/hv]

 

What do you bid?

[Cyberyeti]

What I'd actually bid is 4N blackwood (X is T/O for us) or 5♣ fit, but playing your system probably 5♥ although I'd like to know what 4N then 5♥ would be.

[phil_20686]

What I'd actually bid is 4N blackwood (X is T/O for us) or 5♣ fit, but playing your system probably 5♥ although I'd like to know what 4N then 5♥ would be.

 

Undiscussed? :)

[mikeh]

What I'd actually bid is 4N blackwood (X is T/O for us) or 5♣ fit, but playing your system probably 5♥ although I'd like to know what 4N then 5♥ would be.

what do you bid with xx x Axx AKJxxxx?

 

Or do you insist that you rarely get dealt Axx in an unbid suit, and are far more likely to hold Axx in partner's suit?

 

As for 4N blackwood...is it keycard?

 

It would be for me.

 

While 4N in competition is often 2 suits to play, in my regular partnerships we have the agreement that it is keycard when partner opened a major and the opps bid at the 4 level. Whether this is optimum is arguable, but it has the critical importance of being an easily remembered agreement.

 

I wouldn't expect to be able to bid 5♥ next, since partner is more apt to hold 2 than 3 keys, and if he has 3, then assuming 1430, 5♥ would be asking about the spade Q.

 

I wouldn't choose 4N and definitely not 5♥...it seems to me that 5♥ is the perfect post-mortem call, providing almost no specific information to partner beyond assurance of a fit and slam interest. It makes evaluation very difficult.

 

I think this is one of those rare hands where unilateral action may be best. I bid 6♣.

 

I don't like it. I don't choose it because I like it. I choose it because I dislike it the least of the various options available at this stage.

 

I'd far prefer a forward-going, highly invitational, 5♣ but I don't think that he'll expect this good a hand for that action, tho it is close and 5♣ would be my 2nd choice. I am assuming imps or total points, not mps, so I care only about level, not strain.

 

In a perfect world, the opps will take a phantom :P But we live in an imperfect world, so it is, I concede, more likely that we go down doubled than that we get to defend 6♥ doubled.

[whereagles]

4♠. Give pard some slack.

[mike777]

6c

 

the bidding may not be over yet.

[Cyberyeti]

what do you bid with xx x Axx AKJxxxx?

 

Or do you insist that you rarely get dealt Axx in an unbid suit, and are far more likely to hold Axx in partner's suit?

 

As for 4N blackwood...is it keycard?

 

It would be for me.

 

While 4N in competition is often 2 suits to play, in my regular partnerships we have the agreement that it is keycard when partner opened a major and the opps bid at the 4 level. Whether this is optimum is arguable, but it has the critical importance of being an easily remembered agreement.

 

I wouldn't expect to be able to bid 5♥ next, since partner is more apt to hold 2 than 3 keys, and if he has 3, then assuming 1430, 5♥ would be asking about the spade Q.

 

I wouldn't choose 4N and definitely not 5♥...it seems to me that 5♥ is the perfect post-mortem call, providing almost no specific information to partner beyond assurance of a fit and slam interest. It makes evaluation very difficult.

 

I think this is one of those rare hands where unilateral action may be best. I bid 6♣.

 

I don't like it. I don't choose it because I like it. I choose it because I dislike it the least of the various options available at this stage.

 

I'd far prefer a forward-going, highly invitational, 5♣ but I don't think that he'll expect this good a hand for that action, tho it is close and 5♣ would be my 2nd choice. I am assuming imps or total points, not mps, so I care only about level, not strain.

 

In a perfect world, the opps will take a phantom :P But we live in an imperfect world, so it is, I concede, more likely that we go down doubled than that we get to defend 6♥ doubled.

I have to double with your example hand although I don't like it much, and yes 4N is keycard (I play 0314 so 5♣-5♥ is in the frame, but I was talking about 4N then 5♥ in the OP's system where 4N is not Blackwood).

 

In the OP/poll 5♥ DOES provide some specific information, a heart control which is why I chose it.

 

Your comment about 5♣ being fit misses the point of the approach, what is more likely, that I have 5-7 clubs and 3-4 spades (and it won't be just 5-3) or 7-8 better clubs without spades ?

[billw55]

4♠. Give pard some slack.

I agree. Partner need not have a moose for his overcall, for me almost any 1♠ opener with decent suit texture will do.

[Cyberyeti]

I agree. Partner need not have a moose for his overcall, for me almost any 1♠ opener with decent suit texture will do.

 

Well TBF KQxxxx, xx, Ax, xxx is plenty for slam to be decent.

[PhilKing]

LOL - I am the only 5♣ bidder.

[whereagles]

i know the feeling B-)

[PhilKing]

i know the feeling B-)

 

I feel like Gszes. :ph34r:

 

Although he usually votes for "other".

[biggerclub]

At the table, I would probably bid 4♠. In a bidding contest I want to get to a VUL slam. But there are so many cards out and no way to know who has which of them. Why should P have all the A's and K's and not OPPs?

 

If I had a NON-CUE 5♦ bid . . . which may be more useful than CUE BIDS in this kind of situation . . . .

[biggerclub]

LOL - I am the only 5♣ bidder.

 

5♣ is very good if, as seems likely, the auction continues. Partner will draw the correct inference after 5♠.

[mikeh]

At the table, I would probably bid 4♠. In a bidding contest I want to get to a VUL slam. But there are so many cards out and no way to know who has which of them. Why should P have all the A's and K's and not OPPs?

 

If I had a NON-CUE 5♦ bid . . . which may be more useful than CUE BIDS in this kind of situation . . . .

your partner is red v white

[the hog]

6S. Pd should have a decent hand.

[Fluffy]

I would use blackwood if available, but since it is not, bid 5♥, partner should expect 2 keycards in our hand.

[lrussell]

6♣ is my call which will make more often than 6♠

[nige1]

[hv=pc=n&w=sa76h7d75cakj9754&d=n&v=e&b=9&a=2h(weak)2s4h]133|200|

 

IMO 5♥ = 10, 6♠ = 9, 4♠ = 8, 6♣ = 7, 5♣ = 6, 5N = 5, Double = 4,

given the OP systemic constraints; but prefer 4N = RKC and double = T/O.[/hv]

[the hog]

6♣ is my call which will make more often than 6♠

 

Explain why 6C makes more often than 6S please.You are known to have at least an 8 card S fit.

[Cyberyeti]

Explain why 6C makes more often than 6S please.You are known to have at least an 8 card S fit.

 

Not sure it makes more often, it goes less off when it fails, if you're forced to ruff a heart at trick 2, the club suit is dead if it doesn't run in a spade contract.

[Fluffy]

The only time when 6 clubs wins and 6 spades doesn't is when your only loser is ♣Q... the card you can normally ruff playing in spades. Also possible when dummy happens to have 4 red tricks and you can pitch your third spade. All of them are trully remote.

[whereagles]

Explain why 6C makes more often than 6S please.You are known to have at least an 8 card S fit.

 

I think black slams are probably equivalent in odds. It's not really a question of fit length but more this: if a heart force jeopardises dummy's clubs in 6♠, then 6♣ will require some club luck too.

[Cyberyeti]

I think black slams are probably equivalent in odds. It's not really a question of fit length but more this: if a heart force jeopardises dummy's clubs in 6♠, then 6♣ will require some club luck too.

 

Unless partner has stiff Q and a defender has 10xxx.

[dake50]

5C is very good if, as seems likely, the auction continues. Partner will draw the correct inference after 5S.

 

*** Yup, but is that "other" or "5c to play" in the choices?